You may have heard in the news about an elderly woman who is stating she was strip searched at New York's JFK airport by TSA officers. TSA contacted the passenger to apologize that she feels she had an unpleasant screening experience; however, TSA does not include strip searches in its protocols and a strip search did not occur in this case. We're currently gathering information and reviewing the screening of this passenger, but we wanted to share what we know so far.
A review of CCTV indicates the passenger opted out of advanced imaging technology and requested a pat-down. It is TSA’s policy that screening procedures are conducted in a manner that treats all passengers with dignity, respect and courtesy.
CCTV shows that the passenger arrived at the ticket counter at 12:19 p.m. for her 1 p.m. scheduled flight which left early at 12:50 p.m.
She entered the checkpoint line in a wheelchair, walker in hand.
The passenger opted out of advanced imaging technology screening, requested a pat-down and told the officers that she was wearing a back brace or support belt which required private screening.
Private screening was conducted by two female officers. The item was removed, rescreened, and the passenger was cleared for travel. Nothing unusual was depicted on the CCTV as the passenger and two female officers entered and exited the room. The wheelchair attendant assisted the passenger in departing the checkpoint area for the gate.
Terrorists remain focused on attacking transportation through tactics such as concealing explosives under clothing. Further, as evidenced by the Christmas Day 2009 attempted bombing, concealed anomalies under clothing must continue to be resolved and cleared as part of the screening process to ensure the item does not pose a threat to the safety of the traveling public. Terrorists and their targets may also range in age. Read here about a group of elderly men who were planning on using toxic ricin against U.S. citizens, U.S government and officials.
TSA Blog Team
If you’d like to comment on an unrelated topic you can do so in our Off Topic Comments post. You can also view our blog post archives or search our blog to find a related topic to comment in. If you have a travel related issue or question that needs an immediate answer, you can contact a Customer Support Manager at the airport you traveled, or will be traveling through by using Talk to TSA.
If you’d like to comment on an unrelated topic you can do so in our Off Topic Comments post. You can also view our blog post archives or search our blog to find a related topic to comment in. If you have a travel related issue or question that needs an immediate answer, you can contact a Customer Support Manager at the airport you traveled, or will be traveling through by using Talk to TSA.
187 comments:
Why on Earth should we trust you? We've caught you lying before. When your "investigation" is complete, I'm sure the fact that you have an interest in exonerating yourselves will be a major factor in the fact that you will exonerate yourselves.
Submit to an independent audit or shut up.
I am curious. Are you guys reviewing whether or not allocating resources for this really actually results in any of the primary goals of the TSA and it's mission?
Because most folks know that's not the case. And I think that's probably the real issue here. That you aren't actually doing your jobs.
The lady says she was strip search. That is good enough for me.
If TSA didn't have a history of being dishonest perhaps my opinion would be different.
TSA is reaping what it has sowed.
Has the TSA and it's leadership lied to the American people in the past? YES!
Has the TSA and it's leadership worked to keep important information from the American people and thereby intentionally mislead the American people? YES!
Is the TSA lying about what happened here? The TSA certainly has shown it's willingness to lie to us and mislead us in the past.
Would the TSA be willing to try to "Save Face" on this matter and intentionally attempt to mislead the American people once again? The answer is obvious.
I'm confused. If she had to tell officers she was wearing a brace, I assume she was wearing it under her clothes. So was the brace removed without removing her clothes? If articles of clothing were in fact removed in order to inspect the brace, at some point it becomes reasonable to characterize the affair as a strip search. It depends on the facts, which you do not provide.
So: What was removed, if anything, besides the brace? Thank you.
Since I can't append to my earlier posting.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/lenore-zimmerman-outraged-tsa-denies-strip-searched-85-year-old-long-island-grandmother-article-1.986437
TSA Covering Its Behind
Why was a medical appliance removed from a elderly disabled passenger? TSA needs to do a better job with people. It was not necessary to remove it to swab it!
"TSA does not include strip searches in its protocols and a strip search did not occur in this case. We're currently gathering information and reviewing the screening of this passenger, but we wanted to share what we know so far."
If you are so convinced that the woman's clothes were not removed, then why are you conducting an investigation?
Nice double-speak there, Bob.
[Screenshot captured.]
I find it odd that not one singe comment about this incident was positive or in any way supported the TSA. It appears that if they needed to screen her brace they would have to request that she remove the clothing that was over the device. That is not a strip search. Also she was probably in a panic because she came to the airport too late, considering all the devices she had to bring along with her and take through the security checkpoint. Until I see the facts, I am not going to fall into the trap of always siding against the TSA, who in my opinion have an impossible job to do. The average traveler has no idea what the TSA is finding in people's luggage, no matter what age they are. Terrorists can be any age.
The entire TSA is run completely in reverse. This agency is charged with protecting the citizens of this country from harm, yet it harms the very citizens it is charged with protecting. The only thing that makes the situation worse is the TSA's constant denial of ever having done anything wrong.
Were the TSA operated in the same manner that Israeli Security runs its airports, more people would take the TSA as a credible agency. Unlike the United States which wastes millions doing random checks on passengers in a vapid attempt to "keep things fair", Israel targets those who fit certain profiles. This falls under more than just ethnicity, it goes into behaviors and known patterns of potential terrorists.
That the TSA ignores this methodology demonstrates that they have absolutely no intention of protecting the citizens of the United States. The TSA is but another functionary used to breakdown and dispirit the citizenry as to make us more compliant.
Benjamin Franklin said it best when he faced off against the bully of his era in saying that, "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
Short of a complete overhaul and the implementation of a citizen oversight committee, here is little the TSA can do to redeem itself. It is a thuggish Federal agency amidst a crowd of thuggish Federal agencies and all of them are directed against We the People of the United States.
How does it feel to be part of an organization that is advocating the destruction of such a great Republic?
I can see the lady's point of view, but I also see TSA's point of view (and my point of view is I want to be safe on airplanes). While the 'odds' are against an elderly lady wearing a back brace being a terrorist, they are not zero odds. Remove elderly ladies with back braces from screening and voila there's your entre to breaking the system as a terrorist. All this angst is temporary though, technology WILL advance to having non-invasive screening for explosives that won't require you to stand still with arms up to be "scanned". People will forget about it, TSA will be able to catch the explosives, and folks 50 years from now will look back and laugh at our self-imposed angst. :)
Unless there are cameras in the private screening area, then it is the word of the TSOs vs. the word of the passenger. How can you so quickly conclude then that there was no removal of clothing?
Hopefully what happened will be decided in a court, and if the TSOs did indeed violate protocol, that they are punished to the fullest extent of the law, including termination and possible prison time for sexual assault.
[Screenshot captured.]
Sounds like the TSOs didn't take the time to work with this woman, instead treating her like an inanimate object. Maybe when your approach to security calls for treating everyone encountered as the enemy, you lose your humanity.
Having been on the receiving end of the way TSA treats "all passengers with respect and dignity" myself, my money is on Mrs. Zimmerman being the truthful party.
Give me a break..stripped searched...right! Well if all else fails...blame it on the TSA, afterall they are only trying to keep your flight safe. People are going to the airport in their bikinis...do you think this is for attention or maybe to prove how right they are?? I am in favor of the TSA doing what ever it is to keep me safe (other than molesting me) and keep terrorists off the plane!
According to all newspaper reports, she told the TSA that she didn't want to go through WBI due to her DEFIBRILLATOR.
She also said that she always tells the screeners that she has a defibrillator and always has a pat down.
Something is rotten, Bob, and I don't think it's Mrs. Zimmerman.
Bob ... your use of the passive voice creates problems yet again.
You write: The item was removed, rescreened, and the passenger was cleared for travel.
Who removed the item from the passenger? Who removed the items of clothing necessary to access that item? That's an important fact to understand whether this was a "strip search" or not ...
I cannot accurately convey the visceral disgust that this story engenders. It would seem, therefore, that I'm not as good with words as Blogger Bob, whose cavalier sophistry in the face of so many intolerable acts can only be described as remarkable.
And again and again, that's what gets me the most about these stories: how cavalier the attitudes of those at the helm. How contemptuously they dismiss legitimate concerns with the wave of a hand, citing vagaries of the system or failures of communication or technical inconsistencies. The real problem, they say, is that we, the taxpaying citizens of this country, are not astute enough or forgiving enough or patient enough or compliant enough. We're too stupid or too short-sighted to perceive the myriad swarthy foreigners lurking in the eaves -- and that this abuse, this sexual degradation, is all for our own good somehow.
What do you even call a country in which you must undergo a thorough body search before you can travel on a common carrier? By what system of ethics is it governed? And how do its arbiters and defenders regard themselves? By what conscience do they know themselves in the small hours of the night, they who would so casually give up their rights and so cavalierly humiliate and defile their fellow citizens?
If our seniors must be sexually humiliated as a precondition to travel, then the terrorists, for any definition of the word, have won.
There is always greyhound no one is forced to fly. Pray the person sitting next to you don't have C4 strapped in their back brace. You know what's real having towers fall before your very eyes. You will never hear the terrorist complaining about what method they should use to destroy people.
If the TSA doesn't perform strip searches, why do TSA employees have access to paper drapes to offer to passengers who are being directed to remove their clothing?
Funny how once again the CCTV is supposedly working when you think the facts are in your favor but 'unobtainable' otherwise.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/lenore-zimmerman-outraged-tsa-denies-strip-searched-85-year-old-long-island-grandmother-article-1.986437
Read the comments TSA. It is an easy thing to learn when an organization is systematically deceiving the public. I suppose when an organization routinely pornographically images and molests the passengers, it is an easy thing to lie about it too.
For her to have gotten to the counter at 12:19 PM for a 1:00 PM flight (which would be *10* minutes before boarding), suggest to me that grandma may be one of those elderly folks who expects the Red Sea to part at their mere approach. Having worked in the airline biz myself, first off - the airline should have rebooked her. Old folks don't travel without baggage, and she CLEARLY missed the checked baggage cutoff. That point's really moot, since she'd have still had to go through TSA. And I'm sorry, grandma - doesn't sound to me like you went through anything anybody else would have gone through. Maybe you shouldn't have opted out of the screening machine, maybe? Grandma opted out, and she got the alternative method - the pat-down. Really, folks - Where's the surprise in this story? People dont' get a "pass" for being old. Jeez - get over it.
When will you clowns realize that your obsession with groping people and rooting around under clothing has found nothing but private and harmless medical devices? You're what I worry about at the airport, not terrorists.
Google "tsa stops terrorist" and see what you find. Other people questioning the TSA... that is what. Your practices are ineffective and humiliating. Other countries have MUCH better techniques than this. The TSA needs to be removed and the US needs to replace it with something much more effective. You can randomly search people all day... no where near as effective as careful observation and asking the right questions. That is what they do in Israel and it is much more effective. So effective the US Military trains Soldiers in this technique. Ask me how I know.
There is definitely something fishy about it. The difference of versions is too big.
After reading kenorasis' comment, I'm also confused. How was the back brace removed without taking off any clothes?
Nadav
"John Reimer said...
I can see the lady's point of view, but I also see TSA's point of view (and my point of view is I want to be safe on airplanes). While the 'odds' are against an elderly lady wearing a back brace being a terrorist, they are not zero odds."
--------------------------------------------
Every day I walk past literally thousands of people. While the 'odds' are overwhelmingly against any given one of them being a terrorist, they are not zero odds. So, naturally, I make sure to request that every single person I pass by place their hands against a wall so I can perform a quick but thorough pat-down. Don't worry-- I am always respectful!
And please-- don't assume that my insistence on "zero odds" of any given person attacking me makes me a quivering coward in any sense whatsoever. I merely perform this procedure out of an abundance of caution.
[Screen shot taken]
"TSA does not include strip searches in its protocols"
Just because it is not part of the "protocol" doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
"she was wearing a back brace or support belt which required private screening.
Private screening was conducted by two female officers. The item was removed,"
It would be impossible for her to remove her back brace without removing her clothing.
The TSA told her, "take off your clothing, remove the back brace, or you can't fly today"
That is what happened.
My money is on Mrs. Zimmerman.
If TSA wants to find some terrorist all they have to do is find a mirror.
Bob, is Ruth Sherman a liar too?
Same airport, same terminal, same TSA employee group.
Time for an independent investigating where the real truth can be determined and corrective action taken.
We sure know that TSA will not police itself.
Another great, respectful day in the life of TSA. I can only hope some day in the very near future that TSA and it's army of rude, arrogant employees will go away or at least learn and display some respect and common courtesy for the flying public. But, then I have hopes for world peace and the elimination of hungar. Which do you think will occur first?
There is no reason to believe this woman is lying about how she was treated and there is no reason to believe TSA is not.
Btw, I'm glad to know it takes two officers to verify that an 85 year old woman is not a threat to an aircraft, resources well spent.
I always appreciate your posts, Bob, even if so many cynical commenters don't. I think many of these people don't care about the facts; they have already come to a conclusion about the TSA. They are simply in search of the evidence.
But as someone who travels for a living, I have to say that I always appreciate the professional, courteous way I am treated by TSA agents. Thanks for all you are doing to protect our country!
