[NIFL-ESL:11079] Re: Thank You and Continued Search for

From: Mona Curtis (MCurtis@tvcc.cc)
Date: Tue Aug 23 2005 - 11:24:34 EDT


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From: "Mona Curtis" <MCurtis@tvcc.cc>
To: Multiple recipients of list <nifl-esl@literacy.nifl.gov>
Subject: [NIFL-ESL:11079] Re: Thank You and Continued Search for
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What's UMBC?

Mona Curtis
ESL Coordinator
Treasure Valley Community College
650 College Blvd. 
Ontario, OR 97914
www.tvcc.cc
541-881-8822 x 316
fax 541-881-2747

>>> tjjhjr@netscape.net 08/20/05 09:01AM >>>
This is what was done in Fredick , Maryland where the ESL staff
instructed us....under observation from UMBC...."you are here to help us
warehopuse them until they quit"...fortunately for those students the
Office of Civil Rights US DEPT of ED forced that district, whose program
had ties to UMBC, to sign a 12 point agreement which goes beyond this
email and gets to the heart of EQUITABLE EDUCATION .....AND BEYOND 54
STUDENTS IN A ROOM, SEGREGATION BY LANGUAGE, COMPUTER USE FOR ALL
STUDENTS, NOT JUST 'AMERICANS', OPEN RECORDS, BOOKS AND MATERIAL, AND
MUCH MUCH MORE......TO PREACH ONE THING AND DO ANOTHER IS SAD



Jodi Crandall <crandall@umbc.edu> wrote:

>If I sent this previously, apologies, but I just found this in my
"drafts::
>------
>I have read the discussion on Caribbean students with interest, and 
>though my experience is more with students from secondary settings, I

>thought I'd provide what I learned in working for several years with 
>these students and their teachers.
>
>This question is not new to ESL.  The issue of what to do with
students 
>who come from countries in which English is an official 
>language--usually those countries which were British colonies--is one

>that is very timely in K-12 education in both the United States and 
>Canada.  The situation is complex, but let me try to indicate some of

>what those of us who have worked in this area have learned and how it

>might apply to adult education.
>
>Students from these countries--if they are educated!--learn a variety
of 
>standard English in their countries which is somewhat different from 
>American English, but is nonetheless, intelligible to American
teachers 
>and these students should be placed with English-speaking students.  
>They will have some differences in their English (pronunciation, some

>vocabulary items, etc.) but these will not be substantial enough to 
>prevent them from participating in mainstream classrooms.  However,
many 
>of those coming from Caribbean countries where English is the
offiicial 
>language and the language of education (countries such as Jamaica, 
>Trinidad and Tobago, Belize, etc.) and from West African countries
like 
>Liberia, Ghana, etc. have limited formal schooling, and thus, they
speak 
>(and more importantly, write) a Creolized variety of English which 
>contains features which are more reflective of the African languages 
>that are part of those Creoles, than of the more Standard Englishes
that 
>are spoken by educated people in their countries.
>
>The unfortunate part of this is that in places where there are few 
>speakers of Caribbean (or West-African) Englishes with limited formal

>schooling, these students will likely be placed with ESL students.  
>Neither the reading specialist nor the regular classroom (or English)

>teacher (or in adult education, the ABE instructor) feels qualified to

>teach someone whose English is so different from that spoken by other

>English-speaking students.  However, the students DO speak English and

>are thus, not surprisingly, quite insulted when they are viewed as
being 
>non-native speakers.  Their problems are different from those of 
>students from other language backgrounds; they are also different from

>English-speaking adults with limited reading or writing skills. 
>
>We can only expect this situation to grow in the US, since there are
now 
>more than 60 countries in which English is an official language and 
>children have some (often limited) opportunity to speak English,
though 
>their education in that language may be limited.  Again, however,
those 
>who have substantial education in whatever variety of English will not

>have as much difficulty in U.S. educational contexts, since educated
(or 
>standard) varieties of English around the world (which are based on 
>written varieties) do not differ nearly as much as oral varieties.
>
>I've provided a website with an article I wrote about this for the 
>ERIC/CLL News Bulletin, "The DO Speak English: World Englishes in U.S.

