Hi Joan, thanks for all the details. Your approach also speaks to the earlier discussions during the week with Martha on how to prepare students for the workplace or how to work with students who are already working but need to upgrade their skills.  Setting up stations, demonstrating how to fix or build something and building functional language skills (double checking; asking for clarification) really acts as a simulation of sorts for the hands-on training that LEP trainees receive in good integrated training programs. At El Paso community college, LEP students build an actual house in the parking lot – they share the same language with their co-workers (Spanish) but the supervisor/trainer is a mono-lingual English speaker so English has to be used to communicate (along with pointing and acting things out).

It makes sense to combine doing the work, learning English, and getting a sense of how the culture works all at once since language learning  is likely to go deeper when all those connections are made.  As for encouraging workers to double check (“is that right?”), when we did curriculum work in California (with Ford Foundation money), we actually built in “mumbling” so that students couldn’t possibly understand directions (“could you hand me five of the mumble mumbles, please”) and had to ask for clarification in order to complete the task.

Personally, I don’t think we are using enough tools and assorted gear in ESL classes that have a work theme – we’ve used variations of the Artifact Activity (where everyone brings in an item that is meaningful to them and tells others “what it is – what it does – and why it is important to them”). Students bring in tools (including kitchen tools) that reflect the work they do, or what they like doing, and tell others about it – there’s lots of authentic communication, driven by the “need to tell” and the “need to know”.

In terms of speaking with English speakers who are not teachers, it makes a lot of sense to structure interactions with staff in the program since they are part of a sheltered environment where students are more likely to take risks. I’ve worked with one teacher who sent her students to various offices to ask for information or just to chat. She had prepped staff ahead of time to let them know that students would be coming around and to please be kind and speak slowly and ask some simple questions. Once the ice was broken, short conversations ensued on a regular basis.  In another program, we had students do a one question survey, asking everyone from the custodial staff to cafeteria workers to secretaries “How did you get your job?” (we did it as a project and had “interview teams” – where one student asked the question; another handled the tape recorder, while a third took filled out a chart noting who they talked with).  Students not only used English for their interviews but gained cultural knowledge as well – by talking to the cafeteria worker, they found out about the free lunch program at school.

Cool program – thanks Joan

Heide

Heide Spruck Wrigley
Mesilla, NM

From: englishlanguage-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:englishlanguage-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Joan
Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 10:20 AM
To: The Adult English Language Learners Discussion List
Subject: [EnglishLanguage 3840] Re: bringing the outside in

Heide, this sounds similar to activities I've used to prepare students for the workplace.  Since a lot of our students ended up in assembly positions, I went out and got some building sets that included plastic nuts and bolts and boards, wheels and axles - all kinds of parts.  We did a lot of different exercises with this set.  In one activity, I would hand parts out to the students, demonstrate how to assemble a particular "machine," and then ask them to watch (listen, of course) and follow my directions.  They had to do everything exactly as I demonstrated it.  If they did not (which was always the case), I could correct them with visual as well as linguistic cues.  There was a lot of context, a lot of visual cues, and a lot of language.  They didn't have to produce a lot of language during this activity, but they learned HOW to ask, "Is this right?"  Since the activity had a cultural as well as a linguistic purpose, however, it was also important that they learn the cultural expectation TO ASK the question, "Is this right?"

One complaint that employers always have is that immigrants and refugees (well, all employees in general) don't ask enough questions and thus make many mistakes, resulting in decreased production and quality.  Too many throw-aways and people lose their jobs.

There's a lot of other situations you can set up with a simple building set like this:  send students to the part room to ask for a part, set up stations for assemblers and quality control personnel so the students are interacting with each other to produce (and even design) a product, have them return parts to their correct bin in in the part room (alphanumeric order).

As to your question about how to extend this beyond the classroom, I was working in a great building.  The top (2nd) floor was all ESL. The first floor had the community ed office and daycare, where our students' children were. Everybody in the  building knew everybody else.  So, sometimes situations arose that required interaction with different rooms in the building.  For example, we would be in the middle of an exercise and suddently run out of staples or paper, so I would ask a student to run to the office and get somer staples. They always had the language they needed to complete this task, and they always did it because it was very low stress - they already knew everybody in the building.

Whether or not they actually do it at work - that's another question all together.  Even though employers say they want people to ask questions, they're not always patient and encouraging to people who do so.