Wasn't the TSA spouting that travelers could expect "Less Intrusive" procedures before the Thanksgiving holiday? A story like this makes it clear that the TSA airport screening charade is intrusive regardless of the false assurances by TSA leadership.
I also recommend the TSA find another marketing message to describe the treatment of average Americans at airport checkpoints. I travel frequently and would not say the passengers are treated with "dignity and respect" by the TSA - in fact, I would say just the opposite.
The problem with the TSA is that their words do not match their actions - outside of Washington's bureaucratic culture that's good reason for lack of trust.
When I started reading this blog, I questioned whether extra security was worth the the invasion of privacy.
After reading the many comments and thinking about it, I've come to realize that the answer in no. The TSA is causing real harm to America. They are turning us against ourselves. The terrorists must love the TSA.
To add to the insult, the TSA isn't even providing any real improvement in security. The terrorists know they are there and will just choose other targets. You can't stop terrorists by waiting for them to come to you and surrender.
[[Read here about a group of elderly men who were planning on using toxic ricin against U.S. citizens, U.S government and officials.]]
... which is, naturally, completely inert in vials smaller that 3oz ...
rwilymz
http://dblyelloline.blogspot.com/
There is so much wrong about this story.
Let's assume that you Blogger Bob are being totally honest when you say that she had a back brace that had to be removed. How is that done without removing clothing? And why should TSA agents EVER be allowed to do anything with a person's medical device? What kind of training in back injury do they receive from the TSA?
The bottom line is the woman felt violated and I doubt she did not have a good reason for feeling that way.
I am amazed that the TSA can order a passenger to remove a medical device in order to fly.
John Reimer said...@ December 4, 2011 7:04 PM
I'll first refer to anonymous' comment at December 5, 2011 6:21 AM, and will add:
There's a non-zero chance that you could be killed today, or any other day, whether through your own or someone else's actions. The same is true for everyone, including me. Personally, I'm saddened to know that you and others are so scared to live your life that you feel that you need the government to violate someone else just so you "feel" safe to walk out your front door. I am truly saddened.
Anonymous said...@ December 4, 2011 9:19 PM
There is always greyhound no one is forced to fly.
Actually, TSA pesters people attempting to board greyhounds occasionally too. And in similar fashion, no one is forcing you to fly either.
Pray the person sitting next to you don't have C4 strapped in their back brace.
Your partially right, I would prefer that they didn't plan to use it while sitting next to me - just because they have it though, is no reason to be worried. On the other hand, if they did intend to use it, in many ways it's actually a preferred location - pretty much dead instantly.
You know what's real having towers fall before your very eyes.
Yes, it was real. The question may sound harsh, but, do you plan to live the rest of your life in fear? If so, then I am saddened for you. Personally, my fear from all of this is that we, as a country, have lost some basic freedoms and liberty (as a result) and may never get them back.
I personally see TSA playing the semantics game again. No, perhaps it wasn't a "strip search" where one is forced to remove all clothing and do the "squat and cough". However, the general public would consider the required removal of outer clothing, whether fully or partially, that exposes the under clothing, or worse, the removal of under clothing, whether fully or partially, exposing the unclothed body to be a "strip search".
Enough for now...
signed -- a saddened American.
ttp://newyork.cbslocal.com/2011/12/04/another-elderly-woman-says-she-was-exposed-at-kennedy-airport/
Which seems more likely
1. TSOs behaving inappropriately when conducting a private screening where they know there is no video.
2. Rogue senior citizens conspiring to create lies against innocent and dutiful TSOs.
Bob,
You should just forget about trying to ply us with your lies. Nobody believes anything you or any representative at the TSA states anymore. Too many lies that you've been caught in telling.
Rather than trade your own dignity and integrity for a paycheck, find an honorable job where you don't have to lie through your teeth daily.
WHY did TSA make her remove her back brace? It says right on TSA's own website that medical devices don't need to be removed! Why did they remove and screen this one?
A few months ago I flew out of OKC wearing a post-surgical back brace. My doctor told me not to remove it for any reason. Yet the TSA demanded that I remove it to be screened. I refused, and was treated to one of the most brutal experiences of my life - a screening that involved pressing so hard on the brace over my recent surgical incision that I cried out in pain.
TSA says they didn't strip-search her...but they openly acknowledge that they defied their OWN policy by making an 85-yr-old woman remove a medical device.
What do you have to say about that, Bob? You posted it! Explain how the TSA can say that this passenger was treated with dignity, when you openly admit that they defied their own policy!
How was the back brace removed without stripping the elderly woman?
Why do you stress the time of arrival of this woman? Should she expect to take more than 20 min at security? Are people who arrive late more likely to have their clothes removed?
Why do you stress (twice) that she opted out of the whole body scan? Does this mean she is presumed guilty? Wouldn´t the back brace have triggered the need for a secondary anyways? Shouldn´t opting out thus speed the process up? And how does a woman that uses a walker go though a whole body scan anyway?
And what about the second granny who says she was strip-searched too?
Do you really want us to believe there are multiple octagenarians inventing these stories?
I generally take much of the complain with a grain of salt, but this is outrageous: you state categorically that a strip search did not take place on the basis of ZERO probative evidence other than the word of the screeners.
In other words, you accept the honesty of the screeners as a given and conclude therefore that the passenger must be dishonest when there is a conflict. Yet we know -WE KNOW- that TSA agents, hired by that same process as those involved here, and subject to the same training as those involved here, and subject to the same level of supervision involved here have NOT always proven to be honest.
There is no rational reason to presume the honesty of the screeners other than to avoid scrutiny.
Anonymous said...
Why was a medical appliance removed from a elderly disabled passenger? TSA needs to do a better job with people. It was not necessary to remove it to swab it!
I'm not a senior, and I have the SAME thing. My brace taken and swabbed, along with my leg. And I received burns from the swab that was done on my skin, but my complaints were NEVER addressed.
It is IMPOSSIBLE to hide anything in my brace. As it is elastic, for the most part, anything, even a little wad of paper will be noticible to the naked eye as a bulge in the brace. There was NO reason to single me out, put me in a glass room infront of EVERYONE going through security and being stared at by everyone who passed by, and treat me the way I was treated. It takes a lot to bring me to tears, but THAT did it! The most humiliating experience of my life!
Now, I remove my brace before I go in. Not as easy as it sounds, as I have a VERY hard time getting around without it, and the problem escallates when I am forced to remove my shoes.
Funny....when it is in the side pocket of my backpack (where it can be seen), nothing happens. They don't give it a second look. But if I'm wearing it......an entirely different story. What the hell is the difference? Actually, while I COULD NOT put anything in it when it is on, there could very well be something wrapped in it when off. If it can be screened and pass through while in my bag, why can't the same be when on my leg?
Seems just like the new show rules. Again I ask. How are some kids' shoes so much safer than mine, they they do not need to remove them.
I fly only when I have to,once a year. and lately even that is seeming to be once a year too much.
And for those who say TSA is only trying to keep us safe... Keep convincing yourselves. If you're that terrified about flying that you're willing to put up with this crap, maybe YOU are the ones who need to find alternate transportation. After all, you are the ones living in a world of fear, not the rest of us.
Please provide TSA's definition of "strip search." I suspect you are obfuscating by using a definition that requires *all* clothes to be removed, so that if someone has to remove their underwear but gets to keep their shirt, they were not "strip searched," according to TSA. It sounds a lot like you went to the Bill Clinton School of Denial. ("I did not have ... with that woman ...")
Answer some simple questions. Was the woman required to remove her medical device as a condition of proceeding to the gate? Was the woman required to remove her pants as a condition of proceeding to the gate? Was the woman required to remove her undergarmets (underpants) as a condition of proceeding to the gate? Note that saying she was given an "option" that involved not traveling is not an answer to these questions.
Then please answer the same questions with regard to the claims by 88-year-old Ruth Sherman about another strip search at JFK.
"The TSA does not use strip searches"
Yeah right, another stinking lie from the TSA.
Do you really think we can't even remember this episode from a couple of months ago where a woman was taken off of a plane and strip searched in Chicago?
http://www.naturalnews.com/033589_airport_security_strip_searched.html
I will never forget 09-11-01. NEVER !
You sir, as well as the TSA ARE DISGUSTING
Now that ANOTHER 88 has come forward with
Similar story... Stuff it
So, you say she was not strip searched, but then you say she was made to remove a medical brace that she had to remove clothes to get to. It doesn't matter who does the removing, that woman was stripped of her clothing under the authority of the government under no reasonable suspicion of wrongdoing.
Please, TSA. Keep strip searching the grandmas and giving the toddlers enhanced pat-downs. It won't take much more of that for the country to be rid of you completely.
We are referred to an alleged scheme by a group of old men to attack something or other, with some substance or other, as justification for THIS incident involving an elderly woman.
Well, we know of verified incidents involving subsetances inserted in the rectums of individuals on airplanes. So why doesn't TSA begin an IMMEDIATE policy of full cavity searches of everyone going through checkpoints--women, children, the elderly, the handicapped. I will feel VERY unsafe on airplanes until this policy is put into action.
Isn't it interesting how the ADA just disappears in the bowels of the TSA. Remember all the hype and turmoil surrounding the Americans with Disabilities Act?
Then the TSA comes into existence and it means nothing. The handicapped, the impaired, are literally TARGETED by TSA for onerous handling--stripping, groping, searching, removal of devices. Didn't you just LOVE the story of the TSA agent who broke open someone's ostomy bag?! What a horror story! Right in our airports, every day.
THIS is the huge nightmare that we can lay at George Bush's doorstep--Bush was President when the TSA & our newest cabinet-level Department, so-called Homeland Security, were created. What a nightmare, Bush's homage to Islamic terror, a gift that keeps on giving EVERY hour of EVERY day.
TSA is now so institutionalized that is is now unionized--like the Teamsters. Entrenched doesn't begin to cover it.
TSA contacted the passenger to apologize that she feels she had an unpleasant screening experience
Worst. Apology. Ever.
TSA does not include strip searches in its protocols
I assume that theft of passengers' belongings is not in the protocol, either. Does that mean it has never happened?
Care to comment on the stories from the other two women who say this happened to them?
Anonymous said...
"Yes, it was real. The question may sound harsh, but, do you plan to live the rest of your life in fear? If so, then I am saddened for you. Personally, my fear from all of this is that we, as a country, have lost some basic freedoms and liberty (as a result) and may never get them back."
The 9/11 attacks were incredibly successful. I'm not talking about the direct destruction, I'm referring to creating an atmosphere of fear which is the real goal of a terrorist.
We have become a nation of paranoid people who distrust everyone. People are willing to have their fellow citizens abused and mistreated just to make themselves feel a little safer.
The terrorists won and we helped.
Recent polls have shown that the TSA has surpassed the IRS as the single most reviled and hated US Government Agency.
Things like this make me wonder how anyone would/could be surprised by or actually defend the actions of the TSA.
GOOD JOB TSA!
You LIE!
http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2011/12/05/another-elderly-woman-says-she-was-exposed-at-kennedy-airport/
Has any American citizen ever left a positive comment about TSA? I didn't think so.
Why does TSA refer to their security guards as "officers"? They are not law enforcement officers and have no arrest powers.
Has any American citizen ever posted a positive comment about TSA? I didn't think so.
she was wearing a back brace or support belt which required private screening.
Private screening was conducted by two female officers. The item was removed
From the TSA website
Security Officers will not ask nor require you to remove your prosthetic device, cast, or support brace.
and
Security Officers should not be asking you to remove your orthopedic shoes, appliances, or medical device (insulin pump, feeding tube, ostomy or urine bag, or exterior component of cochlear implant) at any time during the screening process.
So why was this passenger required to remove her back brace?
from the new york daily news story: "TSA spokeswoman Lisa Farbstein said a review of closed circuit TV footage from the airport shows “proper procedures were followed.”"
would you comment on that? what closed circuit TV footage did she use to make that statement about the private search?
"TSA does not include strip searches in its protocols and a strip search did not occur in this case."
...
"she was wearing a back brace or support belt... The item was removed, rescreened, and the passenger was cleared"
So, you admit the "back brace or support belt", which was an article of clothing she was wearing, was "removed" from her and searched.
Hmm... what's another name for "removing" an article of clothing from someone and searching it and them? 'Sip tearch'? 'Stip surch'? Oh, I have it- 'STRIP SEARCH'!
“They took me into a private screening room and pulled my pants down and then pulled down my underwear,” the 4-feet-11 Zimmerman said. “If that’s not strip-searching, I don’t know what else you’d call it.”
Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/lenore-zimmerman-outraged-tsa-denies-strip-searched-85-year-old-long-island-grandmother-article-1.986437#ixzz1fi3AmDol
Hey Bob- what else would you call it???
Anonymous said...
It appears that if they needed to screen her brace they would have to request that she remove the clothing that was over the device. That is not a strip search.
On the contrary- it's the very definition of a Strip Search: "strip search - searching someone for concealed weapons or illegal drugs by having them remove their clothes"
Are you next going to tell us that War is Peace, Freedom is Slavery, and that the chocolate ration has gone up??
You say "she was wearing a back brace" and that "the item [back brace] was removed".
But according to the "Assistive Devices and Mobility Aids" page at http://www.tsa.gov/travelers/airtravel/specialneeds/editorial_1370.shtm, "Security Officers will not ask nor require you to remove your prosthetic device, cast, or support brace."
