***Update: 5/27/2011 – Read this story in the Houston Chronicle for an update.***
What's our take on the Texas House of Representatives voting to ban the current TSA pat-down? Well, the Supremacy Clause of the U.S. Constitution (Article. VI. Clause 2) prevents states from regulating the federal government.
We wish we lived in a world where you could just walk on a plane with no security screening, but that just isn't the case unfortunately. Aviation security agencies worldwide have been using pat-downs long before TSA was created to prevent dangerous items from getting onto airplanes. The pat-down is a highly effective tool to resolve certain alarms and keep these dangerous items off of planes that could cause catastrophic damage. It's important to note that if a passenger (or bag) alarms during screening, our officers must resolve the alarm before allowing the passenger and their baggage on the airplane.
Here are some pat-down myths and facts:
Myth: Everyone who travels will receive a pat-down.
Fact: In fact, less than 3% of passengers receive pat-downs. Only passengers who alarm a walk through metal detector or AIT machine or opt out of the AIT receive a pat-down. In addition, some passengers may also receive a pat-down as part of our random, unpredictable security measures. In his testimony to a Senate subcommittee, Administrator Pistole said: "The bottom line is few people in the overall scheme of things will actually receive those pat downs. Now, we've heard some examples, and obviously, there's a vocal group out there who have experienced this for the first time, and, rightfully so, raising concerns, what's behind this. And the bottom line is we, the transportation security officers in particular, are trying to work in partnership with the traveling public to say we want to ensure that you are safe on this flight. Work with us in a partnership to provide the best possible security. And that's what it comes down to."
Myth: All children will receive pat-downs.
Fact: No. TSA officers are trained to work with parents to ensure a respectful screening process for the entire family, while providing the best possible security for all travelers. Children 12 years old and under who require extra screening will receive a modified pat down.
Myth: Complaints about the pat-downs are extremely high.
Fact: Only a small percentage of the traveling public receives a pat down as they travel through the security checkpoint. Between November 2010 and March 2011, TSA screened nearly 252 million people. In that same time period, we received 898 complaints from individuals who have experienced or witnessed a pat down. That's roughly 0.0004%.
Myth: Pat downs for certain individuals are limited to the head and neck.
Fact: No one is exempt. Everyone is subject to the same screening. TSA is sensitive to religious and cultural needs, but everyone must be screened effectively.
Blogger Bob
TSA Blog Team
If you’d like to comment on an unrelated topic you can do so in our Off Topic Comments post. You can also view our blog post archives or search our blog to find a related topic to comment in. If you have a travel related issue or question that needs an immediate answer, you can contact a Customer Support Manager at the airport you traveled, or will be traveling through by using Talk to TSA.
1,032 comments:
1 – 200 of 1032 Newer› Newest»Feel free to raise your number of complaints to 899.
If you're gonna plead the Supremacy Clause, then you have to abide by the enumerated powers. And you're not gonna wanna go there, cuz that would mean no federal role in aviation at all.
Nice take on states rights. Texas isn't trying to regulate the federal government , it's doing what all need to do which is keep te federal government from infringing on Constitutional rights and putting them back where they belong. The FACT is that TSA putdowns are a violation of our 4th amendment rights and criminal in their execution. I'm proud of my state for challenging the federal grab of the TSA. Most of you should be on a federal sexual predator list.
I'm also ashamed that my federal government would use the "everyone else was doing it first" argument as an excuse to violate our rights. Tell me, how many of those other countries have a constitution like ours?! NONE!! It's a petty, childish, and illogical argument.
About your "facts": 3% of Americans are having their 4th amendment rights violated for searches that have yielded NOTHING! Not a single thing. One child is too many if they don't set off a detector. Keep your hands off our future! Only a small percentage of us are sheepdogs, willing and able to stand up to the TSA and actually complain. The rest are Sherpa and have no problem with the Feds overstepping their constitutional limits.
See, I'm not even afraid to use my real name. You people don't scare us sheepdogs. We know who you work for. The American people. Not the other way around. TSA employees should be ashamed of violating our rights willfully!
The government has no role in the airlines operation...anymore than the .gov has any right to screen someone that is entering the mall. .gov has no Constitutional right to search anyone without a warrant. These are unreasonable searches and seizures and thank God for Texas. The TSA has never caught or stopped a ter'rist with these screenings.
I was wondering how long it would take for a response.
And, you still continue with the lies. For example you state complaints are low regarding the pat-downs. This is because of the threatening response always used by the TSA agent when encountering an irritated passenger "DO YOU WANT TO FLY TODAY". And you call this working with the public, sheesh.
It is no wonder the TSA has the distinction of being the most hated and despised agency in the United States with the IRS now in second.
Great work ladies and gentlemen.
Your propoganda is misleading... Just because people do not file complaints, it does not mean they are not there. I know a large number of people who refuse to fly at all because of your "screenings".
When we live life based on fear mongering, the terrorists have accomplished their goals.
On another more important note, the U.S. was founded on checks and balances. Where is the TSA's check or balance? All I see is an unchecked agency doing as it pleases (while giving large amounts of taxpayer money to corporations to which some TSA officials are tied).
Is this justice for the American people? Is subjecting a terrorized people to screenings and humiliating pat downs appropriate? When will the TSA be reigned in?
Sadly to everyone saying the government has no role in regulating aviation your arguments will be struck down thans to the (IMESHO) over broad powers the courts have granted the Federal government under the Interstate Commerce Clause.
And sadly I can see the courts siding with the Feds under that clause in this instance too. However it might be nice to have a TSO or two arrested to sort this out. That might have a chilling effect on the pat downs....
This is a country by the people for the people of the people. WE THE PEOPLE get to say when enough is enough. Neither the TSA, DHS, or the White house get to say they don't care if the public doesn't like the security procedures we are doing them anyway. If we the people say you have gone to far it is time to stop then you must stop. We WILL stop you from alienating our rights one way or another.
RE: low level of complaints. I get patted down every time I fly but don't bother to complain since I am certain that my complaint will be worthless.
I mean honestly even if 90% of the people being patted down complained don't you think the TSA response would be 'We are sorry but we need to continue the pat down as is to ensure the security of the American public when they fly".
You people are idiots. it is not a vio0lation of your 4th amendment right at all. Last I checked it isn't your right to fly, it's a privelage. And in order to use this privelage you are allowing them to do pat-downs every time you buy an airline ticket. If you don't like the idea of the patdowns then find a different way of transportation. But it is no way a violation of your right.
Has the TSA taken note of its public opinion? The American public LOATHES the TSA.
Also, I would like to know how the TSA can account for many of its former employees and its political backers reaping huge profits from scanner sales. That seems like a conflict of interest.
And yet more disinformation posted by the ultimate government propaganda mouthpiece.
Your 3% number rings hollow to those of us with metal body parts who have to get sexually assaulted EVERY SINGLE TIME WE FLY. Every time, Bob. Read that again: EVERY TIME. I cannot get on a plane without having a stranger touch my genitals, because I have metal rods and pins in my spine. Nor can my mother, who has a metal hip.
You also are using faulty logic, suggesting that we want to be able to get on a plane with NO security. That is NOT what we're calling for. We want APPROPRIATE security, that doesn't violate our dignity, our bodies, and our 4th Amendment rights.
Get rid of the outrageously expensive, potentially dangerous, privacy-violating nude-o-scopes. Stop wasting millions on ineffective, junk-science Behavior Detection Officers. Stop hiring uneducated low-level workers recruited from pizza-box ads, putting them in uniforms that give the false appearance of law-enforcement, and then giving them total dominion over our bodies and belongings while we're in a checkpoint.
Start using INTELLIGENT security techniques, not false security theater. And STOP THE ABUSE!
I fly weekly, TSA please keep doing the job you are doing. If Texas wants to ban pat downs then flying to/from Texas should be banned.
Blogger Bob -- good luck with that. The Texas ban on indecent behavior does not attempt to regulate the federal government, it regulates an individual's behavior against another. Individuals that are acting within their positions, even if they are law enforcement (which the TSA is NOT) are not immune from prosecution if it is found that those actions violated Constitutional protections. Go look up Bivens.
I like how you list total number of people screened, and number of patdown complaints... but not a number of patdowns. I applaud your ability to lie with statistics.
You also don't take into account the there is a (justified by recent discoveries) fear that the TSA will actively retaliate against travellers who complain.
TLDR: Blogger Bob is lying through his teeth.
Texas: Apparently the only state with common sense!
I suppose six year olds and babies are a threat to national security.
Hey TSA, have you ever discovered or prevented a legit terrorist threat (baby poop, kids, and grannies don't count)? Let me answer that for ya. Nope!
So its just a small number of people huh Bob?
That is why it passed 138-0 in the Texas House vote right?
Not to mention the 37-0 vote that Alaska just had against the procedures.
I could go on about the Senators and the members of the US house that have either put bills forward to reduce funding for new machines or to limit/reduce the use of these machines & pat downs.
If it truly is just as small as a number of unhappy people as you state then why all the attention?
