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STUTTGART, Germany, 

Mar 26, 2011 — CNN's Wolf Blitzer interviewed General Carter F. Ham, commander, U.S. Africa Command, via the Defense Video and Imagery Distribution System March 25, 2011, on U.S. AFRICOM's future role as NATO takes authority of operations in Libya.

The following is a transcript of the interview.

WOLF BLITZER: And joining us now from Stuttgart, Germany, General Carter Ham. He's the commander of U.S. forces now serving over Libya. He's the commander of the U.S. military's U.S. Africa Command - only been in business for a couple weeks. You've got your hands full General Ham. Thanks very much for joining us.

GENERAL CARTER HAM: Well, thank you for having me Wolf.

MR. BLITZER: You're still in command of the U.S. mission over Libya, is that right?

GEN. HAM: That's correct.

MR. BLITZER: When does that change? When does NATO take over?

GEN. HAM: Well, NATO has already taken over one piece, which is the arms embargo that's principally maritime. We expect that NATO will take over the no-fly zone this weekend and then the next piece, the third and final piece, is the mission to protect civilians. It is my understanding NATO has agreed to that in principal and will this weekend decide on the procedures and the timing of accepting that mission. But, I think that will probably occur in the very near future.

MR. BLITZER: So when NATO takes overall command of everything, assuming that happens and that's still an assumption right now, what is your job and the job of the U.S. military's Africa Command?

GEN. HAM: Well, Libya is one of the 53 countries in Africa for which this command is responsible. So, we still have a decided interest in security matters in Libya, but once NATO assumes responsibility for those missions, then I would no longer have a direct command authority relationship with the forces engaged in NATO operations.

MR. BLITZER: Do you have a clear understanding, general, of what the mission is in Libya right now?

GEN. HAM: I do. It is threefold. It is to execute the arms embargo; it is execute a no-fly zone; and it is to protect civilians.

MR. BLITZER: Is it also to get rid of Kaddafi?

GEN. HAM: It is not. It is very specifically not that mission.
MR. BLITZER: Why not since the president has repeatedly said that the U.S. policy is that Kaddafi must go?

GEN. HAM: It is indeed U.S. policy that the current leader of Libya should no longer be that leader and that he has lost legitimacy. But it has also been a determination that we will not seek to achieve that policy end through military means.

MR. BLITZER: But you work for the president of the United States; he's the commander in chief. You report to the president and if he says Kaddafi must go, isn't it your responsibility to implement that policy?

GEN. HAM: It is the policy, but the president has also stated very clearly, to me and to others, that we will not seek to achieve that policy goal through military means.

MR. BLITZER: How will the U.S. achieve that policy goal?

GEN. HAM: Well I think by other ways, by economic sanctions, certainly by diplomatic effort; there are a number of ways that the international community can apply pressure on the current leader in Libya, but specifically to me, it is not a mission to cause regime change in Libya.

MR. BLITZER: Of no regime change as far as your mission is concerned, even though the president has repeatedly said Kaddafi must go, so it's still a little vague in my mind, how will you know success in Libya when it occurs?

GEN. HAM: Well I think we have achieved already a large degree of success. We do have an arms embargo. We do have a no-fly zone. And we have halted very serious assault by Libyan regime forces toward the city of Benghazi. I don't know how many people we saved in doing that, but I know we saved some. We have an ongoing effort to where we see regime forces attacking civilians that we take military action to prevent that to the degree that we can. And we have had some success. Have we had complete success? No. And it breaks my heart that that's the situation we're in. Because we find these regime forces taking cover inside built up areas where they know because of our concern for civilian casualties that we won't strike in there. So it's a tough, tough situation right now, but I think we have achieved a large measure of success.
A second part of the mission is indeed to transition this to NATO and we're prepared, we have transitioned one part of the mission, and I think in the coming days we'll transition the other parts of the mission and we'll do that seamlessly.

MR. BLITZER: Will NATO do what the U.S., the British, the French, the Canadians, have already been doing - going after Libyan ground forces, attack them from the air?

GEN. HAM: It is my understanding that NATO has agreed in principal to accept that mission and in the coming days they'll decide exactly how and when they want to execute that mission. It's important to remember that the United States is a NATO member. We participate in those discussions. And I'm confident that those discussions will indeed end with a satisfactory solution for NATO to accept this mission.

MR. BLITZER: But in the meantime, until NATO is fully onboard for that part of the mission, the U.S. and the others will continue to pound Libyan ground forces that may endanger civilians, is that right?

GEN. HAM: Until I am relieved of this mission, our mission, my mission, is to protect civilians. Now we will take actions that are consistent with our imperatives of being precise, being very discrete, being conscious of civilian casualties. But there should be no mistake, when we see regime forces attacking civilians, we will do everything we can to stop those attacks.

MR. BLITZER: Are you arming the rebels?

GEN. HAM: No.

MR. BLITZER: Why not?

GEN. HAM: First of all, I have no authority to do that. Again, our mission is not to support the opposition forces. Our opposition is to prevent civilian casualties. Now, there's a linkage there. Those who are causing civilian casualties are regime forces. So when we destroy or degrade the capability of regime forces, then certainly we are doing that and there is some benefit to the opposition, but we do not operate in direct support of the opposition forces.