Bob, Americans need a truthful answer: Did Security Officers ask or require this elderly woman to remove her support brace?
If yes, why did this DIRECT violation of policy take place?
Of course that a "strip search" is not part of the TSA procedures. It's called "resolving an alarm" and if that involves taking the clothes off an 85 year old woman, then so be it!
Disgusting.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/09/14/national/main20105942.shtml
The above is a link to a story from a couple of months ago where a woman was strip searched after being removed from an airplane.
Another day, another LIE from the TSA
Seems the count is up to three ladies Strip Search by TSA at this same airport.
Think it may be time to change your story Bob?
This is why I now insist that my pat-down be done in full view of other passengers. I don't trust any of the TSO's to behave appropriately behind closed doors; most of them are insecure bullies on power trips, and the female "officers'" attitudes are even worse than the males. I have had several pat-downs that were far more intimate than what Blogger Bob and the TSA website describe, but if you dare to ask for a complaint card, they threaten to detain you until you miss your flight. I've had mammograms that didn't squeeze as hard as some of your TSO's!
The TSA is worthless, a waste of tax dollars, and staffed by people who are at best indifferent to the idea of respecting the public, and at worst are rude, intimidating and sadistic.
I am completely humiliated by the TSA pat down, but as a cancer patient, I should not take any radiation.
DHS has testified in Federal Court that they have the authority to Strip Search travelers.
Why should we believe that isn't what is happening and what happened in this case plus the two new cases that have been reported?
What part of a limited Administrative Search does Strip Searching fall under?
DHS: We Have the Authority to Routinely Strip-Search Air Travelers
DHS: We Have the Authority to Routinely Strip-Search Air Travelers: The Department of Homeland Security told a federal court that the agency believes it has the legal authority to strip search every air traveler. The agency made the claim at oral argument in EPIC's lawsuit to suspend the airport body scanner program. The agency also stated that it believed a mandatory strip search rule could be instituted without any public comment or rulemaking. EPIC President Marc Rotenberg urged the Washington, DC appeals court to suspend the body scanner program, noting that the devices are "uniquely intrusive" and ineffective. EPIC's opening brief in the case states that the Department of Homeland Security "has initiated the most sweeping, the most invasive, and the most unaccountable suspicionless search of American travelers in history," and that such a change in policy demands that the TSA conduct a notice-and-comment rule making process. The case is EPIC v. DHS, No. 10-1157. For more information, see EPIC: EPIC v. DHS and EPIC: Whole Body Imaging Technology. (Mar. 10, 2011
"TSA does not include strip searches in its protocols"
This is simply semantics. In this case, perception is reality and frankly I am more inclined to believe the woman's story than that of the TSA, which has been caught multiple times spinning legitimate passenger complaints. TSA may not refer to it as a "strip search"...but then again, the TSA does not acknowledge manual patdowns as groping, which it very much is.
Was the passenger required to remove her clothes as part of the screening?
You may not define that as a strip search but many other people would.
You're trying to make this woman out to be a liar by parsing her words and relying on narrow definitions of terms.
The fact is that she went through an experience that left her feeling humiliated and the main reason why this happened is because she has a medical condition.
Rather than trying to blame the victim, why not just say that it was unfortunate that she had to remove her clothes and that she had the option of using the scanner?
Why do you have to continually defend the TSA by trying to make its victims look like liars?
I'm not even going to touch on whether or not the searching is necessary.
9 Examples Of Elderly Americans Being Strip-Searched Or Sexually Molested By TSA Agents At U.S. Airports
http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/9-examples-of-elderly-americans-being-strip-searched-or-sexually-molested-by-tsa-agents-at-u-s-airports
"I will never forget 09-11-01. NEVER !"
Me neither! I remember 9/11 by cherishing my liberty and refusing to live in fear. Clearly, you've chosen to do the opposite. Pathetic.
Bob,
Several comments have pointed out that the TSA website states braces do not need to be removed.
Please show some respect to the traveling public and explain why this woman had to remove her back brace, in contradiction to TSA policy.
So we at TSA can't really win with you guys can we? If we allowed that woman to continue without checking the brace, we could have had (potentially) another "Underwear Bomber" and been persecuted for allowing this person on a plane.
If we clear the brace PROPERLY, we are persecuted for invasion of privacy. Instead of attacking us, who are trying to do the best job we can, can you offer any suggestions for improvement? We're not going away. Solutions instead of sarcasm and vile accusations would be more helpful to me.
"Instead of attacking us, who are trying to do the best job we can, can you offer any suggestions for improvement?"
We've offered suggestions hundreds of times, but you lot refuse to listen.
End the show carnival that no other nation requires.
End the farcical liquids nonsense that has no scientific basis.
End the pointless BDO voodoo that has been conclusively shown to be worthless.
End the use of strip-search scanners that don't work, don't find anything dangerous, cause cancer, and make no one safer.
Oh, and STOP STRIP-SEARCHING ELDERLY PEOPLE. Or anyone else, while you're at it.
To Proud TSO: You're absolutely right. TSA is here to stay, and TSOs will continue providing a service to the nation.
It would be great to hear from more travelers thanking TSOs for the great job they do. At least, these Americans understand the need for the government to provide for a safe and secure flight. Something that the private airport security on 9/11 could not do.
So I ask all the anti-TSA firebrands: How many terrorists did the private airport security capture on 9/11?
I think it would clear up a great deal of confusion if TSA would provide the TSA definition of a Strip Search.
http://www.local10.com/news/Elderly-complain-about-pants-search-at-airport/-/1717324/4881644/-/ov0t3e/-/index.html
TSA Strip Searching America One Person At a Time
"3 elderly women say TSA agents made them pull down pants, underwear
TSA says agents followed protocol
Published On: Dec 05 2011 09:43:07 PM EST Updated On: Dec 06 2011 09:47:49 AM EST"
Proud TSO said...
So we at TSA can't really win with you guys can we? If we allowed that woman to continue without checking the brace, we could have had (potentially) another "Underwear Bomber" and been persecuted for allowing this person on a plane.
If we clear the brace PROPERLY, we are persecuted for invasion of privacy. Instead of attacking us, who are trying to do the best job we can, can you offer any suggestions for improvement? We're not going away. Solutions instead of sarcasm and vile accusations would be more helpful to me.
December 6, 2011 9:42 AM
.................
According to the limited information available to the public from TSA the back brace should not have been removed.
Please explain why it was removed and why shouldn't the TSA employees who caused the removal of the appliance not be fired for not complying with TSA policy.
No TSA can't win when TSA exceeds a limited Administrative Search which should be conducted in public and instead terrorizes the public in secret.
Knock off the BS and stop abusing the public; then TSA might start rebuilding some public trust.
TSA has clearly earned the despicable reputation it now has and I see nothing happening to change the public's total disgust of all things TSA.
So many "Anonymous" folks commenting here, or maybe it's just the work of one lonely individual who thinks his/her anti-TSA mission is going to drive hundreds of millions of air travelers from avoiding the airplanes.
Every day, millions of people choose to fly. Millions go through security checkpoints without a problem. That makes passengers happy, and it makes TSOs very happy.
It is a small minority of passengers who alarm, and all alarms must be resolved in a courteous, respectable and professional manner.
That is why there has been no traction in the anti-TSA firebrand movement. Far too many passengers don't require additional screening.
Look, with a clear mind, go spend time, say an 8-hour shift at an airport to observe TSOs in operation. TSOs are the first line of defense in the war on terrorism on the domestic front to protect air travelers daily.
That is why the public supports TSA mission. Nobody wants a repeat of September 11, 2001.
Let's not forget this part of the story...
CCTV shows that the passenger arrived at the ticket counter at 12:19 p.m. for her 1 p.m. scheduled flight which left early at 12:50 p.m. "The proof is in the pudding!"
Let’s try (if you will) to determine the EXACT meaning of "strip search" Now I’m certainly no genius (after all I read most of the insane comments on here) but searching somebody means the TSA officer is doing their job. When you add the word "strip" into the phrase you have a whole new meaning of something we just don’t do. Ever. It just doesn’t happen. What does happen is people regularly remove their own clothing out of frustration or confusion. Trust me, we quickly tell them to put their clothes back on! People seem to believe everything the media puts out there, but just like me, you were not in the room so anything you say at this point is just an assumption, not a fact.
So the TSA website states that travelers will not be asked to remove braces.
So why was this traveler?
This is a perfect example of why people distrust the TSA.
Proud TSO said...
If we clear the brace PROPERLY, we are persecuted for invasion of privacy. Instead of attacking us, who are trying to do the best job we can, can you offer any suggestions for improvement? We're not going away. Solutions instead of sarcasm and vile accusations would be more helpful to me
------------------
Many people have offered suggestions, though personally I think for TSA to "go away" is in fact the best one. Commercial passenger aviation in the USA survived for over 80 years without TSA and in the process became one of if not the safest means of public transport, even when considering terrorism fatalities, again without TSA.
But as for specifics to this case (well, actually the three reported older-woman strip search cases we're up to now): were the women screened with ETD? If they passed ETD swabs done on their hands, clothes, or the exterior of the devices, and pat downs did not reveal any substantive weapons (i.e., guns, very large knives), that should have been enough. Why do you need to search under or around a medical device that does not alarm the ETD? What possible credibly-threatening weapon, explosive, or incendiary could be hidden there? The answer, of course, is that you are searching for completely irrelevant items like drugs or cash that could be concealed under a medical device.
In the absence of specific, individualized suspicion, these sorts of invasive searches are completely unacceptable. Even most law enforcement types, who are hardly liberty advocates, recognize that. I virtually guarantee that there was no specific individualized suspicion that any of these women were a threat to aviation or anything else. But TSA thinks that a person purchasing an airline ticket gives them carte blance to perform whatever invasive "screening" they desire.
Bob,
The TSA really needs to explain why this passenger was required to remove her back brace when the TSA's website says that it shouldn't have happened.
Your people need EXTENSIVE sensitivity training. I am a rape survivor, and I have a defibrillator. In November, I traveled to Dallas. In the Richmond VA airport, my defibrillator was seen on the new scanner, and when I moved slightly a trigger went off at the apex of my legs. IN FRONT OF EVERYONE in the scanning area, a female TSA officer ran her hand down over my front. I was too STUNNED to object.
THEN in Dallas I was told by the TSA that their scanner was magnetic, which I could not go through because of my defibrillator. I told the TSA agent that I was a survivor of rape and that I could not have a pat down in public. The pat down in private was FAR WORSE than my experience in Richmond. The pat down was far more detailed, and I stood there shaking and ready to cry. NOT ONCE did the officer apologize for having to follow protocol or reassure me that it would be okay. SENSITIVITY TRAINING should be mandatory.
You CANNOT and must not conduct searches as if every passenger you search is a criminal. We are innocent until proven guilty, or at least that's my recollection of any jurisprudence.
As an Army veteran, I served honorably to preserve our freedoms. The TSA has gone above and beyond its efforts to take away that freedom. In the future, I'll be traveling by train and car unless circumstances FORCE me to fly.
There is no logic in the TSA procedures in place when other security measures continue to be overlooked, e.g., silverware still being used in first class, etc.
Can you offer any suggestions for improvement? We're not going away. Solutions instead of sarcasm and vile accusations would be more helpful to me.
We've offered suggestions for years now. We've been largely ignored at best, and ridiculed at worst.
anything can be made into a weapon. during the vietnam war, "terrorists" filled the hollow tubing of bicycles with C4 and then drove right up to their target...whatever their cause and whatever your views on that war, they were still terrorists...the problem with the tsa is its apparent inability to distinguish between likely suspects and otherwise...but until someone comes up with a solution to that problem, what choice is there? unless, of course you are still wearing your tinfoil hat and believe the lunatic rantings of the conspiracy crowd...again: WHAT CHOICE IS THERE? and if the woman made this up and is not demented, isn't she guilty of something? come on people...who would ride an airplane unchecked? please put up your hand so i can sell you some ocean front property in arizona.
"Proud TSO said....
So we at TSA can't really win with you guys can we? If we allowed that woman to continue without checking the brace, we could have had (potentially) another "Underwear Bomber" and been persecuted for allowing this person on a plane.
If we clear the brace PROPERLY, we are persecuted for invasion of privacy. Instead of attacking us, who are trying to do the best job we can, can you offer any suggestions for improvement? We're not going away. Solutions instead of sarcasm and vile accusations would be more helpful to me."
You want a suggestion. Follow your own guidelines as well as the Constitution for starters. This would go a long way towards solving your problem, but then people have been saying this all along and no one listens.
Also, until you treat the flying public as people instead of criminals you will have this response. Get used to it.
From an American Citizen who hates the TSA worse than the IRS.
To Anonymous Proud TSO said...
The TSOs in question did NOT follow TSA policy. They made her remove the back brace. And exactly how did she do that without removing clothing?
I'm sure they said something like, "You don't have to do this if you don't want to, but if you don't you're not flying today".
From the TSA website
Security Officers will not ask nor require you to remove your prosthetic device, cast, or support brace.
and
Security Officers should not be asking you to remove your orthopedic shoes, appliances, or medical device (insulin pump, feeding tube, ostomy or urine bag, or exterior component of cochlear implant) at any time during the screening process.