I would go on about all the lies that you posted in your Myth: Fact: column but honestly you guys won't respond so whats the point.
You have no wish to create an open dialog with travelers. Your only goal is to spread your propaganda and spin the all the negative heat that is coming toward TSA as best as you can.
Boy am I glad the you guys aren't in charge of airport security. GET A CLUE!!!
The only think I like about Texas is their toast.
Keep up the good work TSA!
So, what if I don't want to fly with anyone from Texas because they could have a bomb on them? They're going to kick said people off because it makes me feel uncomfortable and I don't want to die, correct?
Any pat down conducted by TSA that includes touching, rubbing, feeling, or any contact in any manner with the genitals exceeds any reasonable standards.
Any pat down as described above (and has actually been caught on video) of a child should result in a jail sentence for the person doing the pat down.
Use of Virtual Strip Search Machines goes to far and should never be used unless cause can be presented.
If the threat of a terrorist act is so great then show us those facts, otherwise get your fricking hands off of us!
For those of us who live in Texas and find the antics of our less than illustrious elected officials not only tiresome but also troubling -- we cannot help but apologize to sane people everywhere for the idiots that seem to keep be elected to office -- sadly, it is still a "good ole boys" system down here despite efforts of those like me who are seeking to elect sane, qualified, intelligent, and rational officials -- the problem is that we are too few in numbers....
You do all know that it isn't TSA who mandates the patdowns, but our very own congressmen and women and the president, right? It's pointless to blame TSA when everything they do and don't do is mandated to them by the higher ups, by higher ups you voted into office.
Texas is trying to do something about it. I would suggest writing to your congressman and encouraging others to do so rather than blame TSA for everything when all they're doing is doing what your elected officials tell them to.
I see JoshD and a few others have been drinking the TSA's propaganda punch... Last I checked, we DO have a right to fly. We have the right to transportation, and flying is incorporated in that. Also, don't forget that other public transportation is being targeted for these types of searches. Are you going to tell us that we don't have the right to travel by rail or bus, either? Does that mean everyone who can't afford to keep a car gives up their rights when they use public transport? ...Because it's a "privilege"? So buy a bike or walk? I don't think that will "fly."
Count me as #900.
Lots of TSA kool-aid drinkers in this thread.
Maybe if it was your grandparents or young children that were having their pants reached into by TSA officials you would care.
In fact I bet most of these "anything for security" people don't even fly more than once or twice a year.
We all drink the Kool-aid. We just each have our own flavor. My flavor is better than your flavor. Your flavor sucks. That's usually how it goes.
I have lost count of the number of times I have asked the question ( and the number of times you have not bothered to answer Blogger Bob ): how are medical/cosmetic implants beneath the skin resolved if they alarm AIT? A pat-down could not possibly resolve these.
Will I finally get an answer to this perfectly reasonable and worrying question? Passengers who are concerned about this issue have a right to know the answer.
Have any of you read ATSA? TSA didn't create ATSA. TSA was created by ATSA and is mandated to abide by ATSA. You are all focusing your hate on the wrong people. Look under the dome.
It is always entertaining to read RB's posts. Entertaining like an outdoor Celine Dion concert in 100 degree temperatures.
This is stupid. You can't completely lie about the Constitution in your blog.
Way to set an example... psh.
Anonymous said...I have lost count of the number of times I have asked the question ( and the number of times you have not bothered to answer Blogger Bob ): how are medical/cosmetic implants beneath the skin resolved if they alarm AIT? A pat-down could not possibly resolve these. May 14, 2011 2:57 PM
------------------------
While I would love to answer this one, I'm not able to get into procedures such as this one. I know what I'm about to say is akin to a shaking up a hornet nest around here, but this is Sensitive Security Information (SSI)that I'm not able to discuss.
Thanks,
Blogger Bob
TSA Blog Team
"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people." -10th Amendment of the US Constitution.
I wouldn't want to be the federal lawyer that has to go to court to justify the actions of a federal agency that violates the federal constitution upon its own whim and whimsy and base it on the Supremacy Clause of that same document. Using your logic, the federal government's agents should be allowed to rape, murder and plunder in the states at their say so.
I don't believe the law is passed yet in Texas, but I hope is does. We need to return to a country of laws, not of men.
As far as the number of complaints go, the denial of liberty to one person is the denial to all.
Right or wrong, TSA officers are now perceived by many Americans as deviants not to be trusted. Statedly simply, the DHS and TSA leadership have created a public relations disaster with a large percentage of Americans that will not easily be repaired. It's even more pathetic that the DHS and TSA leadership believe there are minimal complaints coming from average Americans.
I have a solution instead of a complaint.
Get rid of all of the screening.
Let the passengers bring whatever they want on the plane.If anybody acts crazy on board, let the air marshals take care of business.
Whatever happens after that, happens.
The strongest man survives and the weakest will fall.
Problem solved.
This is an absurd statement and represents at best a complete misunderstanding of the Constitution and the Supremacy Clause; at worst it represents an actionable infringement on the Constitutional Rights of every single American who travels by air.
"This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding."
It's. Right. There.
If a State makes a Law, the State Law overrides the Federal Law in that State. That's what the Constitution says.
The Federal Government gets its power from the people, not the other way around. We entered into this Union by choice and not by force.
It's amazing what happens to people's sense of reality when you give them a little power.
"Well, the Supremacy Clause of the U.S. Constitution (Article. VI. Clause 2) prevents states from regulating the federal government"
To put it most charitably, TSA is the PerpeTraitor (sp sic) of terminological inexactitude.
To say they're lying may be less charitable, may even be less accurate... for all we know this could be a TSA Blogger counting scalps from the nefarious and illegal activities of TSA patters and downers and mass-xray fiends.
She is doing her lord and master no good deed for such willful and gross misrepresentation of Constitutional Law which (Barack's contrarian brazenness notwithstanding) is still Supreme in recognition of the Will of We the People.
End of Sermon
(Print it if you dare.....)
Thank you Blogger Bob for at least replying (if not fully answering) to my question of how medical/cosmetic implants beneath the skin are resolved if they alarm AIT ( the January 2011 AIT PIA states clearly that such implants MAY alarm AIT as an 'anomaly'). You state that you cannot answer this because it is SSI. OK, to be fair I can partly understand this, but then why are passengers not fully forewarned (signage)at airport security that medical/cosmetic implants beneath the skin MAY alarm AIT (body scanners)? Surely this would be a fair and sensible compromise (security/privacy)which would allow passengers to make a fully INFORMED choice of whether they wish to use a body scanner OR a metal detector/pat-down. From a human rights point of view it simply cannot be acceptable to have innocent and law-abiding passengers undergo highly degrading and personal searches if AIT discover their medical/cosmetic implants because they have NOT been fully informed that this may happen.
There must be a reasonable compromise situation on this issue that can satisfy both security and privacy.
Can you imagine the relief the passengers and pilots and airline attendants must feel knowing that the TSA is doing so much to prevent danger from getting onto the plane? What effect does it have on their tendency to pay attention to possible danger? To watch for suspicious behavior, or even to pay enough attention to notice debris in the walkway that might trip someone?
I'll tell you. If TSA has any effect, it is to deaden the senses, thereby weakening the flying population. It's an example of "crutch atrophy".
Oh, and your take on the Supremacy Clause is nuts. It suggests that the Constitution supports ALL the tyranny it was meant to prevent. Don't you see that?
The REAL reason for this blantant-in-ya-face-and-up-ya-khyber TSA airport screening industry is President Homeland Chertoff forcing We the People into letting Him get away (so far) with installing grossly over-priced electronic screening machines in which He has yet to declare His Almighty dollar interest.
Patting erogenous zones is merely obscene front-of-house advertising for Michael's fat, if not grossly-obese, cash cow
The 10th Amendment allows the states to nullify federal mandates. End of story. Sorry TSA, you lose.
The Supremacy clause only counts if federal law is consistent with the Constitution -- Read the 4th Amendment and try to explain your unlawful searches in light of that.
Texas is PROTECTING its citizens' CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS from a runaway Federal Govt. that no longer seems to care that we have a Constitution.
BY THE WAY -- THE SOVEREIGN STATES CREATED THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT -- BY DEFINITION THE CREATION IS SUBJECT TO THE CREATOR, NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND
everyone get a grip, again take into account every comment posted on this blog including ones made hourly/daily by the regulars and you have a fraction of air travelers that fly in one DAY in YEARS of the blog. lets get a real sense of many people are worried about this. and stop with the whole we are forced to be quiet "stuff". are your rights more important than you traveling? if your rights are so important to you then stand up for them and stop flying and stand up for yourself! quit coming on here and typing and lets see some action. its easy to type than it is to actually show what you support. if the tsa is so evil then put up or shut up or should i say stop typing. even if you have to fly for your job im sure that your rights are more important than your job correct?
Anonymous said...
Right or wrong, TSA officers are now perceived by many Americans as deviants not to be trusted. Statedly simply, the DHS and TSA leadership have created a public relations disaster with a large percentage of Americans that will not easily be repaired. It's even more pathetic that the DHS and TSA leadership believe there are minimal complaints coming from average Americans.