----- Original Message -----
From: Wrigley, Heide<mailto:heide at literacywork.com>
To: The Adult English Language Learners Discussion List<mailto:englishlanguage at nifl.gov>
Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 12:43 AM
Subject: [EnglishLanguage 3837] bringing the outside in

Thanks, Steve and to others who have written privately to ask for more information. Again, this is a bit long for a post but you can skip to the end to see a question that speaks to the perennial issue of promoting and achieving “authentic language use” inside and outside of the classroom.

To start, I just wanted to clarify my role a bit. I’m not running an actual class at this time, though I’ve taught all levels of adult ESL.

Rather, I’m involved in a number of research to practice projects . As part of this work, I work with teachers who sign up for professional development institutes, mostly through the Texas GREAT Centers  (free to them; some even get a stipend to attend and do a project.)  As part of this PD, I conduct demonstration lessons in German to help teachers (who don’t know any German) to see how difficult it is to “get” a language when bits and pieces of the language are presented in a decontextualized way and how relatively easy it is to understand what’s going on if the context is clear, the concepts and the language are somewhat familiar (Oktoberfest activates a bit of schema right away), and there is visual support to help get the point across. The teachers then try a similar approach with their students (most of whom are beginning ESL students with few years of education in the home country- some are refugees, many are immigrants).

We schlep in food and drinks and all sort of pictures and stuff (playing cards, toy cell phones, signal cards) to teach functional language (Moechten Sie ein Glass Wein oder ein Glass Bier?   – it’s orange or apple juice for Muslim students – Seeing the bottles being offered tends to get the point across rather quickly (and because students only hear the language, they don’t get caught in trying to figure out what “moechten Sie?” means, they just react to the situation of someone offering them something. (And no, it’s not actual alcohol – just fake stuff like in the movies) –

Teachers can just point to indicate their preference but I do ask them to say “Danke” or the L1 equivalent  when they get what they wanted– In my book, going through a “silent period” in language learning does not excuse you from being polite. We do allow for some processing time, however ☺ - deer in the headlights, confusion, an aha moment, and an expression of gratitude is often the sequence.

We talk about what makes the experience difficult (getting lost in between) and what makes it easier (repetition and a chance to catch on; relaxing and not trying too hard to understand every word.) Since the oral language is coming at you fairly quickly, there’s little time to translate word for word – you just catch what you can and try to react .. (Banane oder Apfel?)  Teachers get a chance to try the same interaction in a small group where they end up helping each other and encouraging each other. Lots of modeling and helping others by those who are a bit quicker to catch on.

Later on, we ease into reading (just listening while seeing the print; a bit of echo reading to get how sounds and print relate to each other. Only later do we try to sort out how German works (lots of invitation to “notice” patterns and a bit of “discovery grammar” to help them wrap their minds around the language).


Since teaching teachers is not the same as teaching students, I sometimes “borrow” a class from a teacher to do a demonstration lesson in her classroom so that the teacher can see how her students react to this kind of approach.  So that’s why I was referring to students.  Of course, while the demonstration lessons are in German for the teachers, the demos with students are in English –

And yes, the point is absolutely to give students strategies that will help them learn on their own – not just after they leave a class, but while they are still in a class. Lots of assignments that ask students to pay attention and use the language outside of the classroom. Given the retention rates of adult ESL, helping student use strategies for language learning has to be part of the work we do.

But that’s a whole other discussion –

Here is my question:  What is it that others do to have beginning level students use English outside of the classroom (other than admonishing them to do so?) or, conversely, what are the barriers you are encountering?

Best

Heide

P.S. The practice of using authentic materials and “Bringing in the Outside” – is one that the study of What Works in Adult ESL Literacy?  that Larry Condelli and I were involved in found promising.




From: englishlanguage-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:englishlanguage-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Steve Kaufmann
Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 1:47 PM
To: The Adult English Language Learners Discussion List
Subject: [EnglishLanguage 3833] Re: cognates as part of meaningful input and enthusiastic uptake

Heide,

It sounds like you run an excellent class.