Hey Proud TSA.
I would gladly live with the minescule chance of another underware bomer to prevent the stripsearching of innocent citizens.
You want to win your opponents over, then explain why she was required to remove a medical device in order to board an airplane. This is in direct opposition to what is posted on the TSA website.
The TSA routinely hides behind secret documents and flat out accuses people who complain of being liars.
Your statement "We're not going away." makes your viewpoint very clear. You are not going away so the rest of the population better get used to being abused by federal employees.
How many lives did the TSA save in the last ten years? No answer means Zero.
Not Scared of Terrorists.
Proud TSO said...
......
Instead of attacking us, who are trying to do the best job we can, can you offer any suggestions for improvement? We're not going away. Solutions instead of sarcasm and vile accusations would be more helpful to me.
December 6, 2011 9:42 AM
You have stated in your comment that the best solution is not an acceptable answer - "We're not going away." Until you can recognize that TSA is (at least part of) the problem, I doubt there is any point to having the conversation you allude to wanting to have. In spite of that...
Solution:
Put the screening back into the airlines responsibilities. This will allow a realistic risk assessment to be made. The airline will weigh security measures against their liability while obtaining direct market feedback from their customers. If the customers feel the measures are too invasive, they will choose a less invasive airline. If, on the other hand, the customer feels that they are not doing enough, then the customer would choose an airline they feel offers more security screening. (etc.)
The airline will end up providing the level of security they have deemed that their customers will accept (from both directions) as well as the risk the company is willing to accept. I can assure you, from a purely business standpoint, that airlines do not want to lose a plane. The costs associated with planes and defending against the potential civil suits are expensive. This is also one of the reasons you do not hear the airlines complaining - they have (virtually) zero liability right now. If anything happens - they point fingers at TSA. (From worst case scenarios all the way down to petty theft.)
I can go into further detail why this is ultimately the best solution, but I'll stop here for now. If you are willing to have a conversation where potential solutions can include TSA going away, let me know.
(Can I foresee solutions which involve TSA? Yes - but, to be practical, the diminished role of the governmental agency would likely not be acceptable to you either. One of the issues with governmental agencies is that they tend to either be quite a bit under or dreadfully over what is reasonable or necessary.)
[[we at TSA can't really win with you guys can we?]]
Sure you can! But it would require that you actually pay attention to what you're being told and acknowledge that it is the legitimate concerns of the population that you claim to "serve". That hasn't happened yet.
[[we could have had (potentially) another "Underwear Bomber"]]
This is the first thing: raging paranoia. Drop it. If you are going to sit there all pious and aggreived and claim that every 85 year old granny in a wheel chair is indifferentiable from a foreign national traveling with no luggage and no winter coat in the middle of winter showing hinky recent travel on his Visa, then you're obviously ill-equipped to do the job you purport to do. Sorry. It doesn't get much more obvious than that.
[[Instead of attacking us, who are trying to do the best job we can]]
Yeah, yeah ... poor you!
If the job you do is so critical, then do it the right way. If you can't [or won't] do it the right way, then it tells quite a number of us that your job doesn't need doing. That is, in fact, the premise behind the Constitutional Democratic Republic we live under, and which you work for ... on my dime.
Civil rights are more important than governmental convenience according to our national charter. We simply don't care what makes your life or job easier; in THIS country, that's not supposed to be relevant. In THIS country it is OUR ease that is important.
[[can you offer any suggestions for improvement?]]
Been done countless times. Why do you not pay attention?
If you suspect that someone constitutes a significant security threat to the aircraft, passengers or facilities, then GET A WARRANT. Then you can search to your heart's content. If you don't, then leave people alone. That is among the rights free citizens of THIS free country have: to be left alone by their government unless the government does the legwork to support pestering them.
What you do and how you do it, however, violates every precept of civil rights from the theoretic Rights of Man to the tangible Bill of Rights. That's not even rationally debateable. The only thing that can be done with it is attempt to justify, rationalize and excuse it by claiming - boo hoo - that people are scared. And that's pretty much all that this blog is used for: excuse-making [and criticism of it].
[[We're not going away.]]
A fellow can dream, can't he?
[[Solutions instead of sarcasm and vile accusations would be more helpful ]]
I've given this advice before: if you don't like the "vile accusations", then don't do those things that make vile accusations appropriate and accurate. Seriously, it's not difficult.
I've also given the advice - to you, the people who do it, and to my elected officials, who created you in the first place - on how to make it right. At least [some of my] my elected officials give lip-service in response. TSA simply ignores what it doesn't like to hear.
...which is another thing you can fix. Learn to say, "Yes, you're right ... we should be doing it the way to describe..."
Go ahead; practice that now.
rwilymz
http://dblyelloline.blogspot.com/
Proud TSO said...
"So we at TSA can't really win with you guys can we? If we allowed that woman to continue without checking the brace, we could have had (potentially) another "Underwear Bomber" and been persecuted for allowing this person on a plane.
If we clear the brace PROPERLY, we are persecuted for invasion of privacy. Instead of attacking us, who are trying to do the best job we can, can you offer any suggestions for improvement? We're not going away. Solutions instead of sarcasm and vile accusations would be more helpful to me."
Dear Proud TSO, we understand that you are proud of yourself for forcing people to subject themselves to humiliating, degrading, invasive and profoundly unethical and abusive violations of our rights as citzens. Please understand our point: We see you as a plague on our freedom, a menace to our families, willing accomplices in the erosion of our rights and petty tyrants. We KNOW that the danger from terrorists is far, far less than the danger that we face from an Authoritarian Government intent on destroying our liberties. You are not our friend, you are not our ally, you should be ashamed of what you do and how you do it. Someday Napolitano and Pistole will be out of their overpaid government jobs and will join the likes of Michael Chertoff as they become leeches on the American people as they collect their filthy lucre as lobbyists.
To "Proud TSO" --
I disagree. You've got to go away, and the sooner, the absolute better for the country, for the citizens, and for me.
I'm more determined than ever to work tirelessly to end this TSA/DHS reign of terror.
I grew up in a time when Americans were brave, and the country was a beacon of liberty and opportunity for the whole world. It's become a much sadder, much less free place to live, thanks to you (note: NOT thanks to the "terrorists").
You, and people like you, represent absolutely everything I loathe.
Proud TSO:
one of two things is true:
1. searching the brace by hand is a joke.
2. she's gonna blow that thing up while you're examining it.
good job, eh?
if you really believed there was a chance of finding explosives in a form-fitting brace, you wouldn't be putting your hands anywhere near it.
you want a suggestion for a better approach? how about WTMD + ETD? more effective, less intrusive.
Proud TSO said...
So we at TSA can't really win with you guys can we? If we allowed that woman to continue without checking the brace, we could have had (potentially) another "Underwear Bomber" and been persecuted for allowing this person on a plane.
If we clear the brace PROPERLY, we are persecuted for invasion of privacy. Instead of attacking us, who are trying to do the best job we can, can you offer any suggestions for improvement? We're not going away. Solutions instead of sarcasm and vile accusations would be more helpful to me.
Here are a couple of suggestions (short of getting rid of the entire agency):
Each employee of the TSA should go through a comprehensive Customer Service training program. They can leave the snide/rude comments of passengers at home. The screeners on power trips that raise their voice, yell, belittle passengers should be removed from screenings. I would also recommend you recruit a higher standand of workers. Fire immediately anyone that is caught stealing from passenger bags or at screening points. How about that Mr Proud TSO?
Proud TSO said...
"So we at TSA can't really win with you guys can we?"
No, you can't because the basic ideas behind the creation of the TSA are defective. It doesn't matter how well you do your job when the job itself is wrong.
No amount of airport screening will ever prevent a terrorist from killing people. Your job will never make people safer. The terrorists are laughing at you.
"Anonymous Anonymous said...
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/09/14/national/main20105942.shtml
The above is a link to a story from a couple of months ago where a woman was strip searched after being removed from an airplane.
Another day, another LIE from the TSA"
If you're being pulled off of a plane by FBI and HSI you're not being searched by TSA.
With the upcoming holiday travel season quickly approaching, it would be useful if the TSA clarified its position on medical braces.
Can the TSA require them to be removed or not?
Proud TSO said...
So we at TSA can't really win with you guys can we? If we allowed that woman to continue without checking the brace, we could have had (potentially) another "Underwear Bomber" and been persecuted for allowing this person on a plane.
If we clear the brace PROPERLY, we are persecuted for invasion of privacy. Instead of attacking us, who are trying to do the best job we can, can you offer any suggestions for improvement? We're not going away. Solutions instead of sarcasm and vile accusations would be more helpful to me.
**********************************
The last time I checked American voters DO have a say in electing leaders who can dismantle or re-engineer the TSA. Don't be so self-assured about your long-term role.
To be fair, I have offered a few no-cost suggestions for the TSA at your request.
1. Greet every American taxpayer with a friendly "Hello and Welcome"
2. Stop barking/shouting orders at passengers and ask travelers if they need assistance
3. Respect and protect passenger property/privacy as if it were your own
4. Survey passenger experiences and use feedback for staff performance reviews
You are right in the fact that many Americans do not like the TSA, myself included. My reasoning is simple - I see most TSA officers as rude and unprofessional. Hopefully, someday my perceptions will change.
"Proud TSO" wrote: "So we at TSA can't really win with you guys can we? If we allowed that woman to continue without checking the brace, we could have had (potentially) another "Underwear Bomber" and been persecuted for allowing this person on a plane.
If we clear the brace PROPERLY, we are persecuted for invasion of privacy. Instead of attacking us, who are trying to do the best job we can, can you offer any suggestions for improvement? We're not going away. Solutions instead of sarcasm and vile accusations would be more helpful to me."
First of all, you need to open your eyes to the FACT (yes, fact) that there has NEVER been an attempt to take down an aircraft by an elderly person using medical device to smuggle something onto a plane. NEVER, not once. Ever. So your basic logic here fails: you are assaulting, molesting and humiliating people in attempt to stop something from happening that has NEVER HAPPENED.
There's also never been someone who attempted to melt a plane in-flight with lasers implanted int their eyes. But there COULD be in the future, right? So let's gouge out everyone's eyes before they board planes, because if it DOES happen, everyone is sure gonna be mad at you because you didn't stop it!
Please. Wake up. Your efforts, and the 8 BILLION dollars spent by your agency every year, are completely wasted on fantasies based on irrational fears.
And if you consider this "doing your best job", then you need to be fired. Now.
How you can be "proud" of working for an organization that assaults, molests, humiliates and violates the basic civil rights of innocent civilians on a daily basis is beyond me. You should be ASHAMED, not proud.
I wish there could be a little more back and forth discussion here. Seems like things are said then never responded to ...
Proud TSO said:
"Solutions instead of sarcasm and vile accusations would be more helpful to me."
Honestly Proud TSO ... I don't think the TSA wants any suggestions! The TSA seems to do the exact opposite of everything that the American people suggest or want!
Americans want LESS invasive security so the TSA ramps it up and starts patting people down, INCLUDING LITTLE CHILDREN, and giving us many incidents like this one.
Americans are concerned over possible heath risks associated with scanners so the TSA IGNORES the people and instead of using a passive system like the E.U. has it sticks with the radiation machines!
Americans are concerned over pictures of their naked bodies being seen via the Strip-Scanners ... does TSA rush to correct the problem and reassure the public that privacy IS a concern? NO! They first DEFEND the practices then, after MANY YEARS of public outcry and hearings, VERY SLOWLY roll out a supposed censoring program for the AIT.
Americans want kinder, gentler, more courteous TSA agents so TSA responds by hiring some of the most obnoxious, ignorant,unprofessional, power-hungry people on the planet!
"Get your freak on girl"
AND ... to top it all off ... TSA continually flip-flops on its positions and procedures!
Why is it that one airport doesn't bat an eye at my nail clipper but the next not only takes it from me but gives me the evil eye like I was going to clip the pilots to death???
Why does one airport make me take off my belt and the next one doesn't?
Why does the TSA tell people picture taking is okay and then SEVERELY harass people when they do?
Why does THIS website state:
"You should neither be asked to nor agree to lift, remove, or raise any article of clothing to reveal your breast prosthesis, and you should not be asked to remove it."
... AND ...
"Security Officers will not ask nor require you to remove your prosthetic device, cast, or support brace."
and yet how many times have we read stories and articles about people who have been forced to remove them???
Are there still any TSA agents who DON'T understand why the American public is starting to have more love for the IRS agent that audits them than for TSA???
Any responses to this? Bob? Proud TSO? ANY TSA cheerleader???
Proud TSO said...
... If we clear the brace PROPERLY....
-----------------------------------
The question is "what is the proper way to screen the brace"
The TSA website states that the proper way to screen the brace includes not asking the traveler to remove it.
You and the TSO's involved disagree.
Hey "Proud TSO", I'll make you a deal. I will not hold it against the TSA the next time an 85-year-old lady with the last name Zimmerman sneaks one past you and maybe your cohorts let her keep a shred of her dignity. There is nothing your organization could do to make me have any respect for the way you provide "security." It sickens me that my taxes are used to fund the abuse of travelers.
