Without our Sun, life on Earth would freeze to death within months.

I would say it takes just some days - if there were days without a sun.

Are you going to publish your book here step by step?

Wow "super-massive black holes in galactic cores" shock exposure...

... for heaven's sake, it's hardly a slow news day!

Spaghetti?

"But a black hole would not need to suck the Earth in to cause us trouble. If one wandered within a billion miles of our solar system".

Why if?

If you have trouble imagining everything being sucked in to nothingness, just think of the Euro in six months time........................................................

'Without our Sun, life on Earth would freeze to death within months.'

You're joking, aren't you?

Astronomers have announced the discovery of the two biggest black holes ever seen

I just discovered two of the quietest silences ever heard!

Most things in the universe move as steadily as a clockwork. But not all of them. There also are always some ricochets, some turbulences. You can't be absolutely sure about what happens.

" Black holes begin as giant stars (at least six times the mass of our Sun) and, after billions of years they collapse in on themselves into a point smaller than the full-stop at the end of this sentence" Really? To quote "Black holes of stellar mass are expected to form when massive stars collapse in a supernova at the end of their life cycle. After a black hole has formed it can continue to grow by absorbing mass from its surroundings. By absorbing other stars and merging with other black holes, supermassive black holes of millions of solar masses may be formed.
Does this happen with full stops?

Is it just me, or does this article suffer a lack of both scientific and journalistic rigour?

each one

= both

These cosmological objects are some of the strangest in our known universe, where the laws of physics seem to break down and space gets very strange.

'Cosmological', 'known universe' and 'space' are weasel words in this context.

Even at some distance outside the edge

Some distance? This can vary greatly depending on the mass of the black hole. And do you mean the event horizon?

it would take all the effort in the universe to resist getting pulled into orbit around the hole

I don't think it would take all the effort in the universe (whatever that means), especially if you hadn't crossed the EH.

because of the sharp rate of increase of the forces

Forces? Do you means that gravity increases hugely?

if your head was nearer the hole than your feet, the atoms in your hair would feel a stronger force than those in your toes

Like if you did a handstand on Earth.

This difference would quickly tear you apart, turning you into a spaghetti-like line of atoms.

This was cliche in the 70s (although some bores use noodles), and is quite an understatement of what would happen.

but the chances of our solar system running into one of them is small, because space is vast

Non sequitur.

but it is safe to say that they were the extremely unlucky ones

I give up.

How on Earth can someone mangle a mere 350-word article quite so badly. Give me a call some time Grauniad; I'll write you something better for free.

First two paragraphs - news?

The rest - cut and paste from a book? The content of which is an insult to my intelligence, not expected from The Guardian.

Thanks for that cheerful read.

I like the idea of being stringed into a line of atoms...

Black holes begin as giant stars (at least six times the mass of our Sun) and, after billions of years they collapse in on themselves into a point smaller than the full-stop at the end of this sentence.

No. For an object like a sun to become a black hole, its' radius must shrink to its' Schwarzschild radius.

If earth became a black hole it would need to shrink to have a radius of 9 mm, our sun 3 kilometres. The super massive black hole at the centre of the milky way, has a radius of 13.3 million kilometres. Which is bigger than the full-stop at the end of this sentence.

We only notice the big black holes. If a black hole the size of a full stop passed through our solar system, we wouldn't notice it.

Without our Sun, life on Earth would freeze to death within months.

I'd say most life would freeze to death within a few days. We'd probably all freeze to death within the first day (or night - as there just would be night). Some of the seas might stay liquid under the ice - life around the underwater volcanic vents would go on.

spaghetti? is this article aimed at complete berks?
space is vast indeed. jesus wept.

The inside of a Black Hole is somewhat akin to the Magic Roundabout.
You'll see a stoned rabbit, a hairy dog and a snail wearing a hat.

I'm not entirely sure why I said "hairy dog". Perhaps I just wanted to make it clear that the dogs were not shaved. hmm.

if your head was nearer the hole than your feet, the atoms in your hair would feel a stronger force than those in your toes. This difference would quickly tear you apart, turning you into a spaghetti-like line of atoms.