May 14, 2011 4:32 PM
..............
Perceived?
With the near weekly new report of some TSA employee engaged in some type of illegal behavior I think it is much more than perceived.
TSA and its employees are reaping what they have sown.
Enjoy TSA.
Well, I suppose this is what I would categorize as a "good" blog entry.
However, the Texas House of Representatives is not trying to ban the pat down. After all, we have read and heard it said that the patdown does not touch genitalia. If this is true, then this law shouldn't affect the TSA except where screeners are poorly trained.
What's up with all the anonymous comments? You all complain that the TSA is lying and that more people are frustrated, but refuse to prove it with you names. Come on, America! Nothing will change if we lurk in the shadows. The TSA can't hurt us! We are the majority. We are Americans. Speak up and be heard and let them know we're real people. Sheesh!
And for the record, my phone auto-corrected "sheep" to "Sherpa" for some reason on my previous comment.
Blogger Bob wrote: "Fact: [...] Only passengers who alarm a walk through metal detector or AIT machine or opt out of the AIT receive a pat-down."
Not true -- at least not in practice. I didn't alarm through the metal detector flying out of LAS less than 3 weeks ago and was still selected for a pat-down.
Blogger Bob also wrote: "Myth: Pat downs for certain individuals are limited to the head and neck. Fact: No one is exempt."
SIMPLY NOT TRUE.
For example, certain members of Congress and Cabinet secretaries who might be traveling commercial with their own security detail are exempt from screening.
You can argue -- even argue effectively -- that not screening those individuals is both acceptable and reasonable.
But you CANNOT argue that there are exemptions and that there are people who can fly commercial without having to go through security. Because it's a FACT that there are people who are EXEMPT.
"This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof; and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the land; and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby, anything in the constitution or laws of any state to the contrary notwithstanding."
That is the full quote; the TSA seem inordinately fond of cherry-picking quotations when it suits their purposes.
You forgot the most important myth
Myth: TSA patdowns (aka groping) contribute to the safety or security of the passengers on board.
Fact: Each and every person groped has has had their security eliminated. Each and every American lost all their security and safety the moment the TSA started this program.
http://www.tenthamendmentcenter.com/2010/03/29/whos-supreme-the-supremacy-clause-smackdown/
'Nuff said..
http://www.tenthamendmentcenter.com/2011/05/14/in-public-statement-tsa-lies-about-the-constitution/
Article VI, Clause 2 only affirms the position of the State of Texas. If the federal government creates a law that is unconstitutional, no State is required to implement it. Hopefully, Texas will lead the way for every State to begin the process of nullifying unconstitutional regulations and departments. This is the only way the federal government can be brought back into compliance with the Constitution.
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized"
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."
I applaud the Texas legislature for at least sending a message that travelers are fed up with TSA violating their rights without cause! Too bad TSA isn't paying attention.
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety" said Benjamin Franklin. If Ben were to see the American government today, he would be truly ashamed.
FACT: According to TSA personnel in Indianapolis, the only people who "opt-out" are simply "trying to hide something".
FACT: Being told "I guess you don't want to fly today" IS an economic threat.
OPINION: Your actions and tactics which have now become "fodder" for advertising (note AT&T commercial) should clue you into the fact the general public can relate to what your version of "Security Theater" really is...
"In public statement, TSA lies about the Constitution"
http://www.tenthamendmentcenter.com/2011/05/14/in-public-statement-tsa-lies-about-the-constitution/
"This time, the TSA is on the defensive, and published an official statement about the Texas bill on their blog:
What’s our take on the Texas House of Representatives voting to ban the current TSA pat-down? Well, the Supremacy Clause of the U.S. Constitution (Article. VI. Clause 2) prevents states from regulating the federal government.
The problem here? The statement is false. Ignorance from the TSA is unlikely, so I’ll call a spade a spade. They’re lying.
The supremacy clause says nothing of the sort. Here’s the full text:"
No, no , no, NO. The Fourth Amendment is clear. Enhanced patdowns, the search of carry on luggage, and the use of millimeter wave scans is unconstitutional. The TSA is violating the law of the land, and their actions and attitudes is Un-American at best, criminal in the least.
Texas is the first to stand up to respect and withhold the law. I pray it won't be the last.
"When the federal government violates your rights by refusing to abide by the limits put on it in the constitution, it’s your state’s duty to stand up and do it instead.
The verdict? Texas is in the right, and more states should join in now. The TSA…not even close."
http://www.tenthamendmentcenter.com/2011/05/14/in-public-statement-tsa-lies-about-the-constitution/
You lean on the supremacy clause? From the "supremacy clause," Article VI, Clause 2: This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof... shall be the supreme Law of the Land. In other words, the laws are only supreme if made in pursuance of (i.e., in agreement with) the Constitution. According to the Tenth Amendment (that is part of the Constitution, "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people." The powers you claim via the laws establishing TSA authority are NOT delegated to the federal government by the Constitution.
How many terrorists have you caught? zero.
Wow...just wow.
How hypocritical is it to invoke the constitution when it is your disregard of the 4th amendment that has caused this action to be taken. If the TSA had any respect for the constitution then they would respect it all and not just pick and choose which parts they want to utilize.
The State of Texas isn't regulating the federal government. The Fourth Amendment to the US Constitution is the regulation that applies. It says quite clearly that unreasonable searches are prohibited and that searches require probable cause. This bill says the State of Texas would protect individuals if the TSA should try to violate their constitutional rights.
"We wish we lived in a world where you could just walk on a plane with no security screening, but that just isn't the case unfortunately..." because roughly 3,000 people have been killed in the last decade or so in a terrorist attack.
We wish we lived in a world where you could just get in a car without blowing into an interlock, but that just isn't the case unfortunately because roughly 150,000 people in the last decade or so have been killed in drunk driving accident.
We wish we lived in a world where you could walk out your door without being strip-searched, but that just isn't the case unfortunately because roughly 150,000 people have been murdered in the last decade, many with weapons.
We wish that we lived in a world where you could take a bath without a state-mandated life guard but that just isn't the case unfortunately because roughly 3,000 people have drowned in their bath tub in the last decade or so.
Wake up-- we live in a world with risks.
All I can say is you are attempting to data spin. As a PhD. I can call you on quite a bit of what you have stated. Lets start with the first one:
In that same time period, we received 898 complaints from individuals who have experienced or witnessed a pat down. That's roughly 0.0004%.
I have tried complaining many times from the Mayors office to the airport to the TSA etc. For over a month I was given the runaround after going through a full body scanner and getting a full body pat down which they said showed two irregularities: a money belt and my passport/boarding pass. Then I was asked how much money I was carrying in my money belt and I told them it was none of their business....I was flying from Cleveland to NYC. That is when they demanded all of my credentials, harassed me, and called the police. The police showed up and when the TSA asked them to run me through the system they said no, that I had done nothing wrong. Since when is it a requirement to disclose the amount of cash one is carrying on domestic flights? Even on international flights...that is not the job of the TSA. If they wanted to call Immigration and Customs in Cleveland then they could have but they would have said the same thing....I was going to NYC. Just a side note, what does the amount of money I was carrying (500US at the time) have to do with transportation safety? Even I as a professor can make many connections between disparate entities but this one has me stumped beyond belief.
The second point is in regards to the number of complaints. According to the press by the TSA, if you now complain you will be looked at closer thus people are clamming up in terms of complaining about their civil liberties being trampled on. So, when you say only a certain percentage of complaints are recorded, that may be truthful but you need to add the likely reasons behind them being so low: the inability to file a complaint as well as the problems filing a complaint can cause the traveler.
I really like your interpretation of the Constitution there. Though I'd like you to cite where the Constitution provides for federal involvement in aviation. Oops! Guess it's not there. Bummer.
By the way, you might want to check out the 4th Amendment while you're searching the Constitution for justification of your agency's very existence. That pretty much covers it.
Consider this a complaint.
In other words, DON'T TREAD ON ME.
Supremacy Clause says:
"This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof; and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the land; and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby, anything in the constitution or laws of any state to the contrary notwithstanding."
The TSA does not operate in accord with either our Constitution for the United States and Bill of Rights and nor the Laws of the United States in pursuance thereof and so cannot appeal to the supremacy clause for its authority.
Therefore TSA can be nullified by the several sovereign States within their jurisdiction in order to protect its Citizens from TSA's unconstitutional and lawless activity.
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."
On the subject of the 4th amendment, some people would say that a citizen of the united states does not have a constitutional right to fly therefor a TSA search is voluntary ex. don't submit to search don't fly. I say this concept it bogus in that in this day in age we have a right to transport ourselves as it has become a necessity. There for we have a right to drive, fly, ride, just as we have a right to walk. To support my argument, when was the last time you walked over the hill and through the woods to get to work or grannies house. I have the right to fly without a shakedown by TSA. Humiliating passengers does not equate to security. We have ample technology to provide security to the flying public, in fact I expect to be secure on an airplane without being humiliated by TSA. Our 4th amendment rights are being violated. Here is another case. IF a TSA agent searches you under the premise of safety, will he not arrest if he finds contraband such as a joint. The answer is he will arrest for anything he can arrest for as long as he finds it incidental to his duties as a TSA officer. There are some real 4th amendment issues in this subject. I hope the Texas Rangers report to the nearest airport and arrest the first violator they find.