Earlier this year (2011) an attorney for the TSA argued in U.S. Court of Appeals that the TSA has the ABSOLUTE RIGHT TO STRIP SEARCH at its own discretion. Check the court transcript if you're unaware of the legal claims of the government lawyers.
With 3 unrelated, credible women coming forth to report idential strip searches within hours of each other, the TSA's automated response: "oh, it didn't happen, our agents followed all protocols" is worthless at best, complete cover-up (no pun intended) at worst.
In response to Proud TSO:
I would offer the following... everything you read that is in opposition to what you do and represent IS constructive criticism...Do you not feel the outrage? Because what you do to children, women, the elderly, the infirm is outrageous in a free society...if we are free. There is no greater freedom than the right to say NO. You and your ilk do not represent safety, you represent tyranny under the color of law.
“A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear. The traitor is the plague.” - Marcus Tullius Cicero
"So we at TSA can't really win with you guys can we? If we allowed that woman to continue without checking the brace, we could have had (potentially) another "Underwear Bomber" and been persecuted for allowing this person on a plane. "
So you're saying that you HAD to strip search the passenger? If that's the case, then it's a management problem. The poorly trained, undereducated TSO force cannot be expected to exhibit discretion and does not have the tools to prevent the abuse of elderly and disabled passengers as this event demonstrates.
"Instead of attacking us, who are trying to do the best job we can, can you offer any suggestions for improvement?"
The problem is that your best is not good enough. I suggest that if it was explosives you were concerned about, an explosives dog could have cleared the passenger in five seconds. Is that so difficult?
"We're not going away. Solutions instead of sarcasm and vile accusations would be more helpful to me."
No but you're probably going to transition to a privatized force that is more flexible and willing to counter the threat instead of saying things like you did above: "We have poor procedures that require us to abuse elderly passengers."
"I am completely humiliated by the TSA pat down, but as a cancer patient, I should not take any radiation."
According to the TSA, you were not humiliated as it's not the policy of the TSA to humiliate passengers. Sorry.
"Instead of attacking us, who are trying to do the best job we can, can you offer any suggestions for improvement? We're not going away. Solutions instead of sarcasm and vile accusations would be more helpful to me."
From TSA documentation:
"Security Officers will not ask nor require you to remove your prosthetic device, cast, or support brace."
So my solution would be to follow the guidance of your organization. That would be sufficient until the American people can reform it into behaving acceptably.
Proud TSO said...
Since you came by to plead "Just following orders", maybe you could clarify when exactly it is policy to not follow policy?
1)" It is TSA’s policy that screening procedures are conducted in a manner that treats all passengers with dignity, respect and courtesy."
You have an interesting concept of "dignity." But moving on...
2)" CCTV shows that the passenger arrived at the ticket counter at 12:19 p.m. for her 1 p.m. scheduled flight which left early at 12:50 p.m."
I think it's foolish to leave such little time, especially if one's mobility is limited. I wouldn't have been particularly surprised or outraged if she had missed her flight. But that has nothing whatsoever to do with the matter at hand.
3) "She entered the checkpoint line in a wheelchair, walker in hand."
This sentence contains a straightforward statement of fact that does not contain any outright lies or sneaky obfuscations. A true rarity!
4) "The passenger opted out of advanced imaging technology screening, requested a pat-down and told the officers that she was wearing a back brace or support belt which required private screening."
This one's piddling, but I'm sure she didn't say "I am wearing a back brace that requires private screening."
5)"Private screening was conducted by two female officers. The item was removed, rescreened, and the passenger was cleared for travel. Nothing unusual was depicted on the CCTV as the passenger and two female officers entered and exited the room. The wheelchair attendant assisted the passenger in departing the checkpoint area for the gate."
No one ever claimed anything "unusual" had happened when she was in the HALL. So this tells us nothing at all.
6)"Terrorists remain focused on attacking transportation through tactics such as concealing explosives under clothing. Further, as evidenced by the Christmas Day 2009 attempted bombing, concealed anomalies under clothing must continue to be resolved and cleared as part of the screening process to ensure the item does not pose a threat to the safety of the traveling public. "
This one really takes the cake. Of course it is possible to attempt to hide a dangerous object under one's clothing. But that isn't evidence of a need to screen for them. Tell me why the following statements wouldn't be true in your warped, paranoid worldview:
"As evidenced by an attempted stabbing in the park two years ago, all persons must continue to submit to thorough pat-downs upon leaving their home."
"As evidenced by a near-fatal car accident two years ago, all automobiles must continue to undergo modification to ensure a maximum speed of 20 mph."
"As evidenced by that guy who almost was hit by a falling brick two years ago, all pedestrians will continue to be required to wear helmets on the sidewalk."
I would say "You get the point" right now, but the thing is that you never seem to get it.
[I have taken a screenshot of this post, which is in full accordance with your guidelines.]
what is the matter with you people? ANYTHING can be made into a terrorist instrument. during the war in vietnam the "terrorists" filled the hollow tubes of their bicycles with C4 and drove right up to the target like they were delivering egg rolls. the TSA has not developed a way to distinguish likely suspects from amongst the crowd - but who has? until you solve that problem what else can they do? if this woman is lying about her treatment, isn't she also guilty of something? please raise your hand if you would board an airplane where the occupants had not been searched. i have ocean front property for you in arizona. if you are wearing as tinfoil hat and really believe the conspiracy nuts, you are lost to reason anyway. a few pervert TSA rogue agents mean nothing. what matters is that an open society is trying to protect itself without turning into a prison camp. please come up with a reasonable solution. everyone is listening.
Proud TSO said...
"So we at TSA can't really win with you guys can we? If we allowed that woman to continue without checking the brace, we could have had (potentially) another "Underwear Bomber" and been persecuted for allowing this person on a plane.
If we clear the brace PROPERLY, we are persecuted for invasion of privacy. Instead of attacking us, who are trying to do the best job we can, can you offer any suggestions for improvement? We're not going away. Solutions instead of sarcasm and vile accusations would be more helpful to me."
Suggestions have been given. Many suggestions. Were you listening? It seems more flyers are now turning to vile comments rather than suggestions because no one at the TSA has been listening.
@Proud TSO
You would like suggestions? Okay, here's one crazy one, how about you talk to the 85 year old woman and determine if she presents a threat to the aircraft through a conversation. Just because TSA has written down a procedure that constitutes being "cleared properly" doesn't make it necessary, effective, or intelligent.
Had this woman been flying out of Tel Aviv they would have cleared her without the need of a strip search, so don't go whining about how it can't be done.
TSA is choosing not to do it that way, because they don't believe their TSOs are intelligent enough to do it effectively. Doesn't that offend you?
I'll add my voice to those asking whether you are wrong when you claim that passengers don't have to remove braces or when you claim that your protocols were followed when you required a passenger to remove a brace. Which one is it, Bob?
I would appreciate an answer today. I don't think that is an unreasonable request.
Blogger Bob said:
"It is TSA’s policy that screening procedures are conducted in a manner that treats all passengers with dignity, respect and courtesy."
No it isn't.
Rule #1 for the TSA is to thoroughly inspect all passengers. Everything else is secondary to that.
Stop trying to spin it and admit that you will do whatever is necessary even if passengers are harmed in the process.
Proud TSO said...
So we at TSA can't really win with you guys can we? If we allowed that woman to continue without checking the brace, we could have had (potentially) another "Underwear Bomber" and been persecuted for allowing this person on a plane.
If we clear the brace PROPERLY, we are persecuted for invasion of privacy. Instead of attacking us, who are trying to do the best job we can, can you offer any suggestions for improvement? We're not going away. Solutions instead of sarcasm and vile accusations would be more helpful to me.
This is pathetic. I swear every time I'm at the airport it's the same thing. Elderly and mothers with children being harrassed and humiliated. What fresh hell is this? What a charade. The idea that this actually makes some people feel safe would be hysterical if it wasn't soo pathetic. What a joke. When all they have to do is shove up there rear! You think a terrorist can't figure that out when its common knowledge?
The TSA has clearly violated their own policy over and over and lied about it over and over. Humiliating innocent law abiding American citizens in the process. Then insult them with lies. CYA is clearly what its all about. Do you guys have toilet paper with the constitution printed on it? You may as well.
ProudTSO, I certainly have hope that you will go away. I don't fear other citizens, I fear you and what the likes of your organization has done to America. I bet you folks at the TSA can't wait till the last of us who remember how this country used to be and what we've lost are dead. So you can ratchet the screws down further to serve your idiotic merchants of fear.
You better wake up before it's too late for you. You guys are terrorists. Nazi's were just doing their jobs too. There's no amount of security that can protect anyone from another that is determined to harm them. The bill of rights after all, is a document designed to protect us from the government. From people like you and your employer. Thanks to you, the terrorist have won and will keep on winning until we wake up and elect people with common sense.
How did we go from FDR's "We have nothing to fear but fear itself" to fear everything and everyone. Are we a nation of wimps? Just bend over, its for your own good and protection. Disgusting!
Fear and intimidation are all you have TSA. Like someone else has stated, look in the mirror TSA. There's nothing to pat yourself on the back for. You do far greater harm to America than good. I think what you are doing to this country is insidious and evil.
So it is the TSA's position that the passengers who make these claims are lying?
I just want to know if you are bold enough to say that explicitly instead of implicitly.
Proud TSO said... "So we at TSA can't really win with you guys can we?"
Sure you can. Stop the phoney-baloney stuff and concentrate on the real issues.
Examples of Phoney-baloney:
*the 3-1-1- rule. If a liquid is dangerous, it doesn't become less dangerous simply because it's in 3 ounce bottles.
*the "advanced imaging technology screening" machines, aka nudie-scanners. They miss stuff all the time, they irradiate people, and they are a violation of the 4th Amendment.
Examples of Real issues:
*screeners who can't recognize common forms of ID.
*screeners who don't even know or follow the TSA's own rules
*Baggage and cargo that goes on the plane unchecked.
*a horrible failure rate (up to 70%!) of finding weapons and bombs in tests.
*a horrible failure rate of finding weapons and bombs in real life.
*inconsistencies from airport to airport, and checkpoint to checkpoint.
*taking away my bottle of water, when the exact same bottle is for sale just past the checkpoint (at increased price)
And so on.
Take care of this kinda stuff, and you CAN "win with us guys'.
Security is important. If anyone don't like to go through screening process then they should not go to such places. TSA has done their job. What do you want to do them? Not to do their job just because you are an old lady?? I disagree. IMO, everyone... EVERYONE.. even president, should be go through security screening process. That is the only way, bad people won't find any security loopholes.
Lee Anthony Nieves writes:
So I ask all the anti-TSA firebrands: How many terrorists did the private airport security capture on 9/11?
Sure, I'll play. Zero.
Now, let me ask you two questions in response:
1. How many security regulations in place on 9/11 were not enforced by those private security workers? (Hint: the answer is zero.)
2. How many terrorists has TSA caught since 9/11? (Hint: the answer is zero.)
From a very recent report from the Combating Terrorism Center at West Point:
"As politically painful as such an admission may be, it is essential to scale back bloated security measures that add significant expense and inconvenience to commercial aviation without materially reducing risk."
http://www.ctc.usma.edu/posts/terrorist-threats-to-commercial-aviation-a-contemporary-assessment
Read it and weep, TSA, as it could be your death knell.
Screen shot taken
Lee Anthony Nieves said...
So I ask all the anti-TSA firebrands: How many terrorists did the private airport security capture on 9/11?
None.
But they also didn't confiscate my water bottle.
They didn't throw away my 3.5 ounces of shampoo.
They didn't grope grannies.
They didn't irradiate people.
They didn't hand pliers to people and tell then to pull out their nipple piercings.
They didn't squeeze people's ostomy bags, squirting urine on them.
They didn't... well, I think I've made my point.
Bob,
This incident shows a disconnect between the policy as stated on the TSA web site and what happened to this individual.
You and the TSA have been asked to clarify, but have chosen to ignore these requests.
Your silence on this says a lot about you as an individual as well as the TSA as an organization.
Lee Anthony Nieves said...
"That is why there has been no traction in the anti-TSA firebrand movement."
Because the politicians in Washington are all too afraid to say anything against the TSA for fear that they will be labeled as weak on terrorism.
The purpose of the TSA isn't to protect passengers, it's to protect the jobs of politicians. They don't care if it works, they just want to be seen as doing something.
"please raise your hand if you would board an airplane where the occupants had not been searched."
I'm raising my hand.
I want passengers, luggage, cargo, including US mail that is frequently in the cargo bay to be screened for explosives. Dogs are probably best at this.
I am not at all worried if a passenger has a screwdriver, a bottle of water, or a three inch blade, particularly when that person can have knitting needles or a mechanical pencil. More to the point, any US SOF soldier, among others, don't even need tools to kill a person quickly. Are you suggesting that the TSA should not allow US service men to fly?
"what is the matter with you people? ANYTHING can be made into a terrorist instrument. "
Are you suggesting that passengers should not be allowed to take anything on board? A necktie can be a garrotte, after all.
"That is why there has been no traction in the anti-TSA firebrand movement. Far too many passengers don't require additional screening."
Recent reports show that the TSA is more reviled than the IRS.