If it was a spinning black hole before you got anywhere near the event horizon, you would have been atomised into hot gas. Most of you would be sucked into the black hole and some of you would be spun so fast, you would fuse into other elements, like gold, and then be shot out into space at near the speed of light.

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.........................

In response to:
"DrewGold
11 December 2011 11:48PM
Is it just me, or does this article suffer a lack of both scientific and journalistic rigour?"

Hello DrewGold,

Personally, I don't give a wotsit about "scientific & journalistic rigour" , . they are things that ........you would probably find in NEW SCIENTIST, if that's what you're after.

I liked this article because I LEARNED SOMETHING NEW that I didn't know before, & because it was WELL WRITTEN, in an INTERESTING way, very similar, in fact, to GOOD TEACHING...........something which...........

Those who are OBSESSED with things like "SCIENTIFIC RIGOUR/JOURNALISTIC RIGOUR are often totally useless at & THUS present their SUBJECT in a VERY BORING WAY

These BLACK HOLES remind me a lot of those old films I used to watch on the telly in the 60's and 70's, in which PEOPLE were SUCKED into DEADLY BOGS & they just COULD NOT STOP SINKING!

Scarey but fascinating!

This story sucks.

You don't care about scientific and journalistic rigour? In an article about science, you don't think those things are important? So, what you are saying is that you don't care whether the information you read in your newspaper is accurate or whether it is presented in a clear comprehensible way. So why bother reading anything at all? Just make it up. The moon is made of marmalade! Yeah!! The Higg's Boson is actually a jaffa cake! Woo! Is it true? Who cares??

It's funny that you then go on to say you liked the article because you learned something new today. As has been pointed out by others, you've actually been exposed to a small amount of inaccurate badly presented information and so have actually learnt nothing new.

As a side note, when you spell a word in capitals, it implies that you are shouting. Try reading your comment and shouting the words in capital letters and see how sensible it sounds.

Isn't Time itself a black hole into which everything is falling? Regardless of apparent change, i.e. the universe evolving, the wave patterns of matter remain the same, these wave patterns being like the DNA of the universe. Some suggest that these wave patterns are preserved, smeared 2 dimensionally at the mouth of the vortex by the gravitational winds pulling all matter, time and space into it. Memory itself can only be wave patterns which we retrieve to give ourselves consistency. As one slips down the funnel towards the black hole, due to the exponential and infinite rise in gravity, physical information becomes smeared across the surface of its crushing gravitational whirlwind. A trace would be left at the edge, which itself would become infinitely thin; universal knowledge preserved two-dimensionally, a page of all recorded time in the book of cosmic forgetting. A ghost, a spirit, a phantom. Then what? Cosmic remembering?

If a black hole is a collapsed star, then initially it will have the same mass as the original star, albeit occupying a smaller volume. Anything in orbit around it would then presumably continue to orbit around it.

As stars are much more numerous than black holes, shouldn’t we be more concerned about one of them knocking the earth out of orbit?

Black Holes are really soooo yesterday. But, Mr Higgs-Bosun has turned up in my front room, trying to distract me from watching the American Football...F"ck Off.,

Strangely no one ever explains where the extra gravity comes from. The simple act of a star collapsing doesn't increase it's mass so there can be no increase in gravity.

This is pathetic alarmist, ignorant, reporting.

The size of the star changes but not it's gravitational effect. Therefore it is no more of a hoover than before.

you would have been atomised into hot gas. Most of you would be sucked into the black hole and some of you would be spun so fast, you would fuse into other elements, like gold, and then be shot out into space at near the speed of light.

Wow, that sounds like one hell of a ride! Alton Towers eat your heart out...

DrewGold - no, it's not just you. This article is hopelessly poorly researched and written and can only misinform its' readership. I'm not sure whether Alok Jha or Charlie Brooker wins the prize for funniest article this Monday.

Even at some distance outside the edge

- you missed "edge", by the way. Edge of what, a toasted crumpet a billion miles wide?

Anyway, this article is about what exactly? Two massive black holes have been discovered (but not seen, since you can't see them - they're black, don't you know), duhh... and that's it. So why don't we get Alok to write a scary piece about these whatchamacallits and he can promote his new book which is about scary (cosmological - nice big word) things. Just the thing for your Crimble stocking - just don't fall into it, right?