>Schools" whicht discusses the issue and provides concrete suggestions

>for appropriate instruction, especially for adolescents.  Some of the

>guidelines include:
>--Fostering an atmosphere of respect for different varieties of
English
>--Building on the English varieties students bring to class
>--Focusing on developing written Standard American English
>--Being explicit about differences between students' Englishes and 
>Standard American English
>--Being cautious in interpreting the results of standardized tests in

>English
>--Developing special instructional programs for those with limited 
>literacy or formal schooling
>
>
>
>http://www.cal.org/resources/news/2003summer/sum03newsfinal.pdf 
>
>
>
>JUDITH SINCLAIR wrote:
>
>>Once again, we appreciate Ms. Chitester's comments,
>>and we most certainly welcome other responses to our original
request.
>>
>>Thank you.
>>
>>Dr. Judith Sinclair
>>Sinclair & Associates International, LLC
>>Main Office: Washington, DC
>>
>>
>>
>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>From: "Deborah Jill Chitester MS CCC SLP" <djcslp@slllc.org>
>>To: "Multiple recipients of list" <nifl-esl@literacy.nifl.gov>
>>Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 5:54 PM
>>Subject: [NIFL-ESL:11040] Re: Thank You and Continued Search for
Caribbean 
>>Students Information
>>
>>
>>  
>>
>>>Further, students who self identify as English speaking may be not 
>>>reliable
>>>and often are not. English literate CALP and English basic BICs are
very
>>>different. Self identification should be eliminated via a
standardized
>>>measure or some other informal instrument.The response was not a
review 
>>>but
>>>consisted of guesses based on sketchy, incomplete info needed for a
valid
>>>comrpehensive response. I am sorry if this offends you which it
appears 
>>>but
>>>I am an expert in this area and do these case analyses daily and
know what
>>>info needs to be supplied. if the info is not available, then the
>>>implication is more needs to be done on your end to exclude or
include
>>>various phenomena as accounting for various issues etc you note and
>>>observe.Thank you ....I feel somewhat uncomfortable by your response
and
>>>lord knows I am busy so for now I m signing off. Thanks
>>>******************************************************************
>>>DEBORAH JILL CHITESTER M.S.,CCC/SLP
>>>Bilingual Speech-Language Pathologist
>>>Second Language, Literacy & Learning Connection, LLC
>>>  -Attaining Success for Second Language Learners-
>>>Web Site: www.SLLLC.org 
>>>E-mail: djcslp@slllc.org 
>>>732-398-1796(Tel/Fax),  732-642-5118 (cell)
>>>Confidentiality Notice: This transmission may contain information
that is
>>>privileged,
>>>confidential and/or exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If
you 
>>>are
>>>not
>>>the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any
disclosure,
>>>copying,
>>>distribution, or use of the information contained herein including
any
>>>reliance
>>>thereon is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you received this transmission in