You sure have a lot of complaints here.... You sure about your facts?
You are way off about the "Supremacy clause" of the Constitution. The Constitution is the supreme law of the land, it gives the federal legislature certain powers, they can eneact law to enforce those powers. Those laws would supersede a contradicting state constitutional clause or law. But there is nothing in the Constitution about the federal government securing forms of travel, that would be a state issue and any federal law would be superseded by the state law via the 10th amendment. You just might find some coworkers being arrested by Texas police officers.
Do we who go out there and live life with vigor and vitality have any say?
I go out and live life fearlessly and daily do what's needed with no concern over what might happen (no frets over the unknown).
I and those like me claim the right to tell the fearful frighted little people to go back home and lock yourselves in.
If you can't deal with life, there are a few solutions:
- GROW UP.
- GET OVER IT.
- GO HIDE.
I'm tired of your fear dictating how I live.
I don't want to be around frightened little people anymore including you politicians, go hide!
TSA needs to close its doors and let us get back to living and traveling.
If you live fearfully it only shows your trust is incorrectly placed.
TSA should be commended for providing 100% security and the complete elimination of risk while flying.
I know one thing for sure. Once I'm in the sterile area nothing bad will happen.
And for that, allowing TSA agent to touch my genitals or examine me nude with a 100% safe x-ray machine is perfectly safe.
And if touching my kids genitals is required to keep them 100% safe, well thats a price that I'm willing for them to pay.
Anything for security I say.
And we know that X-rays are 100% safe because they are used in hospitals everyday by doctors.
Keep up the good work TSA.
Blogger Bob wrote: "Fact: [...] Only passengers who alarm a walk through metal detector or AIT machine or opt out of the AIT receive a pat-down."
If this is true, why did I get pulled at the gate as I was boarding a plane out of Oakland International Airport in California? It was humiliating being pulled aside and patted down while four other TSA people watched and the other passengers of the flight walked past me to get on the plane. Explain that one... or is that SSI?
Blogger Bob said...
Anonymous said...I have lost count of the number of times I have asked the question ( and the number of times you have not bothered to answer Blogger Bob ): how are medical/cosmetic implants beneath the skin resolved if they alarm AIT? A pat-down could not possibly resolve these. May 14, 2011 2:57 PM
------------------------
While I would love to answer this one, I'm not able to get into procedures such as this one. I know what I'm about to say is akin to a shaking up a hornet nest around here, but this is Sensitive Security Information (SSI)that I'm not able to discuss.
Thanks,
Blogger Bob
TSA Blog Team
May 14, 2011 4:12 PM
Let's suppose for a minute that a private citizen posted a description of how an alarm was resolved. Would you post that description? Would you provide any commentary about whether the described resolution was appropriate.
The lies about the constitution in this blog post make me sad to be a citizen of this country.
There are several other states waiting in the wings to pass legislation similar to that which is going through the Texas state legislature.
What you gonna do, Bob, when 7, 8, 9, 10 states do that?
This thread confirms that the TSA is well and truly concerned that the revolt of the citizens against it's tyranny has begun.
screenshot kept
You can raise the number of complaints by one. TSA agents in general are eager for power and happy to use it. They know that most people won't complain because they are afraid to be rejected to fly. The stories out there of people kept waiting till they missed their flight for trying to complain are all over the web. I guess that's quite an effective way to lower the number of complaints, isn't it?
Time for all states to do their duty and stop the TSA from misuse of power. Exactly for this reason the states can stop the federal government.
Your complaint rate is low because your agency intimidates people into complying and retaliates against those who do stand up for their rights. You are LYING about the Constitution, and you are taking our rights away from us. You are not a solution - you are a problem. You are a cause for revolution. You bring shame upon us all, and you should be dissolved.
"Well, the Supremacy Clause of the U.S. Constitution prevents states from regulating the federal government."
No. It doesn't. The Supremacy Clause establishes the Constitution and laws made in pursuance to the Constitution as the supreme law of the land.
It does not prevent states from nullifying unconstitutional laws or interposing state authority between those unconstitutional usurpations of power by the federal government and the people of the state.
The TSA searches at airports violate the protections granted all citizens of the United States by the fourth amendment against unreasonable search and seizures. A search is unreasonable without probable cause. My presence in an air terminal or my desire to board a commercial aircraft does not constitute probable cause for an invasive search of my person, neither by individuals or by electronic means.
The Constitution wasn't written to empower federal authority, it was written to limit it.
The Constitution is a covenant between sovereign states that delegates certain enumerated, defined powers to a federal government; not a total submission to a federal authority with sweeping power to decide its own limits. It is not only within the authority of a State to negate unconstitutional federal regulation, it is its sacred responsibility to do so.
Bravo to Texas. Now I must petition my own State Assembly to demand that they do the same!
Go Texas! Bring some sanity back to our airports. The TSA does absolutely *nothing* to improve our personal safety. Our odds of being killed by a terrorist are exactly the same with the TSA or without it.
JoshD said..."You people are idiots. it is not a vio0lation[sic] of your 4th amendment right at all. Last I checked it isn't your right to fly"
I can't agree with your statement, JoshD. The Tenth Amendment to the constitution reserves any rights not expressly given to the United States to the States or to the People. I have the right to fly as much as you have the right to make ludicrous statements on the internet.
George Washington once said, "Government is not reason; it is not eloquence. It is force. And force, like fire, is a dangerous servant and a fearful master." You would be wise to think a little longer before you give up your rights so quickly.
This is rich BB, just rich. If you had any sense of the constitution whatsoever you'd quit your job on the spot in disgust for what you are doing to your country. I hope one day you are so ashamed that you wouldn't even admit to your closest friends that you ever worked for this illegal operation.
How does your argument make even any sense Bob? Because the federal government is doing something, it automatically makes it legal? Does that ring true to you? The states have an important role in checking federal government power, there is nothing in the constitution that specifically authorizes the federal government to regulate air travel, therefore it is a state's responsibility.
You really should be ashamed of yourself for even writing such garbage.
A State can define sexual assault any way it wants. And being a government official does not exempt an individual from sexual assault laws. See IMF.
I don't want to be patted down. I was told all my life ( I'm only 16 ) That no one can touch me inappropriately. Why is the TSA exempt from that rule? Also, as I learned in my history class, it's not the federal governments job to regulate the people. It's the people's job to regulate the federal government! That's why are constitution was created! Goodness, I'm getting very angry.
Israel has more enemies than we do, more threats than we do and yet they respect the people more than the TSA does. And how do they do this - Profiling. It works and it makes sense. They give the most attention to those most likely to be a problem and lets the rest of the people go on with their lives.
Also the Constitution which you bring up has this pesky little 4th amendment that is supposed to keep the government from unreasonable searches. Perhaps next time you decide to quote a document you read the whole thing and not just a part that you can try to stretch to cover your perversions of the founding document.
Finally let me say go Texas. At least there is one state with the backbone to stand up to the Fed.
Aviation security agencies worldwide have been using pat-downs long before TSA was created to prevent dangerous items from getting onto airplanes.
Liar!
As a Texan I salute our legislators for attempting to reign in the TSA's blatant over-reaching violation of our fourth amendments rights. If there is probably cause go ahead and search and pat down, fine. However, simply wanting to travel via a privately owned airplane from one point to another is not probable cause. There's no way around that.
In reading your story about the Supremacy Clause, there is something you overlooked. Texas can pass legislation regarding behavior at state & municipal-owned airports. Remember, airports are NOT federal property. Therefore the Supremacy clause is easily challenged. You are inferring that the Fed Govt is free to do anything they want & travelers MUST tolerate the behavior which is illegal by state law. You are wrong. Whatever not listed in the Constitution is the pervue of the state...
Regarding the complaint level, I have seen that they often try to not accept complaints, soo... those numbers aren't accurate.
Here is the Supremacy Clause:
"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."
It is here to read, over and over and over until you have it memorized.
"Well, the Supremacy Clause of the U.S. Constitution (Article. VI. Clause 2) prevents states from regulating the federal government."
Looks different to me:
Clause 2: This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding.
Please show me the federal law which Texas is abrogating. Last I checked, federal law is the responsibility or Congress, not some executive branch bureaucracy.
I have stopped flying due to the TSA and its unlawful searches. Just because I walk into an airport shouldn't mean that I give up being an American. Raise your count of complaints by one more.
I also have avoided flying. Every time I fly I feel like I'm being exposed physically in body and exposed to harmful cumulative radiation. For someone who has gone through a number of CT scans in life worrying about further exposure is no small thing. Plus it just feels so offensive for a law abiding citizen to have to go through such offensive scrutiny when criminals and drug dealers on the street get more rights and privacy. I just make more time to take other travel options.