No traction? More TSA delusion about its role.
Blog Team,
If you hope to retain any credibility, you have to address the obvious conflict between the compelling the passenger to remove the brace and the TSA's policy of not requiring this of passengers.
If you fail to address this even the most fairminded readers will conclude the violation of TSA policy is condoned in the treatment of elderly passengers.
Ayn R. Key said...
So it is the TSA's position that the passengers who make these claims are lying?
I just want to know if you are bold enough to say that explicitly instead of implicitly.
December 7, 2011 7:00 PM
............
You are asking for honesty and integrity in the TSA reponses given by the TSA Blog Team.
Afraid you will be waiting a long time.
TSA Strip Searches are nothing new.
I-Team: Illegal Strip Searches at Reagan National?
Story:
TSA Employee: "I couldn't imagine my sister or my mother going through that process. I was so upset."
AGAIN AND AGAIN, TSA EMPLOYEES AT REAGAN NATIONAL AIRPORT -INCLUDING SUPERVISORS-TOLD US THAT PASSENGERS WERE ASKED TO REMOVE THEIR CLOTHING AND EXPOSE THEIR PRIVATE PARTS DURING SECURITY SCREENINGS…A CLEAR VIOLATION OF TSA'S OWN INTERNAL GUIDELINES… OBTAINED BY THE I-TEAM.
Most travelers don't care what the TSA guards do as long as it isn't to them and the line keeps moving. If a person gets pulled for harassment and humiliation that's their problem.
"please raise your hand if you would board an airplane where the occupants had not been searched."
I would board that plane without hesitation, so consider my hand way up in the air.
I guess I am just a risk taker, like when I got on an Amtrak train where the passengers did not go through security. When I go to a movie theatre where the other patrons are not searched. When I go to the mall where the customers are not searched. When I walk down a public street where the people I pass by are not searched. When I go to work where my co-workers are not searched. When I go to church, where nobody is searched. When I ride a city bus when the other passengers are not searched.
Not Scared of Terrorists
Where's my post from this morning, Bob? I didn't say anything in violation of your TOS.
1. "please raise your hand if you would board an airplane where the occupants had not been searched."
As other commenters have pointed out, I would also be willing to enter a public building, walk down a public street, and drive on a public highway where others have not been searched. In fact, right now I am sitting in an office on the fourteenth floor of a building and, shockingly, not a single person has been searched who is presently in the building. Of course I am wearing a flak jacket and carrying a portable rescue ladder, because you just can't be too careful, right?
How long will we go on calling this the land of the free and the home of the brave when we are increasingly not free and clearly not at all brave?
2. Bob-- it is time for you to answer the question that has been posed by many commenters: how is it that you followed all your policies in asking this woman to remove her brace when your policies clearly state that your officers will not ask or require anyone to remove a brace? It's not a complicated question. So answer it. Today.
Bob, some time ago TSA took and held Stacey Armato hostage for an extended period of time in an attempt to force TSA's will on the lady and refused to screen her breastmilk using alternative actions. This was the second incident at this same checkpoint and with some of the same TSA employees present.
Did TSA take any action against any TSA personel due to TSA actions against Ms. Armato?
If not why not?
An Anonymous poster said…
[[You want a suggestion. Follow your own guidelines as well as the Constitution for starters. This would go a long way towards solving your problem, but then people have been saying this all along and no one listens.]]
Who’s version? Yours, or that of the US Court system? “I’ll take the US Court System for $500 Bob”.
[[From an American Citizen who hates the TSA worse than the IRS.]]
Most people fear what they do not understand.
Another Anonymous poster said…
[[I would gladly live with the minescule chance of another underware bomer to prevent the stripsearching of innocent citizens.]]
So, you are willing to put every other air travelers life in jeopardy because of your own personal bias?
[[You want to win your opponents over, then explain why she was required to remove a medical device in order to board an airplane.]]
She wasn’t. Removing the device would have been offered as an option, which leaves the decision in her own hands. No one is “required” to remove any medical device at a TSA checkpoint, ever.
Why is everyone so willing to believe these stories, especially when they have been proven inaccurate so often?
DJ said…
[[one of two things is true:
1. searching the brace by hand is a joke.
2. she's gonna blow that thing up while you're examining it.
good job, eh?]]
Better me and another TSO in the private screening room than an aircraft full of passengers at 30,000 feet. Kinda hard to get fire and rescue up there in time to do any good. Don’t worry though, as shown by PanAm flight 103 on Wednesday, 21 December 1988, the folks on that flight will get within range of fire and rescue, eventually. Hardened cockpit doors won’t stop that, and neither will the actions of the other passengers or any of the training received by the flight crew. Reality is that TSO’s are human bomb detectors, and willingly put their lives on the line every day for the safety of the flying public.
An Anonymous poster asked…
[[Can the TSA require them (medical braces) to be removed or not?]]
No. Can’t even ask for them to be removed. Bob has it right.
And yet another Anonymous poster stated…
[[The last time I checked American voters DO have a say in electing leaders who can dismantle or re-engineer the TSA. Don't be so self-assured about your long-term role.]]
In late 2008 I was working on the checkpoint when a middle aged woman who was obviously upset about going through the Walk Through Metal Detector say “I can’t wait until he is in office, all this garbage will go away”. I looked her in the eye and gave her one of those “Yeah, right” grins and kept on processing passengers. And here it is, nearly 2012, and her idea of “this garbage” is still here.
SciMjr2 said…
[[Honestly Proud TSO ... I don't think the TSA wants any suggestions! The TSA seems to do the exact opposite of everything that the American people suggest or want!]]
The vast majority of the flying public have no idea what it takes to make commercial air travel safe. Nor do they want to know, and really don’t care until it inconveniences them in some way. And very few have even an inkling of what they want. They want to get from point A to point B in the easiest way possible.
Jim Huggins said…
[[1. How many security regulations in place on 9/11 were not enforced by those private security workers? (Hint: the answer is zero.)]]
Incorrect. Please read the 9/11 commission report, several clearly written procedures were violated by screeners on that day, some of which allowed the terrorists to bring their weapons on board the aircraft. The 9/11 report is very clear on this point.
Seems TSA continues to influence people.
I wonder how long before someone at TSA is going to realize that the train is off the rails?
Apparently the current TSA leadership just doesn't have the capacity to understand the total failure that TSA is.
H.R. 3608: TSA STRIP ACT
Blackburn Bill Would Strip TSA Badges and Uniforms
Washington, Dec 8 - Congressman Marsha Blackburn (TN-7) has introduced legislation to rein in the Transportation Security Administration and provide more transparency for American travelers. H.R. 3608, the Stop TSA's Reach In Policy (STRIP) Act,
“It is outrageous that in a post 9/11 world that the American people should have to live in fear of those whose job it is to keep us safe," Blackburn said. "Congress has sat idly by as the TSA strip searches 85 year old grandmothers in New York, pats down 3 year olds in Chattanooga, and checks colostomy bags for explosives in Orlando. Enough is enough! The least we can do is end this impersonation which is an insult to real cops."
Adding my voice to those asking if TSA policy was correctly followed if the lady who says she was STRIP SEARCHED was required to remove a medical device?
Bob this is a very simple question that can be answered with a simple yes she was or now she wasn't required to remove the medical device.
Why is it that TSA can't stand up tall and respond to such a simple question?
So I've given you a chance to bash TSA, and you sound as though you're bashing me, which is still unproductive, because you don't know me. You don't know my airport. You haven't screened through my checkpoint.
First, I'm Mrs. Proud TSO, to clarify for those who keep calling me MR.
Secondly, I nor any of my team, yell, scream, demand or belittle. And I'm not saying it doesn't happen, I'm saying it doesn't happen at my airport. I have flown through some really large airports, and been treated horrendously. I'm not saying it doesn't happen. I understand your frustrations as a passenger. I just wish you could understand my frustrations as an officer.
When I said "we're not going away", I didn't mean that to sound condescending or threatening in any way. I mean when was the last time the government eliminated an agency? And even if we went "private" as people keep talking about, the private firms are still regulated by a TSA. Private firms would actually pay me more, train me exactly the same, and offer me the same benefits. Win-win for me, but how does that help America?
I don't understand the statement that supposedly is on the website stating we won't ask removal, if at all possible, of something that cannot be cleared. I would never, ever, ask a passenger to remove something in my presence, however, I would ask them to step out of the checkpoint, remove whatever they can (obviously not if it's not possible) and then re-screen. But that's me, and my team, at my airport.
I KNOW there are many that have control issues, that appear untrained, and uneducated. But there are MANY MORE of us that do not fit that profile. I always greet with a "good morning", never raise my voice, and show extreme patience when passengers scream at me, throw things at me, refuse to speak to me, and swear atrociously at me. So, please, consider some of us are genuine, and sincere in trying to fix the problems. This road goes both ways.
RB sez - "Story:
TSA Employee: "I couldn't imagine my sister or my mother going through that process. I was so upset."
AGAIN AND AGAIN, TSA EMPLOYEES AT REAGAN NATIONAL AIRPORT -INCLUDING SUPERVISORS-TOLD US THAT PASSENGERS WERE ASKED TO REMOVE THEIR CLOTHING AND EXPOSE THEIR PRIVATE PARTS DURING SECURITY SCREENINGS…A CLEAR VIOLATION OF TSA'S OWN INTERNAL GUIDELINES… OBTAINED BY THE I-TEAM."
The article you quote is from 2004. To give some context, I was not an employee then. Since I came to TSA, the rule has always been the same as it is quoted here on the TSA website :
http://www.tsa.gov/travelers/airtravel/specialneeds/editorial_1370.shtm#0
"Security Officers will not ask nor require you to remove your prosthetic device, cast, or support brace."
It even goes further to ask the passengers not to remove their devices:
"During the screening process, please do not remove or offer to remove your prosthetic device."
Since I have been here, this has been the policy I have been taught and followed.
West
TSA Blog Team
http://www.tsa.gov/travelers/airtravel/specialneeds/editorial_1370.shtm#0
"Security Officers will not ask nor require you to remove your prosthetic device, cast, or support brace."
It even goes further to ask the passengers not to remove their devices:
"During the screening process, please do not remove or offer to remove your prosthetic device."
Since I have been here, this has been the policy I have been taught and followed.
West
TSA Blog Team
December 9, 2011 10:24 AM
................
So it does seem that the screeners at JFK are not complying with TSA policy.
I have to ask what TSA is doing to teach all of its employees correct procedures since it is clear that training so far has been ineffective.
Not a day goes by that some report of TSA screeners not complying with policy is reported be it certain ID cards, Breast Milk screening , removing medical devices and such, yet TSA seems to have more than enough training to identify harmless water or cash money as a danger to aviation.
TSA needs to be held accountable for the continued inability to carry out policy and the buck stops in the Administrators Office of John S. Pistole!
"Security Officers will not ask nor require you to remove your prosthetic device, cast, or support brace."
It even goes further to ask the passengers not to remove their devices:
***********************************
This is BULL! I have been asked take my brace off......
West: if TSA policy is not to require the removal of braces, and not to ask passengers to remove them ... then how can Bob say that this passenger's brace was removed AND that the screening was conducted in accordance with TSA procedures?
The article you quote is from 2004. To give some context, I was not an employee then. Since I came to TSA, the rule has always been the same as it is quoted here on the TSA website :
http://www.tsa.gov/travelers/airtravel/specialneeds/editorial_1370.shtm#0
"Security Officers will not ask nor require you to remove your prosthetic device, cast, or support brace."
It even goes further to ask the passengers not to remove their devices:
"During the screening process, please do not remove or offer to remove your prosthetic device."
Since I have been here, this has been the policy I have been taught and followed.
West
TSA Blog Team
December 9, 2011 10:24 AM
...........
On second look it seems the article you responded to was about Strip Searches, not removal of medical appliances.
West, can we take from your response that you do not contest the content and accuracy of the article?
GSOLTSO,
Thanks for reinforcing the documentation that TSA does not request or require the removal of medical braces. This does not answer the question of conflict between this statement and the text of Bob's post that states the medical back brace was removed and screened while following proper procedure.
The only way proper procedure was followed, based on the description provided by Blogger Bob, is if it is proper procedure to ignore the information provided by the TSA on their own website.
"Since I have been here, this has been the policy I have been taught and followed. "
And yet, Curtis tells us that the brace removal WAS proper protocol. So which one of you is lying?
[quote]RB sez - "Story:
TSA Employee: "I couldn't imagine my sister or my mother going through that process. I was so upset."
AGAIN AND AGAIN, TSA EMPLOYEES AT REAGAN NATIONAL AIRPORT -INCLUDING SUPERVISORS-TOLD US THAT PASSENGERS WERE ASKED TO REMOVE THEIR CLOTHING AND EXPOSE THEIR PRIVATE PARTS DURING SECURITY SCREENINGS…A CLEAR VIOLATION OF TSA'S OWN INTERNAL GUIDELINES… OBTAINED BY THE I-TEAM."
The article you quote is from 2004. To give some context, I was not an employee then. Since I came to TSA, the rule has always been the same as it is quoted here on the TSA website :
http://www.tsa.gov/travelers/airtravel/specialneeds/editorial_1370.shtm#0
"Security Officers will not ask nor require you to remove your prosthetic device, cast, or support brace."