MR. BLITZER: It makes it sound like the U.S. and its partners are neutral in the civil war that's going on in Libya, is that right?
GEN. HAM: Our mission is dictated by the UN Security Council Resolution. So the agreement of the Security Council has given us these three missions. And I think appropriately, at least to me the most important of those is to protect civilians, and that is where we're putting our effort - on that, not on supporting one party or the other.

MR. BLITZER: If these rebels, the opposition, and civilians for that matter, are being attacked by Libyan snipers, what do you do about that?

GEN. HAM: It's the toughest problem that we have. Again, we have some very precise weapon systems, not just U.S., but all the contributing nations. But we must necessarily be very conscious of causing further civilian casualties. So, when we see regime forces attacking civilians, we evaluate that very carefully and if we can interdict and if we can act against that threat without causing further harm to other civilians, then we will and we have acted with some great effect. But it is the most difficult target set we have when we see these regime forces in built up areas, both in armored vehicles and sniper positions as you sight. It is a tough, tough challenge for us.

MR. BLITZER: If you had actionable intelligence on the whereabouts of Kaddafi, would you go ahead and either kill him or arrest him?

GEN. HAM: I would not. I do not have that as a mission. I don't spend any time thinking about where he is. I don't expend any of my intelligence collection assets doing that. It's not part of my mission set.

MR. BLITZER: Do you have the capability to jam Libyan state television and radio broadcast?

GEN. HAM: Well, without getting into a lot of detail, we have pretty significant jamming capability and broadcast capability and we are using that.
MR. BLITZER: But they're still on the air.

GEN. HAM: Well, I'll say we have the capability and we're using it. That doesn't mean that we can or should necessarily mean that we can do that 24 hours, 7 days a week. But we do have a capability and we are employing it.

MR. BLITZER: Well one capability would simply to be to use airpower to knock out their towers. That hasn't been your mission, is that what you're saying?

GEN. HAM: No. I'm saying we look at assets that facilitate the regime's command and control and if we can target those and destroy those without causing civilian casualties then we will do that and we have done that. But we always, we always are very precise and always, always very conscious about civilian casualties.

MR. BLITZER: Because I raised the questions because some argue that those broadcasts endanger civilians in Libya right now, the way Kaddafi's state propaganda machine is using those broadcasts.

GEN. HAM: I think as an extension of the regime's command and control, I would assess those as legitimate targets and we have a variety of means to try to disrupt that.

MR. BLITZER: What kind of liaison officer or officers do you have with the opposition?

GEN. HAM: None.

MR. BLITZER: Why not?

GEN. HAM: Again, it's not our mission. Our mission to protect civilians and the president has been quite clear that there will not be U.S. military boots on the ground.

MR. BLITZER: No boots on the ground, but there are civilians - U.S. diplomats and others who are in liaison with the opposition.

GEN. HAM: There is contact. I'm not aware of anyone who is on the ground with them.
MR. BLITZER: Well, the president himself said that he was naming someone to be a liaison to the opposition. When I was in Paris the other day with the secretary of state, she met with one of the opposition leaders herself, so there is a dialogue, but what your saying is, not a military dialogue with the opposition?

GEN. HAM: That's correct.

MR. BLITZER: So what's next general? Give me your bottom line assessment right now. How long is this operation in Libya going to take before you can declare mission accomplished?

GEN. HAM: Well I think, again, we've accomplished quite a bit already. We will continue until such time as the mission transition. We will continue to do all we can to protect civilians. That means we attack those regime forces that threaten civilians. We attack his command and control systems that direct those forces and then we also attack his ability to sustain threats against civilians, whether that's ammunition or fuel, or transportation systems as well. And we will continue to execute the no-fly zone. So we'll continue in that way as we have and we are learning more every day. Our targeting is getting more precise and more effective. But at some point, and I expect this to be in the very near future, we will transition this mission of protect civilians to NATO. And we'll do it, though it is a very complex transition, we'll make that transition happen without any loss of momentum in the execution of the mission.

MR. BLITZER: Finally general, seeing your officers surrounding Kaddafi, do you see evidence they are defecting?

GEN. HAM: Well I think there is some indication that I would tell you frankly is mostly through the media reporting, that there is at least some wavering. I don't see how they could be in that position and at least not question their ability to continue to exert control. His command and control systems, his forces; certainly there is no air force left. All those systems that he used to repress the country have been significantly degraded. So I've got to believe that in the minds of some of those inner circle people, there are some questions that are arising as to whether or not this is in fact the best course of action for them.

MR. BLITZER: This is my last question general, and it's an opportunity for you. CNN is seen live around the world, including in Libya, and officers, your military-to-military, the officers surrounding Kaddafi might be watching right now. Kaddafi might be watching, his sons might be watching. Look into the camera. What would you say to them right now, officer to officer?

GEN. HAM: I would say, comply with the will of the international community as outlined in the United Nation Security Council Resolution 1973. Cease attacking civilians. Withdraw your arms and your troops from areas in which they are attacking civilians. Serve the people of Libya and not serve this illegitimate regime.

MR. BLITZER: General Ham thanks very much for joining us. Good luck to you and all the men and women you command.

GEN. HAM: Thank you very much Wolf.