Actually the Tenth Amendment allows States to regulate themselves when their is no constitutional provision stating it is a Federal Power. The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.
Is this a joke?? Is this seriously the way the TSA views itself, as a constitutionally lawful entity? There's one BIG problem - the supremacy clause applies to the constitution or federal statutes made "in pursuance thereof". Pat-downs are only one in a list of unconstitutional regulations given to us by the TSA.
Kudos to Texas and Texans. Let's go Arizona.
Absolutely the interrogations lawful Americans go through traveling in their own country (regardless of whether it's by air, rail, water or road) are a violation of the 4th Amendment.
Government officials (in this case TSA employees) have no right to snoop through your luggage or clothes without probable cause and a signed search warrant. Yet for years and with increasing vigor they do just that. Grandma has to surrender her Slurpee. Your 4 year old needs to take off her flip flops to show she's not a fanatical shoe bomber. Insane.
You people defending the TSA, take five minutes from your rants, find a copy of the US Constitution, and read the Bill of Rights section of it. You'll find it flat out contradicts what the TSA does and expects. You've been shills.
Hooray for the 10th Amendment to the Constitution! I am very proud of our founders for having the forsight to see that one day the Federal Government would get too big and that the states would need to re-take their rights. The Federal Government needs to back off and let the states regulate airline security.
Quote: "This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding."
What CONGRESSIONAL LAW are you quoting to empower TSA's violation of our 4th? There is no supremacy of any law issued by congress that violates Texas law. The TSA has misused the constitution to empower themselves over the rights of its people.
Flying on an aircraft is a contract with the private carriers, not the government. If they want to provide private security of the transportation of goods and services, then we are subject to that search by contract. The Feds cannot search a citizen based on a private contract with a private company for rendered goods or services.
If this is not a reasonable interpretation of the constitution, then feel free to comment.
Please cite the federal law - duly passed by the House and Senate -allowing enhanced pat-downs. The Supremacy Clause applies to laws, not to bureaucratic regulation. I can't wait for the first TSA agent to be arrested in Texas.
You know what will happen right? TSA will continue doing business and then someone will enact the law and have an agent arrested for groping them. Courts will ultimately decide this.
However with the way things are going nowadays, I wouldn't be surprise if the Supreme Court sided with the TSA for reason of National Security. At that point it would take a Federal law to actually stop this. But I doubt that too.
Random Pat Downs are needless, harmful, PC run amok, and a complete joke.
In regard to the Constitutional issue; the State of Texas is in the right. Unwarranted searches are in violation of the 4th amendment and not covered by the powers listed in the Constitution. In fact, just so we are clear, the Bill of Rights is actually a bill of prohibition about what the Federal government CANNOT do to individuals.
Oh, and I've been patted down as part of a 'random' check.
You know, as a white Christian male with no background record I SO FIT the profile of those that have been doing terrorists attacks in the last decade!! Get real guys.. TSA is a frakking joke!!
I am assuming the fact that I am traveling from Houston to El Paso means that the Commerce clause is no longer in effect so I should be exempt from any TSA involvment.
JoshD, the 4th Amendment and all the jurisprudence backing it requires that any search be reasonable. Blanket searches of entire groups of people w/o reasonable suspicion or probable cause are not permitted. It's the reason why the gov't can't simply go into every dwelling in a drug-infested neighborhood looking for drugs and weapons. You are also wrong to say that flying is merely a privilege. Under the 9th Amendment, we have a constitutionally-recognized right to travel, and flying is an essential mode of transportation today. TSA is impinging this right. And where do you get off saying that buying a ticket implies a consent to be felt up? That's a classic non sequitur.
Surprise...another lie by the TSA. I have seen pat downs first hand that did not meet the stated criteria. You people are reprehensible
The supremacy clause doesn't shield Fed employees against prosecution committing crimes in states. Otherwise, the Fed gov't could refuse to allow prosecution of a Fed employee for any crime that wasn't also a Fed crime.
So, false.
I'll restate what's been said:
1) TSA has no business existing as a federal agency - enumerated powers
2) A State is free to criminalize federal behavior when it constitutes morally deficient behavior. You don't get to play with my junk just because you say so.
Hog wash! The 10th Admendment says
all powers not delegated to the Fed are reserved to the States. Where is it that the Fed has been granted the right to molest us by anyone?
How about you read the 10th Amendment? The States and the People are not 'vassals' of the Fed Govt. The Fed Govt serves the States and The People!
Respectful pat-downs of children. Well if that is the case there are a LOT of faked videos out there of children being abused. Of course I am waiting to see the TSA claim they are fake.
The major problem with this whole argument, and most of this thread, is that TSA is not confined to airports. It's VIPR teams are spreading out to bus stations, train stations, truck weight stations, sporting events, even the Special Olympics.
people saying 'you dont have a right to fly' will be unable to argue that 'you dont have a right to travel'. clearly, we do have a right to travel - this is a fundamental human right that has only been breached during war time emergencies.
we cannot have an endless wartime emergency. it has taken 10 years to kill bin ladin; it took 5 years to defeat hitler. please explain to me how we will ever know when this 'war on terror' is over, because otherwise you are telling us that the concept of 'human rights' has ceased to exist and that we can have a never ending war where nobody has any rights because of the 'danger of terror'.
the only countries with perpetual states of emergency are dictatorships, like the stalinist soviet union or countless south american countries or middle east regimes.
the TSA has absolutely no right, whatsoever, to detain people wherever and whenever it feels like. thats why the head of Amtrak police recently banned them from Amtrak property.
Apparently the writer(s) of this have yet to read the 10th Amendment. I applaud the State of Texas for protecting its citizens from gross violations of the 4th Amendment. I had the privilege of having my genitals groped by a TSA Agent in the Denver Airport because I refused to radiate myself. -And a Denver Police Office (will law enforcement certification: POST) watched the entire process. Now if he had been the one performing that search I wonder how much trouble he would liable for! I duly sent out a formal letter and have received no response from my representatives.
When will the madness stop? Thank you Texas for leading the way. God Bless America.
As part of the traveling public I am not a fan of your pat downs or procedures. But I am willing to go through them because it is not just the rights of us traveling, if something happens to the flight that we are on, then what about the rights of those on the ground whose houses we may crash into, and the lives lost. I realize that your measures cover not just me but them also. I REALLY wish there was a better, less intrusive way, but we have to deal with reality also. To the TSA, I don't like a lot of your procedures, but I do support you in your mission, I hope there is a median that we can find.
I think TSA blog team would be a welcome cut in discretionary spending.
This blog is exhibit 1 for wasteful government spending.
The ninth and tenth Amendment to the Constitution, in the Bill of Rights, amended the supremacy clause - please go back to constitutional law 101.
Moreover, in any way you look at this the constitution never gave TSA the right of unreasonable search.
By the way - I work for Homeland Security.
If you want to invoke the Constitution, let's do it for both sides: the federal government crossed the "search and seizure" boundary long ago.
The TSA is purposely inflaming the public in order to offer a biometric national ID card as the solution. Just look at the public statements DHS and TSA officials about "trusted travelers" and getting beyond "cookie cutter" approach.
They created the problem, and now will offer a "solution". The biometric national ID card would be rejected out of hand before this power grab by the TSA. I'm afraid most people will accept getting a palm scan or retinal scan matched to a federal ID database just to avoid being groped. Don't fall for it. Enough is enough.
Perhaps the federal government needs to realize the supremacy clause only applies to areas where the federal government is granted authority under the Constitution. Airline security is NOT an enumerated power granted to the federal government by the Constitution and as such the supremacy clause is of no effect.
TSA conveniently forgets to mention the 10th amendment.
"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."
Not so blogger bob. The constitution in the Bill of Rights guarantees us the right from unwarranted search and seizure. This is the supreme law of the land. Thank goodness for Texas, I wish my own state had the nerve to do the same thing. If it takes all states rising up against this, then so be it. If the Congress will not rise up to the challenge they will find themselves without a job. The TSA has become more and more brazen in their approach and while little baby diapers are being checked for explosive poop, real terrorists are allowed to walk right on by.
Not so blogger bob. The Bill of Rights guarantees us the freedom from unwarranted search and seizure. Next time come up with something else to say because you obviously don't understand the Constitution. The TSA has become more and more brazen in its efforts to look for explosive poop in diapers and feeling up young women who happen to have a sweatshirt on. I wish all states would emulate Texas. And if Congress doesn't do something about it, I guarantee they will find themselves without a job.
The Declaration of Independence is quite clear that the purpose of our government is to secure the rights of the people. And the 4th Amendment is clear that people have a right to their privacy and that the government has no power to violate that right without a warrant issued by a court based on probable cause of criminal activity.
How doe the TSA feel about the 4th amendment?
I served my country, in part to protect these very same rights. Imagine how I feel about seeing people deprived of them.
Pat downs are fine but the TSA has overstepped their bounds with their new policy.
Yes you have the power to literally at gun point force this on us. You can't however force me to buy a ticket.