In response to:
"robinr22
12 December 2011 3:40AM
Response to chocolata3100, 12 December 2011 2:11AM
You don't care about scientific and journalistic rigour? In an article about science, you don't think those things are important? So, what you are saying is that you don't care whether the information you read in your newspaper is ACCURATE or whether it is presented in a clear comprehensible way. So why bother reading anything at all? Just make it up."

Hello ROBINR22

In fact , ALL SCIENCE is SCIENCE FICTION. (& almost as thrilling)

NO SCIENCE can be said to be ACCURATE, as such.

We only create our LAWS OF SCIENCE etc, based on the little we know.

We can't be SURE about ANYTHING.

For example, nobody has ever actually SEEN MAGNETISM, what it IS can only be GUESSED from its VISIBLE EFFECTS.

Wow. Wo that's what they look like. Spectacular.

The NIGHT SKY looks so wonderfully CHRISTMASSY, with all those glittery, twinkling STARS, how lovely it is.

The NIGHT SKY is so BIG & TWINKLY.

Take care! Mind you don't fall into it!

TWINKLE TWINKLE LITTLE STAR
HOW I WONDER WHAT YOU ARE

Spaghetti?

I expect other forms of long, thin foodstuffs are available.
Just that culturally we are more used to spaghetti.
Noodles would be good or (my own favourite) cheese strings.
Is spaghetti too thick - should it be vermicelli?
Could it even be like the mozarella strings from a pizza?

It's this sort of inaccuracy that really bugs me with some articles. More research is required, sod all this 'LHC' and 'Higgs' nonsense -- we need real answers to real questions!

TWINKLE TWINKLE LITTLE STAR
HOW I WONDER WHAT YOU ARE

Usually some rather uninviting and unhealthy exotic forms of radiation which would give a nice tan from several million miles away.

If earth became a black hole it would need to shrink to have a radius of 9 mm, our sun 3 kilometres. The super massive black hole at the centre of the milky way, has a radius of 13.3 million kilometres. Which is bigger than the full-stop at the end of this sentence.

Well, you're defining the 'radius' of the black hole as that of its event horizon, but the article is clearly talking about the matter inside the black hole, which becomes a singularity.

I think this article got too near a black hole. What you are witnessing is journalistic spaghettification.

interesting about life lasting a while without the sun. a quick google seems to back this up.

There's a much bigger third Black Hole looming to effectively swallow us all and the other two black holes too : The American Debt.

Because IT has no sex. A least not these type of black holes. Unless IT derives some sort of kinky pleasure from swallowing.

Author is merely plugging his book.
But it provided some entertaining comments...

What a piss-poor article, designed to shift copies of a piss-poor book.

Competition for the bankers then. Which can suck our money away fastest?

Oh, I see. You're trolling. Oh well.

I could give you the whole "of course science isn't science fiction" spiel and explain how the scientific method has utterly shaped the world around us, and how your statement that science can't be sure about anything is essentially nonsense and the same argument used by supporters of intelligent design, and that no one has ever seen the centre of the earth yet we are pretty sure it's there, yaddah yaddah yaddah and so on.

But you're just trolling, so what's the point.

Higg apostrophe s ?

Its'

?
I think you have a black hole attached to your possessive!

If you want a really super-massive black hole, try my son's bedroom. Nothing that goes into it is ever seen again. Trust me.

In response to:
"robinr22
12 December 2011 3:40AM
Response to chocolata3100, 12 December 2011 2:11AM
You don't care about scientific and journalistic rigour? In an article about science, you don't think those things are important? So, what you are saying is that you don't care whether the information you read in your newspaper is ACCURATE
or whether it is presented in a clear comprehensible way. So why bother reading anything at all? Just make it up. The moon is made of marmalade! Yeah!! The Higg's Boson is actually a jaffa cake! Woo! Is it true? Who cares??"

Hello ROBINR22,

How do YOU know that all that stuff they told you is ACCURATE? Maybe they made it all UP? Or maybe they made a mistake. Only GOD really knows the TRUTH .

"So why bother reading anything at all?" you ask. Well, because all SCIENCE FICTION is quite thrilling

Whatever mental drugs chocolata3100 is on, I want some.