>>>error,
>>>please immediately contact the sender and destroy the material in
its
>>>entirety,
>>>whether in electronic or hard copy format. Thank you.
>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>From: "Deborah J.C. MS CCC/SLP" <deb_bil_slp@yahoo.com>
>>>To: "Multiple recipients of list" <nifl-esl@literacy.nifl.gov>
>>>Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 5:46 PM
>>>Subject: [NIFL-ESL:11039] Re: Thank You and Continued Search for
Caribbean
>>>Students Information
>>>
>>>
>>>    
>>>
>>>>I appreciate your response but much more info is needed to answer
you
>>>>properly-I know what you seek but info is missing. If someone can
answer
>>>>this  comprehensively with the info supplied, then I am doing
something
>>>>wrong. And I know this is not the case. Sorry again. Gotta run-got
some
>>>>publishing deadlines-look forward to seeing if I am missing
something.
>>>>******************************************************************
>>>>DEBORAH JILL CHITESTER M.S.,CCC/SLP
>>>>Bilingual Speech-Language Pathologist
>>>>Second Language, Literacy & Learning Connection, LLC
>>>>  -Attaining Success for Second Language Learners-
>>>>Web Site: www.SLLLC.org 
>>>>E-mail: djcslp@slllc.org 
>>>>732-398-1796(Tel/Fax),  732-642-5118 (cell)
>>>>Confidentiality Notice: This transmission may contain information
that is
>>>>privileged,
>>>>confidential and/or exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If
you
>>>>are
>>>>not
>>>>the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any
disclosure,
>>>>copying,
>>>>distribution, or use of the information contained herein including
any
>>>>reliance
>>>>thereon is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you received this transmission
in
>>>>error,
>>>>please immediately contact the sender and destroy the material in
its
>>>>entirety,
>>>>whether in electronic or hard copy format. Thank you.
>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>From: "JUDITH SINCLAIR" <j-p-sinclair@worldnet.att.net>
>>>>To: "Multiple recipients of list" <nifl-esl@literacy.nifl.gov>
>>>>Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 5:17 PM
>>>>Subject: [NIFL-ESL:11038] Thank You and Continued Search for
Caribbean
>>>>Students Information
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>      
>>>>
>>>>>Our thanks to Deborah Jill Chitester MS CCC SLP for her excellent
review
>>>>>of
>>>>>our request.
>>>>>We welcome all responses, and look forward to hearing from our 
>>>>>colleagues
>>>>>through NIFL-ESL.
>>>>>
>>>>>Dr. Judith Sinclair
>>>>>Sinclair & Associates International, LLC
>>>>>Main Office: Washington, DC
>>>>>
>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>From: "Deborah Jill Chitester MS CCC SLP" <djcslp@slllc.org>
>>>>>To: "Multiple recipients of list" <nifl-esl@literacy.nifl.gov>
>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 5:06 PM
>>>>>Subject: [NIFL-ESL:11037] Re: PS to Search for support materials
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>        
>>>>>
>>>>>>Much more info is needed to answer this question appropriately.
How 
>>>>>>long
>>>>>>are
>>>>>>these Carribean students in the US? What is their level of
>>>>>>acculturation?
>>>>>>Very often people who are second language learners identify
themselves
>>>>>>as
>>>>>>English speaking for political purposes and due to such pressures
when
>>>>>>in
>>>>>>reality this is not the case. An ethnographic interview
detailing
>>>>>>language
>>>>>>background and use and level of acculturation is very important.
I am
>>>>>>currently putting together a comprehsive guide to how this should

>>>>>>occur.
>>>>>>Until these answers are obtained, it is hard to answer re:
reading
>>>>>>comprehension..Second language acquisition and acculturation as
well as
>>>>>>eliminating lang problems as an etiology is critical.
>>>>>>******************************************************************
>>>>>>DEBORAH JILL CHITESTER M.S.,CCC/SLP
>>>>>>Bilingual Speech-Language Pathologist
>>>>>>Second Language, Literacy & Learning Connection, LLC
>>>>>>  -Attaining Success for Second Language Learners-
>>>>>>Web Site: www.SLLLC.org 
>>>>>>E-mail: djcslp@slllc.org 
>>>>>>732-398-1796(Tel/Fax),  732-642-5118 (cell)
>>>>>>Confidentiality Notice: This transmission may contain information
that
>>>>>>is
>>>>>>privileged,
>>>>>>confidential and/or exempt from disclosure under applicable law.
If you
>>>>>>are
>>>>>>not
>>>>>>the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any
disclosure,
>>>>>>copying,
>>>>>>distribution, or use of the information contained herein
including any
>>>>>>reliance
>>>>>>thereon is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you received this transmission
in
>>>>>>error,
>>>>>>please immediately contact the sender and destroy the material in
its
>>>>>>entirety,
>>>>>>whether in electronic or hard copy format. Thank you.
>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>From: "JUDITH SINCLAIR" <j-p-sinclair@worldnet.att.net>
>>>>>>To: "Multiple recipients of list" <nifl-esl@literacy.nifl.gov>
>>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 4:39 PM
>>>>>>Subject: [NIFL-ESL:11036] PS to Search for support materials
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>          
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Thanks to all of you who have taken time to read our message. 
We have
>>>>>>>had
>>>>>>>several interesting responses, and a few good questions.  We
would 
>>>>>>>like
>>>>>>>to
>>>>>>>provide additional information to our request for information 
>>>>>>>regarding
>>>>>>>Caribbean students' literacy progress in U. S. jobs and schools:
It is
>>>>>>>our
>>>>>>>experience working with Caribbean students that they consider
English
>>>>>>>as
>>>>>>>their first language.  The assure us that they are first and
foremost
>>>>>>>English speaking, and that they are  neither ESL or bilingual. 
Yet, 
>>>>>>>it
>>>>>>>is
>>>>>>>also our experience that many of these students face
significant
>>>>>>>challenges
>>>>>>>when they are presented with standard tests for professional and