Low rate of complaints? Maybe people realize it's a waste of time to complain to a behemoth of an agency and simply vote with their feet like me. Or maybe they are concerned about the repercussions of getting on a TSA list of complainers.
I now refuse to fly and simply drive, despite the barrels of FF miles accumulated by my traveling spouse. I'll never use them. If more Americans would stop flying, the airlines might actually require you people to treat the citizens of this country with respect. The federal government is simply out of control.
Your quoting the Constitution has no real bearing on this since the TSA patdowns aren't a LAW. They're a procedure enacted by the TSA in order to (suuposedly) achieve the goal of airport and airline security. TSA has the legal authority to secure the airports, but HOW they do it is not a LAW.
Based on that information, the Texas LAW would be legal as it doesn't stop the TSA from doing their job; it only restricts HOW they can do their job in that state.
JoshD falls into the category of idiot he so tritely places others in. If he had done some simple research he would have found that American citizens DO have a RIGHT to fly. They don't have a right to fly on a particular carrier, or even commercially, but we do have a right to fly.
US Code Section 49, paragraph 40103 (Sovereignty and Public Right of Transit), section 2 starts off: (2) A citizen of the United States has a public right of transit through the navigable airspace. To further that right...
Notice the use of the word "right".
You have absolutely no grounds whatsoever to try to stand on the Supremacy Clause.
Here is the text:
"This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof; and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the land; and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby, anything in the constitution or laws of any state to the contrary notwithstanding."
Pay close attention to the first part
"This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof...."
The very first item that has 'supremacy',over even the Federal Government,is the Constitution.
Further:
“[I]t is said that the laws of the Union are to be the supreme law of the land… It will not, I presume, have escaped observation, that it expressly confines this supremacy to laws made pursuant to the Constitution…”-Alexander Hamilton Federalist Papers No.33
Question-
Where in the Constitution does it give the federal government the authority to establish a policing agency with the powers to ignore the 4th Amendment?
Answer-
Nowhere.
But apparently the actual limitation of the supremacy clause in granting the federal government 'supremacy'- the limitation that the federal government must obey the Constitution before it gets to claim any supremacy whatsoever,has entirely "escaped the observation" of people who want to claim and believe that the federal government can make any law it wants,regulate anything it wishes,and act as if it has no limitations whatsoever.
One last word-
"......that whensoever the general government assumes undelegated powers, its acts are unauthoritative, void, and of no force....."-Thomas Jefferson,Kentucky Resolutions of 1798
-Thomas Jefferson
The TSA is a typical government agency. One guy "working" and ten standing around watching. If I were creating a response to elevated terror threats to our transportation, I'd create a fifteen-person office responsible for educating travellers. Period. The paranoia the TSA generates and then profits from is reprehensible. I despise them and find the entire agency to be an egregious waste of taxpayer money. The TSA is by far the single worst legacy of W.
Searching travelers is worthless and doesn’t protect anyone. Terrorists have not taken over a plane since the cockpits were reinforced, so all TSA can do is prevent a terrorist from blowing up the plane. But why would the terrorist do that when he can kill just as many people – the same people – and disrupt airline traffic just as much, by exploding a bomb at the TSA checkpoint???
What does TSA do to prevent that? Nothing. If a bag or person triggers the scanner, shouldn’t the TSA yell “EVERYONE RUN THIS MIGHT BE A BOMB”? Instead they rip the bag open??? That’s insane. It could be rigged to explode.
If the terrorist is armed and the scanner alerts on him, why wouldn’t he just pull his weapon out and start killing right there? Why would he care whether he kills on the ground or in the air?
Solution: rotating checkpoints. At anytime, maybe 1 out of 10 checkpoints are in operation, but you never know which one. Maybe it rotates hourly. Passengers must enter through their assigned checkpoint. All travelers who buy last minute tickets have to be screened.
That solution would be just as effective as the current system, yet 90% of travelers would have no inconvenience. When you do have to go through a checkpoint, you accept that it wasn’t your lucky day and put up with the inconvenience.
The person running this blog clearly doesn't know what the Supremacy Clause means. The federal government is only supreme to the states with respect to the powers delegated by the states to the federal government in Article I Section VIII. Any federal law not made pursuant to the powers delegated by the states is void and of no force, regardless of what any branch of the federal government says. To paraphrase Jefferson, the government created by the Constitution is not the final judge of the extent of the powers delegated to itself since that would make it (the federal government), and not the Constitution, the measure of its powers.
This below post nailed it.
""Well, the Supremacy Clause of the U.S. Constitution prevents states from regulating the federal government."
No. It doesn't. The Supremacy Clause establishes the Constitution and laws made in pursuance to the Constitution as the supreme law of the land.
It does not prevent states from nullifying unconstitutional laws or interposing state authority between those unconstitutional usurpations of power by the federal government and the people of the state.
The TSA searches at airports violate the protections granted all citizens of the United States by the fourth amendment against unreasonable search and seizures. A search is unreasonable without probable cause. My presence in an air terminal or my desire to board a commercial aircraft does not constitute probable cause for an invasive search of my person, neither by individuals or by electronic means.
The Constitution wasn't written to empower federal authority, it was written to limit it.
The Constitution is a covenant between sovereign states that delegates certain enumerated, defined powers to a federal government; not a total submission to a federal authority with sweeping power to decide its own limits. It is not only within the authority of a State to negate unconstitutional federal regulation, it is its sacred responsibility to do so.
Bravo to Texas. Now I must petition my own State Assembly to demand that they do the same!"
We in Texas will honor the Supremacy Clause once you in the TSA start honoring the 4th Amendment.
Deal??
All it takes is an act of Congress and your supremacy clause argument is worthless. The executive branch is at the whimsy of the House and Senate in terms of laws. If the law prohibits a certain type of enforcement, such as pat downs bordering on molestation, then the TSA loses its ability to enforce in that regard.
Arrogant, haughty, and believing that you are self-righteous. Rome did that.
"I know a large number of people who refuse to fly at all because of your "screenings"."
We have stopped flying.
"Well, the Supremacy Clause of the U.S. Constitution (Article. VI. Clause 2) prevents states from regulating the federal government."
Texas is essentially nullifying an unconstitutional law. The Supremacy Clause does not give the Federal Government the power to do anything not specifically enumerated. I'll let Alexander Hamilton explain this to you in Federalist #33:
"But it will not follow from this doctrine that acts of the large society which are not pursuant to its constitutional powers, but which are invasions of the residuary authorities of the smaller societies, will become the supreme law of the land. These will be merely acts of usurpation, and will deserve to be treated as such. Hence we perceive that the clause which declares the supremacy of the laws of the Union, like the one we have just before considered, only declares a truth, which flows immediately and necessarily from the institution of a federal government. It will not, I presume, have escaped observation, that it expressly confines this supremacy to laws made pursuant to the Constitution; which I mention merely as an instance of caution in the convention; since that limitation would have been to be understood, though it had not been expressed."
You are further, breaking the 4th Amendment:
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."
Pragmatically, these policies have nothing to do with security. Security entails a locked cockpit, armed pilots, standard screening and private security agencies which can be fired and replaced by more efficient and respectful agencies.
They bring up the constitution, but fail to mention the 4th amendment... iron, pick and choose what parts of the constitution you want to use
Just so you all understand blogger bob, my daughter was patted down in January simply because she had a sweater on because it was cold. No one told her to take it off, she did not refuse to go through a scanner and she did not set off the metal detector. So, you are lying to the people here and you guys need to cut it out.
Fact: No one is exempt. Everyone is subject to the same screening.
Liar. Name the last time a member of the House or Senate was screened. Name the last time that GWB was screened.
"He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people, and eat out their substance".
The fourth branch of government is the people, and it reserves the right to trump all others.
"Your comment has been saved and will be visible after blog owner approval."
It seems that "Blogger Bob" is practicing censorship on this site.
The standard of "reasonableness" applies here. As far as search goes, what is reasonable MUST ultimately be limited by We-The-People. It would have been pointless to remind the government to only do what is reasonable because clearly anything it wants to do it will justify as "reasonable" ~ therefore - the standard of reasonableness MUST be as defined by and as limited by the people. The States therefore have the right to act as representatives of the people.
Reference to Josh Ds comment, "If you don't want a pat down choose some other way of transportation."
Thanks for the advice Josh but I already figured it out---family auto is the way I go anywhere in the continental USA. I would consider train or bus transport if I didn't want to drive. Bye, bye Southwest and others that I flew with for many years, often monthly in my job. Thank God I am retired.
You argument is flawed. Texas is not banning patdowns, just outlining what is acceptable while doing them. That is well with-in the supremacy clause if the Federal statutes does not outline specifically what is enforced.
You can raise that number to 900. TSA is a joke. There are much better ways to effect security, profiling suspicious behaviors/persons is one that just reeks of COMMON SENSE!
You might allow yourself to be schooled by the Israelis. They do it better.
Pat downs effective huh? Tell it to the Shoe Bomber. Tell it to the Panty Bomber. The only reason these guys were caught is 'cause they FAILED. Nice try. Tell it to someone who believes in "Hope and Change".