It even goes further to ask the passengers not to remove their devices:
"During the screening process, please do not remove or offer to remove your prosthetic device."
Since I have been here, this has been the policy I have been taught and followed.
West
TSA Blog Team
[/quote]
Ok... I will bite
I and many other do not have any disagreement about the policies.
The issue is that TSOs have a reputation of not following policy.
If every single TSO and 3 stripper followed policy then many of our issues with the TSA would disappear.
There are far too many instances of TSOs instructing passengers of things that are against policy.
I have personally witnessed TSO's lying to passengers to try and make their job easier or get the passenger to do what they wanted and not what they had the rights to do.
Every single TSO that tries to talk someone out of an opt out or doesn't place the passenger in a place where they can see their belongings is violating policy.
I know how you twist your words GSOL.
You may say that "policy" says removal or brace is not required... however, I also know that you will not allow a passenger to reach the "secure" area without being cleared.
So the only option the the passenger has is to "voluntarily" remove the brace or miss their flight.
Unfortunately there has been close to a half dozen stories within the last 6 months of TSA causing passengers to remove clothing covering private areas for me not to start to believe that you guys are doing this.
Whether "requiring" or forcing the passengers to "volunteer" is just an argument of semantics and a weak excuse to violate peoples personal rights.
Jim Huggins: The very fact that TSA has strengthened the way passengers are thoroughly screened at the checkpoints sends a signal to those with harmful intent.
You won't make it past the checkpoint. You won't commandeer an airliner, and you certainly won't slip a bomb as checked baggage.
Therefore, TSA, as authorized by the Aviation & Transportation Security Act of 2001, has made air travel safe for millions.
Also, it is not the job of TSA to capture terrorists as TSOs do not have law enforcement powers. It is the job of TSOs to thwart terrorists from accessing the sterile area and the airplane with their deadly instruments.
It is the job of law enforcement and the intelligence community to actually capture terrorists.
Do you understand the difference?
"please raise your hand if you would board an airplane where the occupants had not been searched."
33,000 people died in car wrecks last year; the most dangerous mode of TRANSPORTATION. Please keep your hands raised if you would get on a freeway where other drivers had not been screened by TSA for valid state-issued drivers licenses, and searched to ensure they are not possessing influencing drugs or alcohol?
To those of you who had your hands raised, the TSA is profiting from your wallet by selling you FEAR, and business for them has been booming since 9/11.
"Washington, Dec 8 - Congressman Marsha Blackburn (TN-7) has introduced legislation to rein in the Transportation Security Administration and provide more transparency for American travelers. H.R. 3608, the Stop TSA's Reach In Policy (STRIP) Act"
Blackburn has taken a combined $20,000 from FirstLine and Lockheed Martin. She doesn't care about patdowns and colostomy bag screenings, just who's doing them.
Dear John Reimer,
You say you want to be safe on airplanes. Well me too! But why on earth would you think that TSA is doing that. TSA is a "show." Look at all the knives and guns that have been accidentally put on airplanes. I know someone who accidentally got a 10" kitchen knife on a plane. (she was using it to cut the cake for a children's birthday party the day before).
The TSA dishonest, ineffective, bloated bureaucracy. Hopefully they will lose their "officer" title and cheesy badges soon
"GSOLTSO said...
RB sez - "Story:
TSA Employee: "I couldn't imagine my sister or my mother going through that process. I was so upset."
AGAIN AND AGAIN, TSA EMPLOYEES AT REAGAN NATIONAL AIRPORT -INCLUDING SUPERVISORS-TOLD US THAT PASSENGERS WERE ASKED TO REMOVE THEIR CLOTHING AND EXPOSE THEIR PRIVATE PARTS DURING SECURITY SCREENINGS…A CLEAR VIOLATION OF TSA'S OWN INTERNAL GUIDELINES… OBTAINED BY THE I-TEAM."
The article you quote is from 2004. To give some context, I was not an employee then. Since I came to TSA, the rule has always been the same as it is quoted here on the TSA website :
http://www.tsa.gov/travelers/airtravel/specialneeds/editorial_1370.shtm#0
"Security Officers will not ask nor require you to remove your prosthetic device, cast, or support brace."
It even goes further to ask the passengers not to remove their devices:
"During the screening process, please do not remove or offer to remove your prosthetic device."
Since I have been here, this has been the policy I have been taught and followed.
West
TSA Blog Team"
Then how do you explain the urostomy bag incident, colostomy bag incident, the breast implant incident, and the most recent incidents. Do you see the pattern here?
Please explain how this could be.
I keep seeing representatives of TSA stating that it has always been policy that prosthetic devices should not ever be asked to be removed nor should the passenger voluntarily remove said devices yet this kind of thing keeps happening.
What gives? Is it policy, or is it written policy only with the "real" policing being whatever the TSO says it is at any given time? Inquiring minds want to know.
I fully understand why the TSA is now more reviled than the IRS.
Seems the norm for TSA is overstepping the Administrative Search for WEI including several Strip Searches as reported at JFK.
Reported today is another incident of TSA screening for non-threat items.
TSA THINKS MEDICINE PILLS ARE EXPLOSIVES
Jet blues: Pills in passenger's carry-on bag set off airport security
By GREG WELTER-Staff Writer
Posted: 12/09/2011 12:44:17 AM PST
For the life of me I cannot believe that TSA is continually overstepping its responsibilities like this.
It seems TSA's intent is to force Congress to limit TSA's authority since TSA cannot discipline itself and stick with the core job of screening for WEI.
I have one question for the so-called TSA screeners in Chico.
How did a persons medicine threaten civil aviation?
Another TSA Training failure!
West,
Thanks for actually taking the time to address this issue. However, your statement is not enough. Is it really too much to ask that TSA directly address the apparent contradiction in their claim that proper procedures were observed in this case?
"Since I have been here, this has been the policy I have been taught and followed. West TSA Blog Team"
So what?
What do your actions have to do with this? Yes you are sure a wonderful guy. That has nothing to do with these incidents.
CHRISTMAS IS AROUND THE CORNER AND FEW YEARS AGO A MAN'S UNDERWEAR WENT OFF. THANK GOD NO ONE WAS HURT. MAY BE IF HE "WAS STRIPPED SEARCHED" AS EVERYONE CLAIMS TSA DOES WE WOULD NOT HAVE AN INCIDENT. HE IS THE FIRST OF MANY. IF NYPD PULLS YOU OVER IN NY THEY NOT GOING TO PAT YOU DOWN IN PRIVATE. EVRYONE KNOWS HOW TO DO EVERYONE'S JOB EXCEPT THEIR OWN. GO ON YOUTUBE AND SEE THE THINGS TERRORIST ARE DOING. THEY HAVE CLASSES AND SPEECHES EVERYDAY. BY THE WAY, THE UNABOMBER, HAD A PHD. THEY COME IN ALL AGES AND BACKGROUND.
West, Bob, i wish you guys would stop trying to discredit an article merely because it was several years old. For it to truly be a proper answer to someone's argument, there would have to be some kind of evidence of a massive organizational change since that article happened, or at least evidence that the circumstances are now no longer the case.
Nowadays, if anything, the TSA is more abusive and less effective than it was in 2004, not vice versa, as West is attempting to imply.
"...who would ride an airplane unchecked? please put up your hand"
Me! **putting both hands up!**
I would totally use an airline that would allow me to bypass the TSA and its mission to strip me of my individual liberties.
I'll take the incredibly slight chance that a terrorist is sitting in the next row over if I can fly with dignity.
And to those of you who continue to say I have no right to fly, your wrong. I have a right to travel freely around my nation. No, airplanes are not listed in the Constitution, but neither are cars, or busses, or even bicycles.
And If flying is so incredibly dangerous and and scary then maybe you are the one who should use greyhound and leave the airplanes to the adults who can handle it.
"Blackburn has taken a combined $20,000 from FirstLine and Lockheed Martin. She doesn't care about patdowns and colostomy bag screenings, just who's doing them."
For $20k? You must be joking.
"Therefore, TSA, as authorized by the Aviation & Transportation Security Act of 2001, has made air travel safe for millions.
Also, it is not the job of TSA to capture terrorists as TSOs do not have law enforcement powers. It is the job of TSOs to thwart terrorists from accessing the sterile area and the airplane with their deadly instruments.
It is the job of law enforcement and the intelligence community to actually capture terrorists.
Do you understand the difference?"
Do you understand that strip searching senior citizens does not make us safer? Do you understand that security theater does not make us safer? Do you understand that we realize that hiring non-high school graduates to "screen" passengers luggage does not make us safer?
Lee Anthony Nieves said...
"Also, it is not the job of TSA to capture terrorists as TSOs do not have law enforcement powers. It is the job of TSOs to thwart terrorists from accessing the sterile area and the airplane with their deadly instruments.
It is the job of law enforcement and the intelligence community to actually capture terrorists.
Do you understand the difference?"
Law enforcement and intelligence people who actually capture terrorists increase our safety.
TSA agents who just cause the terrorists to go somewhere else do not.
Do you understand the difference?
Bob, it has been reported in various media that TSA provides people with paper drapes for use during certain screenings.
Why would anyone need a paper drape if clothing is not being removed during a TSA screening?
If a paper drape is in fact required then that is a STRIP SEARCH and one conducted by TSA.
If what you did is proper proceedure, proceedures must change immediately. You are doing more harm than good by distressing the elderly in this manner.
Its unfortunate that all we hear are the stories of folks that are upset at TSA for being subjected to screening procedures. I am fairly certain that the number of people that are unhappy about the screening process are far less than those that are very pleased with the job that TSA is doing.
I was traveling through O'hare last year and was wearing a very big bulky knee brace. I understand the screening process and was not suprised when I was told that additional screening was required on my brace.Unfortunately the pants I was wearing over my brace did not afford my the opportunity to raise my pant leg to screen the brace. Therefore I was offered a private screening. During the screening I did have to lower my pants to the knee so that the officers could screen my knee brace. I was never asked or required to remove it at all. And I VOLUNTARILY lowered my pants to aid them. But they were very courteous and professional throughout the screening process. And they did all the right things including offering me a paper drape to respect my privacy. I have flown since then while wearing my knee brace and I often times will save officers the trouble of having to do the extra work by wearing pants that allow them to access my knee brace without requiring a private screening. I also have found that if you go into the screening with a hostile attitude then the officers take a defensive posture and are sometimes not nice. But, I have chosen to always treat them the way I would want to be treated and have gotten nothing but respect and a smile in return.
Thank you TSA for the thankless job that you guys perform everyday.
Its unfortunate that all we hear are the stories of folks that are upset at TSA for being subjected to screening procedures. I am fairly certain that the number of people that are unhappy about the screening process are far less than those that are very pleased with the job that TSA is doing.
I was traveling through O'hare last year and was wearing a very big bulky knee brace. I understand the screening process and was not suprised when I was told that additional screening was required on my brace.Unfortunately the pants I was wearing over my brace did not afford my the opportunity to raise my pant leg to screen the brace. Therefore I was offered a private screening. During the screening I did have to lower my pants to the knee so that the officers could screen my knee brace. I was never asked or required to remove it at all. And I VOLUNTARILY lowered my pants to aid them. But they were very courteous and professional throughout the screening process. And they did all the right things including offering me a paper drape to respect my privacy. I have flown since then while wearing my knee brace and I often times will save officers the trouble of having to do the extra work by wearing pants that allow them to access my knee brace without requiring a private screening. I also have found that if you go into the screening with a hostile attitude then the officers take a defensive posture and are sometimes not nice. But, I have chosen to always treat them the way I would want to be treated and have gotten nothing but respect and a smile in return.
Thank you TSA for the thankless job that you guys perform everyday.
"Lee Anthony Nieves said...
"Also, it is not the job of TSA to capture terrorists as TSOs do not have law enforcement powers. It is the job of TSOs to thwart terrorists from accessing the sterile area and the airplane with their deadly instruments."
It's the job of screening clerks to know what NEXUS cards are, and they don't do that either.
There is no way the TSA would be able to stop a real terrorist attack if terrorists actually tried to carry one out.
Screaming elderly women makes you look clueless.
I actually can't believe there is such thing as a TSA blog.
Nice use of money and resources. Lol
exactly i agree with p.f.bruns. submit to an independent audit or shut up. tsa policing itself is like a fox guarding the hen house
So here's an option for your FAMILY and their next airplance ride. You can choose for them ( father, mother, sister, brother, infant, grandparent anyone you LOVE and hold dear to your heart...
1. Option # 1 your loved ones flight will have TSA screen the passengers and property
2. Option # 2 the airlines will allow absolutley anyone on the flight, no screening, no checking their bags, no ID checks for known terrorists, no dogs sniffing for expolsive materials, the pasengers can bring on any items they want, bats, knives, guns, drugs and don't forget all of these passengers are served alcohol this of course can only help the situation once they are up in the air, oh and TSA will not be providing federal air marshalls either...OK now think about your loved ones again and tell me which option you would choose for them...
"I actually can't believe there is such thing as a TSA blog."
It was number 1 on Time's list of blogs we could do without.