>>>>>>>school
>>>>>>>work.  We are looking for more information regarding Caribbean 
>>>>>>>students
>>>>>>>who
>>>>>>>consider English as their first language, and their ability to
take
>>>>>>>professional and school tests.  For example, are they
compromised in
>>>>>>>reading
>>>>>>>comprehension tests?  Do they do well in their writing sample
tests?
>>>>>>>If
>>>>>>>so,
>>>>>>>why?  If not, why?  We are interested in a variety of
perspectives, 
>>>>>>>and
>>>>>>>appreciate your response.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Thank you again.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Dr. Judith Sinclair
>>>>>>>Sinclair & Associates International, LLC
>>>>>>>Main Office: Washington, DC
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>From: "Deborah J.C. MS CCC/SLP" <deb_bil_slp@yahoo.com>
>>>>>>>To: "Multiple recipients of list" <nifl-esl@literacy.nifl.gov>
>>>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 1:49 PM
>>>>>>>Subject: [NIFL-ESL:11035] Re: Search for support materials
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>            
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Please check my site and email me privately re: some pieces I
have
>>>>>>>>written.
>>>>>>>>******************************************************************
>>>>>>>>DEBORAH JILL CHITESTER M.S.,CCC/SLP
>>>>>>>>Bilingual Speech-Language Pathologist
>>>>>>>>Second Language, Literacy & Learning Connection, LLC
>>>>>>>>  -Attaining Success for Second Language Learners-
>>>>>>>>Web Site: www.SLLLC.org 
>>>>>>>>E-mail: djcslp@slllc.org 
>>>>>>>>732-398-1796(Tel/Fax),  732-642-5118 (cell)
>>>>>>>>Confidentiality Notice: This transmission may contain
information 
>>>>>>>>that
>>>>>>>>is
>>>>>>>>privileged,
>>>>>>>>confidential and/or exempt from disclosure under applicable
law. If
>>>>>>>>you
>>>>>>>>are
>>>>>>>>not
>>>>>>>>the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any
disclosure,
>>>>>>>>copying,
>>>>>>>>distribution, or use of the information contained herein
including 
>>>>>>>>any
>>>>>>>>reliance
>>>>>>>>thereon is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you received this
transmission in
>>>>>>>>error,
>>>>>>>>please immediately contact the sender and destroy the material
in its
>>>>>>>>entirety,
>>>>>>>>whether in electronic or hard copy format. Thank you.
>>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>From: "JUDITH SINCLAIR" <j-p-sinclair@worldnet.att.net>
>>>>>>>>To: "Multiple recipients of list" <nifl-esl@literacy.nifl.gov>
>>>>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 1:33 PM
>>>>>>>>Subject: [NIFL-ESL:11034] Search for support materials
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Hello:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>As part of our work we look at various cultures that are
>>>>>>>>>relatively/new
>>>>>>>>>to
>>>>>>>>>America to determine how to best address their educational
needs. 
>>>>>>>>>We
>>>>>>>>>are
>>>>>>>>>currently looking for materials, papers, personal narratives,

>>>>>>>>>journal
>>>>>>>>>articles and the like that discuss challenges students from
the
>>>>>>>>>Caribbean
>>>>>>>>>islands face when they come to the United States to attend
school or
>>>>>>>>>obtain
>>>>>>>>>work. We are most interested in reading comprehension
problems, and
>>>>>>>>>Caribbean students' ability to successfully pass written
school and
>>>>>>>>>professional tests.  If anyone has information regarding this
topic,
>>>>>>>>>please
>>>>>>>>>let us know.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Thank you.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Dr. Judith Sinclair
>>>>>>>>>Sinclair & Associates International, LLC
>>>>>>>>>Main Office: Washington, DC
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>___________________________________________________________
>>>>>$0 Web Hosting with up to 200MB web space, 1000 MB Transfer
>>>>>10 Personalized POP and Web E-mail Accounts, and much more.
>>>>>Signup at www.doteasy.com 
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>        
>>>>>
>>>>      
>>>>
>>>    
>>>
>>
>>
>>  
>>
>
>-- 
>JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall
>Professor and Director
>Language, Literacy and Culture Ph.D. Program
>University of Maryland Baltimore County (UMBC)
>1000 Hilltop Circle
>Baltimore, MD 21250
>
>tel:    410-455-2313
>fax:    410-455-8947
>email:  crandall@umbc.edu 
>www.umbc.edu/llc 
>www.umbc.edu/esol 
>
>

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