"Clause 2: This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof..."
That's the key. I'd be willing to bet 99% of the USC is in direct violation of some portion of the Constitution. Good luck making congress prove it, though.
This is an interesting, if wholly predictable "response" from an organization that is, itself unconstitutional.
I will be working to get defunded, and your executive staff imprisoned.
Only 3% receive pat downs. Only 3%? Millions pass through our airports every day. That's a lot of pat downs. Try this: announce a 3% reduction in TSA salaries and discover the reaction to "only."
Seriously...How does the TSA expect anyone to even take this blog seriously?
On a side note, clearly, per the TSA blog site...They have a higher image, if not altogether skewed perception of themselves, then what many non-government Citizens see.
The issue here is the right to say "No"... No, you may not touch my child 12 or under or 12 or older.
No, you may not touch me or my old and infirm parents...nor may you irradiate us with scanners.
No, you may not threaten us with fines for refusal.
No you may not coerce me into surrending my fundemental rights and protections outlined under the the Constitution...and you may not do this under the Color of Law.
You may ask me.
You may treat me with dignity and respect...but you still may not touch my children under any circumstance...
We survived the world and all its enemies before 9/11 without you.
Of course, the irony of our open borders and the BATF arming of drug cartels in Mexico has not gone unnoticed...No, the real war being waged here is that of a Surveillance State against the natural rights and freedoms of American Citizens and their Constiutional Inheritance.
Small number of complaints? Of course when you ignore the public, you will hear no complaints. When you have your mind made up as to what you will do regardless of public outcry, what do complaints matter?
This clearly demonstrates that The Texas House hit a nerve. You're "myths" are straw men statistics that you've constructed to make you're invasion of privacy look tame. Previous post is right, just because the complaints aren't filed doesn't mean there not out there. This is nothing more than propaganda.
whoever wrote this sounds like twelve year old writing their first essay ever.
JoshD said..."You people are idiots. it is not a vio0lation[sic] of your 4th amendment right at all. Last I checked it isn't your right to fly"
JushD, Your right to fly is as solid as your right to go to the mall, grocery store, hospital, park, or ride the highway. With your logic, police can stop your car on the interstate and search you at will without regard to the 4th amendment.
Blatant misunderstanding and disregard of the Constitution in this blog is not surprising. I've seen many 'prohibited items' get thru TSA Security Theater over the years. TSA is a joke.
I like the fact that the moderator has approved "You people are idiots" comment by JoshD when it clearly states "We will not post comments that contain personal attacks of any kind."
TSA Said:
---------------
"The pat-down is a highly effective tool to resolve certain alarms and keep these dangerous items off of planes that could cause catastrophic damage. "
Response:
---------------
So, why the random screening of children?
The idea of you justifying this to "resolve" an alarm, is bogus. Great straw man fallacy, though.
Texas banned this, in the event there is NO Probable cause--obviously, an alarm is probable cause. So, quit pretending that texas is objecting to REASONABLE searches. You are mispresenting FACTS.
There is now no aspect of our lives that government hasn't stuck it's nose into in the name of safety and security. At some point, we will all be considered too dangerous to be allowed to roam free and leash laws will be in effect. Sit, beg, roll over and wait for your trainer to toss you a treat! What is wrong with people in this country? Are they putting something in the water???????
If only it weren't for the 4th amendment, and rather the constitution gave the federal government power to conduct warrant-less unreasonable searches and seizures, then the supremacy clause would apply.
Maybe the constitution should be amended to convey this power to the federal government.
When the pigs are walking on two legs should we start to worry?
We have started a new Orwellian police state and this blog is simply more crowd control. What a farce.
*** "If you're gonna plead the Supremacy Clause, then you have to abide by the enumerated powers. And you're not gonna wanna go there, cuz that would mean no federal role in aviation at all." ***
That is 100% correct! If you want to plead the Supremacy clause of the Constitution, you have to use the rest of the Constitution as well, and the Federal Government doesn't get the power in the first place! My God, why can't we just elect Ron Paul?!
You are not needed, you are not wanted, and your entire agency is an affront to American citizens. Can you point to ONE SINGLE INSTANCE where you stopped an inflight act of terrorism? Even ONE?
I have one comment I will not get on an airplane ever. This is not the America I grew up in,
Having a pat down is very offensive
to me
Let this be worked out in the courts. Texas officers should arrest people doing illegal pat downs by Texas law. Then charge them as sex offenders and let the TSA fight the case out in open court. I suspect the $20/hour TSA employees (they are not officers) will be reluctant to perform the pat downs.
I suspect that even a "3%" arrest and indictment rate would serve as a big deterrent, and that the "vocal few" of the TSA employees would be well served by the vocal majority who passed the laws restricting them.
Hello, Whether a citizen agrees or disagrees with the TSA actions is not material. History shows Empires typically abuse the world outside it's borders then moves to abuse inside it's borders. This is common evolution prior to collapse. No good guys only bad guys and victims here. Good luck.
If the TSA and the rest of the federal government might consider abiding by the list of enumerated powers before it starts trying to cite the supremacy clause.
Out of 252 million people being assessed and "patted down" by TSA, just how many actually resulted in arrest and conviction for terrorism? Any?
The Constitution says you can fondle people's butts on no suspicion other than they want to get somewhere else quickly?
Complete and utter BS.
By the way what's your terrorist capture count up to today? Still zero huh? Well maybe today is your lucky day.
I have never heard a single one of those myths being stated by anyone. Don't oversimplify the opposition to your policies.
About 1,000 complaints for 7 million pat downs. Sounds like this actually is significant based upon the precedent that states are using for bringing suit against the private sector.
As an example, the state of Florida is attempting to sue a couple "for profit" higher ed companies when they received a total of 157 complaints - these higher ed companies have served over a million students during the period in which these complaints occurred; this ratio of complaints to students is less than the ratio of pat downs to complaints.
The complaint rate has nothing to do with legality of such policies - however we can use statistics to gauge their effectiveness.
The plain fact is that I do not believe these pat downs (or TSA security in general) has yielded ONE "attack stop". If we are going to use "sparse" statistics to justify pat downs, how about using the "0% statistic" to verify the ineffectiveness of these policies. These policies should be done away with simply because they are not effective (and become obviously so when looking at the costs and inconvenience being added) - I might say that even if they stopped 1 attack per year it still wouldn't be worth the time, money, inconvenience, and abrogation of personal liberty. I know it's hard for nanny staters to accept anything but 100% safety - but the time and money being spent on this ineffective process would be better spent improving air traffic systems and inspection capabilities - and save more lives that way too.
"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."
If anyone can point to the congressional power to do this, i would appreciate it. Saying you have the power because of the supremacy clause is ludicrous.
I wonder how many complaints have been thrown out before actually getting into the system. A few years ago, one of their TSA agents tried to steal my new smartphone (back when only a few of us had them.) I asked the police to arrest the agent, but that didn't happen so I submitted a complaint. I watched the supervisor throw it away as I walked toward my gate.
I believe that (radio broadcaster) Alex Jones might tend to disagree with your "TSA: All the Way" outlook, not withstanding possible approval by certain illustrious dimbulbs currently residing in Washington D.C. and/or it's daily commute suburbs (to include Wilmington, Delaware).
898 complaints? Yeah right.
Let's see- there are around 150 representatives in the Texas house- representing 24 million Texans- at least 100 voted for this...and then received a standing O.
So- the anonymous bureaucrat author of this blog can now amend the number of "complaints" to roughly 18 million- in Texas alone.
GOd bless Texas!
The fact of the matter is that TSA is rude, overbearing and clueless. I have relatives with joint replacements who spend 5-10 minutes each time they board. These are limping elderly WASPs. When traveling with my 5 kids, I have had them shunted into lines, against my will, where they ended up on the far side of security, alone, long before I did. I have gone through the enhanced pat down for a plastic comb in my pocket. We have all seen the videos of children and infants getting the treatment. I can't wait to call the TX authorities the next time I get the "business".
The "Supremacy Clause" (Art 6 sec 2) states. "This Constitution and all the laws passed IN PURSUANCE THEREOF and all the treaties made or which shall be made under the authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the land, and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby, anything in the State Constitution or laws to the contrary notwithstanding."
The TSA mandate is a law, but it certainly is NOT pssed in pursuance of the Constitution, violating the 4th and 10th amendments. *By the way, the Constitution never grants the Federal judiciary the power to rule on the Constitutionality of Federal Law. Under the 10th amendment, that power is reserved to the States or the people. As noted above, State Law is a different story; however, TSA regulations have not been pseed in pursuance of the Constitution and are, therefore, supreme to nothing.
Either we have a Constitution or not. Make up your mind!
We have more to worry about with a passenger jet being shot down with a SAM. Now that hundreds of such missiles have gone missing in Libya, you can take this to the bank.
That won't stop the TSA, though. Nooooo. They will want to stop your car and search you when you drive near an airport, bus station, or anywhere else they deem themselves "supreme".