You know, at some point, you can't keep brushing off accusations. Take Herman Cain, for example. I liked him okay, not gah gah for him. One accusation comes out and I brush it off... two come out and I can brush it off, but when enough women come forward, you have to stop and think "okay, maybe the guy IS a horn dog." Same with TSA, one or two 'false' or 'exaggerated' claims we can overlook... but there is something EVERYDAY! Whoever is president in 2012, I hope they shut you down.
[[what is the matter with you people?]]
I'm just guessing here, but "we're not paranoid" is the first thing that comes to my mind.
[[ANYTHING can be made into a terrorist instrument.]]
While true, it suggests that anyone who dwells on it is paranoid. And, as previously mentioned, some of us are not.
[[TSA has not developed a way to distinguish likely suspects from amongst the crowd ]]
That is readily apparent.
[[but who has? ]]
Seriously? Apart from every legitimate law enforcement agency in the world? Every legitimate security outfit in the world? Yeah, you're right. Apart from them, nobody has.
[[until you solve that problem what else can they do?]]
Okay Mr Credulous: You've got four people in front of you. One is an 85 year old granny in a wheel chair. One is a dude in a business suit blabbering endlessly into a cell phone and frantically swirling his fingers around a blackberry. One is a 10 year old kid in Mickey Mouse ears and wearing a "Disney World or Bust" t-shirt. The fourth is a foreign national wearing no coat in the middle of winter, holding no carry-on, having no checked luggage receipt, and holding a tourist Visa showing recent travel to Somalia and Yemen.
Who gets the extra look?
In a society that observes the rights of The People to be left alone, who gets ANY look?
If you're TSA, the person who gets the extra look is the granny, because she has an observable "something" in the form of a wheelchair that "might" be dangerous, even though the likelihood is microscopic. If you're TSA, EVERYone gets a look. To any legitimate law enforcement or security system, the guy with no luggage and hinky travel patterns gets the extra look, and if these law enforcers were in a nation that observed rights, he'd be the only one to get a look ... and then only after the law enforcers went through the proper motions to justify it.
[[please raise your hand if you would board an airplane where the occupants had not been searched.]]
I'm joining several others in raising mine. That is, after all, how passenger air service behaved for decades, even after air piracy and sabotage started occuring.
[[if you are wearing as tinfoil hat and really believe the conspiracy nuts, you are lost to reason anyway.]]
I believe you have your scold backwards. The tinfoil hat wearers and the conspiracy freaks are the ones who cannot discern any meaningful differences between Grandma and the guy with no luggage and no coat in the middle of winter. They are the ones who presume that everyone is as likely as everyone else to be a terrorist, despite there being no rational basis for that assumption.
[[a few pervert TSA rogue agents mean nothing.]]
Okay ... then a few terrorists in several billion passengers also means nothing.
[[what matters is that an open society is trying to protect itself without turning into a prison camp]]
Well, bang goes that idea. The prison camp is here. Everyone is a suspect.
[[please come up with a reasonable solution. everyone is listening.]]
The solution is contained in this response, and I seriously doubt you're going to listen.
rwilymz
http://dblyelloline.blogspot.com/
An "anonymous" wishes to advertise that [s]he can only see the issue in dishonesties:
[[So here's an option for your FAMILY and their next airplance ride. ...
1. Option # 1 your loved ones flight will have TSA screen the passengers and property
2. Option # 2 the airlines will allow absolutley anyone on the flight, no screening, no checking their bags, no ID checks for known terrorists...]]
Okay, now let's have the grown-ups toss in the real answer
Option 3: 90% or more of all passengers buy their tickets more than 24-hours before their flight. Run their names through all Interpol, FBI, state and local police databases to check for ANYTHING that would turn up a flag - old parking tickets, bench warrants, felony convictions. Anything turns up? send their name off - electronically - to the nearest federal courthouse for a judge to review to determine if the individual deserves a search warrant. We have the technology to do this, the data-mining is done each and every time a driver gets pulled over for speeding; it can certainly be done for other applications.
Anyone who books a flight with less than 24 hours - automatically send their name to the judge. You wanna automatically toss in all foreigners too? Okay: send their names to the judge.
The judge will review the circumstances of the folks who got flagged and give a "yes/no" to each one. Every "yes" will be converted to a search warrant at the airport when the judge hits "send".
Consitutional issues are [finally] resolved. Anyone with a search warrant ... put their carry-ons through the x-ray conveyor, make them walk through the nazi-stand magnetometer. If they "alarm"? put them in the porno-scan or give them the pat-down. Heck. give them a strip-search if you like. You've got a search warrant based on Probable Cause; you can do it. LEGALLY
Anyone withOUT a search warrant? "Good afternoon, ma'am ... boarding pass and ID please? Where are you going today? ... Oh, seeing family? ... It's lovely there this time of year. Have a nice flight." The vast majority of people would get this treatment, and thus harbor no grudges against TSA, and airflight security would actually be effective.
You see, anonymous, no one - let me repeat that for you since you obviously have trouble understanding it - NO ONE thinks there should be "no security". Most people, however, understand that what TSA does is not security.
It is, instead, raging paranoia and tyranny in the name of defending us from tyranny.
rwilymz
http://dblyelloline.blogspot.com/
In response to:
"So here's an option for your FAMILY and their next airplance ride. You can choose for them ( father, mother, sister, brother, infant, grandparent anyone you LOVE and hold dear to your heart...
1. Option # 1 your loved ones flight will have TSA screen the passengers and property
2. Option # 2 the airlines will allow absolutley anyone on the flight, no screening, no checking their bags, no ID checks for known terrorists, no dogs sniffing for expolsive materials, the pasengers can bring on any items they want, bats, knives, guns, drugs and don't forget all of these passengers are served alcohol this of course can only help the situation once they are up in the air, oh and TSA will not be providing federal air marshalls either...OK now think about your loved ones again and tell me which option you would choose for them..."
I would choose that my loved ones not be forced to submit to a sexually explicit search to protect them from the tiny chance that one of the people on the plane might be a terrorist.
As I stated before, I will gladly allow my loved ones to get in a car, go to the mall, or do any other daily activity with strangers that have not been searched.
As a side note, your option 2 is commical. First because you are stating that our only choice is "whole body imaging" and "enhanced patdown" or no security at all.
I will also ask you a question. Do you allow your loved ones to go to a movie theatre where the theatre owner will allow absolutley anyone in to the theatre, no screening, no checking their bags, no ID checks for known terrorists, no dogs sniffing for expolsive materials, the movie patrons can bring in any items they want, bats, knives, guns, drugs and don't forget all of these passengers are served alcohol. This of course can only help the situation once the previews have finished, oh and the local law enforcement will not be providing an armed LEO either.
Your irational fear of airplanes is not just cause to conduct searches of innocent citizens.
Not Scared of Terrorists
"I have chosen to always treat them the way I would want to be treated and have gotten nothing but respect and a smile in return."
You WANT to be forced to drop your pants under penalty of losing something of value?
Anonymous said...
" 1. Option # 1 your loved ones flight will have TSA screen the passengers and property
2. Option # 2 the airlines will allow absolutley anyone on the flight, no screening, no checking their bags, no ID checks for known terrorists, no dogs sniffing for expolsive materials, the pasengers can bring on any items they want, bats, knives, guns, ..."
This is a false choice - there are many other options than just the current TSA or nothing. Very few people want no security at all, we just want a more reasonable system based on actual evidence of effectiveness and a better analysis of cost versus benefits.
Interesting
matus - recetas faciles
It's funny how people keep introducing copies of policies that say "The TSA doesn't do that." But these reports are from the front lines where actual people actually do that, not the theories contained in ignored policy manuals.
Thank you, Bob. You've made an irrefutable case that whatever problems that might have occurred at JFK were entirely the passenger's fault.
Her first mistake was opting out of AIT, which we all should know by now is unnecessary. Not only is AIT perfectly safe, but it provides the utmost protection of passenger privacy.
Her second mistake was to misunderstand the resulting pat-down, thereby becoming inappropriately upset. The pat-down was obviously conducted conducted "in a manner that treats all passengers with dignity, respect and courtesy," since that's TSA policy. And we all know that each and every TSO is a highly trained, highly competent professional who is fastidious about consistently and correctly following policy. Anyone who claims they weren't trated with dignity, respect, and courtesy is obviously lying, since that's clearly impossible. But she nonetheless became inappropriately hysterical, and called it a "strip search." We all know the TSA never does that.
Even though the passenger bears complete responsibility for causing this incident, you nonetheless graciously apologized for making her feel (however unreasonably) that she had a bad screening experience. That's exactly the sort of commitment to high quality customer service that the TSA should be striving for at all times.
Thank you also, Bob, for showing us what we should learn from this experience. Rather than finding fault and becoming offended at screening measures that are always a necessary and effective response to the threat environment, we should be at all times cooperative and appreciative of the excellent work the TSOs are doing, every day at every checkpoint. I know it's difficult to change the attitudes of many selfish people who misunderstand the threat and fail to appreciate the TSA's vital mission. But going the extra mile to apologize for a misunderstanding, even when the passenger is clearly at fault, is a step in the right direction!
1. Option # 1 your loved ones flight will have TSA screen the passengers and property
2. Option # 2 the airlines will allow absolutley(sic) anyone on the flight, no screening, no checking their bags, no ID checks for known terrorists, no dogs sniffing for expolsive(sic) materials, the pasengers(sic) can bring on any items they want, bats, knives, guns, drugs and don't forget all of these passengers are served alcohol this of course can only help the situation once they are up in the air, oh and TSA will not be providing federal air marshalls(sic) either...OK now think about your loved ones again and tell me which option you would choose for them...
I think I'll take option 2 - just like when I get on a train, bus or a car, or when I go to the mall or other public place.
TSA is not keeping us safe. They are just fostering fascism.
If they had let CWP holders carry their weapons, 9/11 wouldn't have happened!
(PS - Learn to spell)
I am curious as to why the TSA was looking for a money belt after the debacle and public humiliation dealing with the Ron Paul Campaign member?? By the way how do you mistake a back brace for a money belt? How did you come to the conclusion it was a money belt?
Here is the article I am referencing...
http://reason.com/blog/2011/12/12/tsa-breaks-its-own-rules-removes-elderly?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+reason%2FHitandRun+%28Reason+Online+-+Hit+%26+Run+Blog%29
[[FEW YEARS AGO A MAN'S UNDERWEAR WENT OFF]]
Not quite. Close, but not quite.
[[MAY BE IF HE "WAS STRIPPED SEARCHED" AS EVERYONE CLAIMS TSA DOES WE WOULD NOT HAVE AN INCIDENT.]]
TSA does. Debating it is rather academic at this point.
More pertinent, however, is that if TSA would adopt one of the many behavioral/background profiling systems, they'd have the procedures in place to spot the difference between:
1] a foreign national with no coat traveling in the middle of winter; with no checked luggage receipt; with no carry-ons; with recent foreign travel to Yemen and Somalia; and
2] a garden-variety granny in a wheelchair
It is worth pointing out that #1 was the butt-bomber. It is further worth pointing out that every behavioral profiling system known would have pulled the guy out for nothing more than having no coat, no luggage, no carry-on, and his recent travel, and would have left the crippled granny alone.
It is ultimately worth pointing out that TSA's procedures [then and now] would have had no further involvement with #1 other than making him walk through a magnetometer, since the absence of luggage tells them nothing. Granny, on the other hand? Her wheelchair is "suspicious" enough to cause a second look, her medical devices are similarly suspicious enough to require private screening. TSA expends counter-productive time on virtually null-risk passengers and cannot figure out that traveling with no luggage from Africa, through Europe, to the US is in and of itself exceptionally suspicious.
[[BY THE WAY, THE UNABOMBER, HAD A PHD]]
So did the anthrax guy.
...both of whom, by the way, had very obvious behavioral traits that flagged official suspicion.
A PhD who doesn't work in his field but instead lives in a shack in the mountains? Another PhD who was already on the FBI's short-list of "persons of interest" for Anthrax mailings because of his associations? Both would have been flagged by any decently-involved background check of the flight manifest.
[[THEY COME IN ALL AGES AND BACKGROUND]]
Regardless the age, background, or other social criteria you may choose to irrelevantly bring up, they behave in rather predictable ways prior to arriving at the airport, and in the security line, both.
It's the drunks, the claustrophobics, the anxiety-disordered and the fear-of-flyings that don't behave predictably.
This may come as a surprise to you - and TSA - but many people do indeed know TSA's job better than they do. It may have something to do with TSA being run by career bureaucrats and being front-lined by ... there's no real polite way of saying ... undereducated autocrats.
rwilymz
http://dblyelloline.blogspot.com/
Care to comment on this?
http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/tsa-apologizes-elderly-women-strip-search-kennedy-airport-article-1.1007725?localLinksEnabled=false
In an about-face, the feds have admitted wrongdoing in the cases of two elderly women who say they were strip-searched at Kennedy Airport by overzealous screeners.
Federal officials had initially insisted that all “screening procedures were followed” after Ruth Sherman, 89, and Lenore Zimmerman, 85, went public with separate accounts of humiliating strip searches.
But in a letter obtained by the Daily News, the Homeland Security Department acknowledges that screeners violated standard practice in their treatment of the ailing octogenarians last November.
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