Hi Susan,I'd also like to request a copy, if I could.
Thanks,
Jessie

On Thu, Feb 5, 2009 at 4:34 PM, Susan Kidd <SKidd at sbctc.edu> wrote:


>  A couple of years ago a group of ABE math teachers from Washington State

> looked at the content of  CASAS Life Skills and Employability, the GED and

> both the COMPASS and ASSET Numeracy/Pre-Algebra tests. If anyone would like

> to see the crosswalk they created, I'd be glad to send you a copy.

>

>

>

>

>

> *Susan*

>

>

>

> Susan Kidd

>

> ABE Professional Development Coordinator

>

> State Board for Community & Technical Colleges

>

> office phone: 509-682-6968

>

> cell phone: 509-630-4520

>

> skidd at sbctc.edu

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> *From:* assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] *On

> Behalf Of *Joyce Winters

> *Sent:* Thursday, February 05, 2009 9:50 AM

> *To:* The Assessment Discussion List

> *Subject:* [Assessment 1696] Re: Adult Ed Math & Accuplacer, cont.

>

>

>

> Thanks so much for your work and offer to share it, Tom.  Has anyone also

> done this kind of work with the Compass placement test?

>

>

>

>

>

> *Joyce Winters, *

>

> *Professional Development Specialist*

>

> *NWRC/Owens Community College*

>

> *2249 Tracy Road, Room 169*

>

> *Northwood, Ohio 43619*

>

> *567-661-7675*

>

> *joyce_winters at owens.edu*

>

>

>

> >>> "Mechem, Thompson" <tmechem at doe.mass.edu> 2/5/2009 10:35 AM >>>

>

> Ramsey, et al.---

>

>

>

> Well, I can tell you what in my amateurish way I have done. For a number of

> years part of my job has been to make presentations to GED teachers and

> program directors regarding what skill sets are needed for success on the

> five parts of the GED tests. As you know, no one can see the GED tests, so

> it's hard for teachers to know what to teach or what it means that one of

> their students got a 410 on the Writing test, and so on. The GED Testing

> Service in Washington provides us with valuable information on the

> most-missed questions (based on their analysis of every test taken

> world-wide since January 1, 2002); we have the GED Item-Writing Manuals,

> which give valuable insights into the philosophy of how the GED questions

> are formulated; and we pester the GEDTS at every opportunity for more info.

> Teachers have found this to be valuable for the most part.

>

>

>

> Lately I have focused more on the Math because it is the main reason for

> GED failures and it is far and away the main reason that GED grads end up in

> developmental courses.

>

>

>

> Last spring, after it finally sunk in that GED grads were not getting

> anywhere near as far as they needed in post-secondary education, that a

> great majority  were wallowing in (mostly math) developmental courses,

> that poor performance on the ACCUPLACER math test was one of the main

> reasons for that, and that there was no correlation between a GED math score

> and an ACCUPLACER algebra score, I took the ACCUPLACER Algebra test

> (something I recommend everyone interested in this subject to do). And I

> almost threw up, not just for myself, trying to battle through it, but for

> our GED grads, knowing what it was going to look like to them. So I took the

> ACCUPLACER dozens more times and I have put together another presentation

> for teachers and program directors which talks about the differences (in

> philosophy, in how the test is presented and taken, and in the skills sets

> needed) and starts the dialogue as to how we can create a GED math

> curriculum that prepares our students to pass the GED tests, do well enough

> on the ACCUPLACER to avoid developmental courses, and succeed in college

> Math classes.

>

>

>

> (Here's a brief example: if the GED test wants you to use the formula for

> the area of a rectangle, it will create a "real-life" situation in a word

> problem, somebody building a patio or whatever, and the answer will be what

> our GED students consider an "answer," "460 square feet" or something like

> that. On the ACCUPLACER, the rectangle will have a width of "x" and a length

> of "x + 3," so the area will be (I can't type the exponent, but...) "x2 +

> 3x" and all the multiple-choice wrong answers will be in that form, more or

> less.)

>

>

>

> These presentations have been great for me because of the tremendous

> enthusiasm and input from the teachers, "Well, here's a difficulty you

> present and here's how I address that in my class." And the discussion this

> week has been fabulous in that respect as well: so many dedicated people and

> so many fantastic ideas I can hardly steal them all.

>

>

>

> If anyone were to e-mail me off-list, I could send you my PowerPoint

> presentation: one man's opinion, a work in progress, but perhaps food for

> further thought.