Maybe the banker's government needs to quit building empires. That won't happen either, though.
Just out of curiosity, does anyone realize that even if you do leave a comment as anonymous, you can still be tracked?
In regards to pat downs:
I still want to know why a baby was searched because its stroller setup the detector.
Since a stroller will most likely set off a detector, would it not have made more sense perhaps to have the mother carry the baby through?
Since its known a stroller will setup the detector, why use this as an excuse to search a baby?
I think that what Texas should do is park a couple Texas rangers at the checkpoints, and arrest any TSA agents that perform pat downs that break the state law.
Pretty soon the issue will be resolved as the TSA runs out of agents.
So if the TSA is to use statistics to denote the logic of the pat downs how about the TSA then provide all of the statistics?
What is the % of children that receive pat downs of full body scans vs the overall?
What is the % of 20 something females that receive patdowns or full body scans vs the overall
What is the % of the elderly that receive patdowns or full body scans vs the overall?
Disabled?
Point being that we are consistently hearing about these specific groups being targeted for scans with some women reporting that they are patted down Every time they fly. Logic dictates that at some point it stops looking like random events and starts to appear as a act of perversion or malice. Also please note that I doubt there are very many 20 something blonds or 3 yr olds packing dangerous items onto the plane.
I agree with CJ Grisham, and haven't flown since they instituted this policy. Touching someone is assault. Supposedly you are agreeing to the possibility of being assaulted if you want to fly anywhere but interstate. Otherwise, you should drive. And if you live in Alaska, that is a long haul. Perhaps the ferry is an option, as one of our legislators decided.
Even Dr Steve Piecenik doesn't like the TSA. He went on the radio due to TSA hands in the pants.
He is the real-life person that Tom Clancy based his Jack Ryan character on.
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=dr+steve+piecenik&aq=f
whatever Bob. Fight it out courts. one out of a thousand is still too many to pat down as far as passengers are concerned.
I totally agree that we need security in these times. I do NOT agree however that the TSA should be so cavalier with their attitude of their "patdowns". If I wanted someone to grab my crotch, I'd go downtown with a stack of $20's. Figure out a way that won't leave your customers feeling as thought they were violated.
So how, despite a massive transportation and homeland security apparatus, did al-Murisi get into this country and get on a plane?
This is the guy who was screming Allahu akbar!(God is Great) as he tried to gain access to the cockpit of flight 1561 last week - and had to be tackled and restrained by several passengers.
He had no keys, no luggage, $47 cash, two curious posted checks totaling $13,000, and a trove of expired and current state IDs from New York and California — where relatives said he had not notified them that he was coming.
He is young, male, brought no family with him, had no job or other discernible income, and hails from the terror-coddling nation of Yemen. Yes, the same Yemen that is Osama bin Laden’s ancestral home, harbors al-Qaida operatives who are burning the “torch of jihad,” and is deemed a “special interest country” whose citizens warrant increased scrutiny by DHS when they cross the border illegally.
Last month, a federal watchdog revealed that TSA’s counterterrorism specialists failed to detect 16 separate jihad operatives who moved through target airports “on at least 23 different occasions.”
At least the heroes of Flight 1561 who refused to sit silent learned the proper 9/11 lesson. “I swore to myself that I would never be a victim” after the 2001 attacks, passenger Larry Wright, one of the men who brought al-Murisi down, told reporters earlier this week.
The only effective homeland security begins and ends with a culture of self-defense. Just as there are no atheists in foxholes, there are no “see no jihad, hear no jihad, speak no jihad” delusionists on airplanes with Allahu akbar-chanting flyers beating down doors.
I say its time we actually do something effective and do what Israel does (hint - it ain't indiscriminate pat downs). When you are dealing with millions of passengers you *need* to be discriminant to be effective - just ask the passengers of flight 1561.
The argument of "protecting us" and "keeping us safe" makes absolutely no sense as long as the Federal Government allows an open border policy.
Terrorists can literally walk across our border whenever they want, but heaven forbid if a family wants to fly across the country to visit grandma.
When will people wake up and understand that the TSA body scanners and enhanced pat-downs are not about safety but about CONDITIONING the fearful sheep to give away their freedoms and liberties.
WAKE UP AMERICANS, BEFORE IT IS TOO LATE!!
Comments I read so far miss the point completely. It is up to the public to decide how safe they want to be, and therefore leave it up to the airlines to set safety standards, then choices will develop. Then you have choice, that is what liberty means. If the airlines do profiling as should be done it is none of the government's business to prevent it.
End the nanny state. Brake the back of an unconstitutional, incompetent unionized TSA.
Fred Labaar
Long Beach, CA
US Constitution, Article 1 Section 8.
TSA is not in there, so TSA is unconstitutional.
Nothing to discuss.
First the inside contacts in the TSA force the USA to purchase and deploy X-Ray and millimeter wave body scanners. Then they implement advanced patdowns which are intrusive and sexual groping for those who opt-out of the body scanners.
The state of Texas is working to protect its population. Good for Texas. We need these types of elected officials in the federal government.
The TSA's use of advanced patdowns and body scanners violate 4th amdendment rights because the TSA does not have probable cause.
I have opted out of flying until the TSA abides within the US Constitution. I recently drove 1,800 miles to our company division. It was not enjoyable. It was not as safe as a commercial flight. It took 2.5 extra days. It cost me an extra $ 500.00. I will not let the TSA sexually assault me, irradiate me, or have naked body pictures of me.
I hope we can elect a president and representatives and senators in Congress who will support the US Constitution, investigate the TSA, fire those responsible for the body scanners and advanced patdowns, and eliminate these practices. I would like to fly commercial airlines without the TSA's unConstitutional actions.
To Anonymous said...
People that are willing to trade a little security for their freedom, deserve neither!!!!
The powers of the FEDERAL government are finite and CLEARLY DEFINED by the Constitution of the United States. The TSA and other agencies are violating American's constitutional rights on a daily basis with these unwarranted searches. Everyone should opt out of these NAKED BODY SCANNERS and refuse to allow the TSA to pat you down in innappropriate areas. The Texas bill does not 'ban patdowns' as the TSA would like to make you believe. It bans groping of the genitals, anus, and other sensitive areas. Even police in the field do not grope these areas when searching. Americans- stand up for your rights!
I am glad the TSA is catching all of the poop bombs created by young children. I think we should also have a TSA agent assigned to each young child flying so they can also monitor during the flight all potential lethal gases orininating from such child....
There are statistics and then there are distortions made with statistics. The article claims "252 million SCREENED" and then 898 complaints about the pat-downs...how many passengers actually had the pat-downs is left out and then they give a false number of 0.0004% for complaints. If 3% of 252,000,000 get the pat-downs that is 7,560,000 pat downs. If 898 of those complain, then the real complaint filed percentage is 0.0119%. And as a previous poster said, there are many more that don't take the time to complain. I wonder how many people have actually filed a positive note about the pat-down procedure. I would bet that the percentage would have a lot more zeros after the period.
The supremacy clause? Hmmmm, what about illegal search and seizure? By doing one, you violate the other. I've read a lot about this and there are other options than to "checkout an infant" while letting other, more obvious people aboard. Tell me, TSA, exactly how many of the people in the last 2weeks who have created problems on aircraft were pulled aside for closer examination by your agents? The reason my family don't fly anymore is because if you "checked" my 5 year old daughter, I'd break someones nose. All members of congress and government should also be be included in you searches. Look democrats, this is exactly what what you're supposed to be against, treating some differently than others.
You cite the supremacy clause of the constitution. I'm glad you brought the constitution into this.
What part of the constitution authorizes pat-downs, or the existence of the TSA at all? Just looked through Art. 1 sec. 8. Didn't find anything. Am I missing something?
You are right when you say we live in dangerous times, so let me ask you this. What will you do when the terrorist blow themselves up waiting in line just to get screened? There are several people waiting in that cramped area. And when you move the line back to the actual entrance of the dange airport, what will you do when the terrorist blows himself up there? And when you start making a checkpoint just to get onto the airport grounds and force people to get out of their vehicle and do a factory sized x-ray on their vehicle and then pat them down there and have them go through an x-ray there, yet a terrorist blows himself up there. What will you do? And when you start doing random security check points along the highways and through the cities, and even yet the Terrorists blow themselves up, what will you do? I only see this as getting increasingly worst and an onset of martial law. Once you get to Martial Law status, we will have ended up like france. You will have chaos, anti-government groups gaining power, anarchists, and patriots (every day citizens) fighting the government for their rights and protection. What will you do then? Tax us more and establish more "Security Measure Policies"? I hope you sleep well. I know I am losing sleep at the thought of a socialist/communist dictatorship encrouching on our people.
Interesting comments i must say. A few have alluded to banning flights to and from Texas. We could always go back to state rights, not allow unfunded gov't programs , hold our reps responsible for corruption and see the tooth fairy visit. Won't happen. Texas could always ceed itself from the union. Maybe the start of another civil war. 1rst may have started about slavery, but according to what i see, another police state is happening. Just not over one race this time.
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