>

> Tom Mechem

> GED State Chief Examiner

> Department of Elementary & Secondary Education

> Commonwealth of Massachusetts

> 781-338-6621

> *"GED to Ph.D."*

>

> -----Original Message-----

> *From:* assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]*On

> Behalf Of *Ramsey Ludlow

> *Sent:* Thursday, February 05, 2009 8:50 AM

> *To:* The Assessment Discussion List

> *Subject:* [Assessment 1684] Re: Adult Ed Math & Accuplacer, cont.

>

> Very interesting, Donna. You refer to Tom Mechem's  identification of the

> math that is tested on the Accuplacer. What are those, and how do we get

> that info?

>

> Thanks,

>

> Ramsey Ludlow

> Oxford / Buckfield Hills Adult Education

> South Paris, Maine 04281

>

> Donna Chambers wrote:

>

> Jessie,

>

>

>

> Thank you for bringing up the issue of the less rigorous current NEDP math

> requirements.  As you mentioned, CASAS is in the process of revalidating the

> competencies, but we cannot wait for this work to be completed.  Here is how

> we are planning to address this in RI to be fare to the NEDP graduates who

> are planning to move on to college or other post-secondary programs through

> our Transitions program.

>

>

>

> All NEDP candidates are informed when they first enter the program that by

> fulfilling the national requirements they will still need further work to

> meet the demands of most post-secondary programs.   Since our pilot will

> blend both TTC and NEDP, candidates will fulfill the NEDP math requirements

> as a first step and a base.  This math is basic arithmetic.  Our combined

> National External Diploma Program/Transitions to College Program will have

> the additional requirements of learning, practicing and being assessed in

> the math that is being tested on the Accuplacer (which my good buddy, Tom

> Mechem, has so painstakingly identified.)   This is targeted scaffold

> instruction that requires competency-based assessment (no one gets by

> without demonstrating understanding).  You might call this NEDP Plus,  since

> these participants will be going beyond the NEDP competencies to earn their

> diploma. The reading and writing will also have increased rigor.  What we

> will be doing is adding RI Transitions to College requirements to the NEDP

> requirements.  This work does not change the existing NEDP requirements, but

> offers additional activities beyond for our Rhode Islanders.

>

>

>

> Massachusetts Adult Diploma Program has a similar process in that all

> diploma participants must meet the state MCAS rcompetency determination

> before a diploma can be awarded.  In many ways, these graduates are more

> ready academically to transition into college because they are required to

> demonstrate understanding.

>

>

>

> I hope this helps.

>

> Donna Chambers

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>   ----- Original Message -----

>

>  *From:* Jessie Stadd <jstadd at gmail.com>

>

> *To:* Assessment at nifl.gov

>

> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 04, 2009 7:13 PM

>

> *Subject:* [Assessment 1677] Adult Ed Math & Accuplacer, cont.

>

>

>

> Hi All,

>

> I am the Program Coordinator for Academy of Hope and Beyond Talent's

> Pathways College Preparation Program, currently Washington D.C.'s only

> college prep program for adult learners.  Unlike states where adult ed

> programs are housed in community colleges or public schools, the district

> relies on community-based non-profit organizations such as ours. In addition

> to Pathways, Academy of Hope offers ABE/GED classes and Beyond Talent offers

> peer-mentoring to non-traditional graduates.

>

>

>

> Pathways follows the College Prep model and is comprised of three

> month-long modules: writing, math, and college prep & career development

> (applications, financial aid documents, etc.).  Our Pathways students are

> primarily GED or EDP graduates, although we have had several high school

> graduates in the program. All enter the program with generally weak math

> skills. Most will attend our local university, UDC, or neighboring community

> colleges in Virginia or Maryland, all of which use the Accuplacer. Prior to

> starting, most of our GED and EDP graduates placed into remedial math

> classes.

>

>

>

> To address your point, Donna, while all of our students need extra work in

> math, we have found that GED graduates generally have higher math skills

> than our EDP graduates. Our GED graduates have some understanding of algebra

> (at least of its existence!) but that is not the case for the EDP grads. EDP

> learners entering the program scored in the 210s and 220s on the B level

> math CASAS. As a GED instructor, I had always felt that the less rigorous

> math requirements of EDP were a benefit and allowed students to earn a

> credential who otherwise might not. However, as a college prep program

> coordinator, EDP is doing a disservice to its students who believe that

> since they earned an actual high school diploma they are prepared for

> college. I understand that EDP is now in the process of revamping their

> competencies to increase the amount of math required. For those students who

> are interested in pursuing higher education, I do believe this is a positive

> step.

>

>

>

> Thank you,

>

> Jessie Stadd

>

> AoH Program Coordinator, Pathways College Preparation Program

>

> Lifelong Learning Coach, Academy of Hope/Beyond Talent

>  ------------------------------

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