Steve Kaufmann
www.lingq.com<http://www.lingq.com>
On 2/2/09, Wrigley, Heide <heide at literacywork.com<mailto:heide at literacywork.com>> wrote:

Steve – I don't think our views are mutually exclusive.  I am not advocating that students learn cognates out of context but when context and content is provided to students who have NO ENGLISH to start, it makes sense to start with meaningful input that contains ideas, concepts, words etc that are already somewhat familiar to students – so if I tell my students about the recent state elections in Germany – there probably won't be much uptake, even if I use cognates – so the "interest" factor that leads to engagement definitely comes into play



But if the story I tell is one of the Inauguration of the New President, I can build on background knowledge, interest, and familiarity with a number of the words and so can get my point across fairly quickly. I then use a series of compelling pictures from the campaign trail and the Inauguration to support the language students are hearing.



And students do listen to the story over and over; they retell it as best as they can (working with the pictures in pairs and in groups), and then when they are familiar with both the content (which they already know) and the language (which they have now heard several times), the teacher reads the story with them (again presented in PP with captions to keep the association between the visual input, the oral language, and the written language strong.



So the cognates are only a small piece of making language accessible to students so that comprehension is facilitated in ways that engage students and provide early experiences of successful and meaningful learning.



Again, my focus hear is on beginning level adult ESL learners  without much experience in formal schooling.  Also, there is some research (I'll find it) that suggests that new language learners often don't recognize cognates on their own (surprising as this seems), and may need a bit of practice "noticing"  similarities.



Best



Heide











From: englishlanguage-bounces at nifl.gov<mailto:englishlanguage-bounces at nifl.gov> [mailto:englishlanguage-bounces at nifl.gov<mailto:englishlanguage-bounces at nifl.gov>] On Behalf Of Steve Kaufmann
Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 10:58 AM
To: The Adult English Language Learners Discussion List
Subject: [EnglishLanguage 3824] Re: how difficult is English? (even longer)



I have a different perspective on cognates or similarities to my own language, when I start learning a new language. These similarities are often pointed out early in language learning books and CDs. I have never found this information useful, and in fact find it a distraction, and usually ignore this information.

 In my experience the learners are better off discovering the language on their own. They will notice the cognates themselves. It is more important for them to commit to the new language, listening to it, and if possible reading it, over and over, repetitively, until they start to get a feel. The cognates are not that big a help at first, since these cognates may not be the words they need to understant the content they are learning from. Of course, in the long run they are welcome freebees in the gradual discovery of the language, and the more similar the vocabulary the faster the language can be learner, vocabulary accumulation being the major task in language learning.

Steve Kaufmann
www.lingq.com<http://www.lingq.com>

On Mon, Feb 2, 2009 at 9:19 AM, Anne Whiteside <awhitesi at ccsf.edu<mailto:awhitesi at ccsf.edu>> wrote:

Speaking of language distance, I've found that working with bilingual Spanish speakers whose first language is in the Mayan family, those whove already bridged the huge divide between Maya and Spanish are relatively quick at the early phase of English; I've heard lots of anecdotal support for this. Students have told me that word order ( adj. noun) and pronunciation is easy for them because it's similar in Maya, whereas this aspect of English often throws Spanish speakers off, and cognates are easy for them because of Spanish. So I agree with Heide that making teachers aware of the linguistic base students come with and drawing attention to these resources, rather than those that are undeveloped (literacy) is super important for students with less formal education.

Anne Whiteside


>>> heide at literacywork.com<mailto:heide at literacywork.com> 02/01/09 7:51 PM >>>

Greetings all

I wanted to take up the issue of English learning and “language distance† one last time (I promise) and it’s an even longer note. But if you just skip to the end and consider the question, we can perhaps move toward a thoughtful conversation on the topic.

Mhmm, English does indeed have Germanic roots but over the years, many other languages, especially the Romance languages have been grafted onto English and influenced both its structure and its vocabulary. For example, we've lost all those Germanic verb endings - plus the "thee" and "thous" along the way and gained a tremendous amount of Latin-based words, all easily accessible to speakers of Romance languages. Since Britain was part of the Roman Empire, quite a few new words related to the courts and the law came from Latin-based languages and many ended up on our tables after 1066 and the Norman invasion of Britain (Battle of Hastings, anyone?) - so that we now eat beef or, if you are so inclined venison (from the French language the nobility used ) but get the meat from cows and deer (the Germanic words the farmers used) â€"

In terms of teaching then, it makes sense to capitalize on similarities in languages and show Spanish speakers, for example, that there are close relationships in sentence structure (Subject-Predicate- Object) and vocabulary between the two languages that can be exploited to make English easier to understand for beginners (construcion â€" becomes construction; integracion becomes integration and inauguration .. well, you get the picture).

I am always amazed that teachers who only have Spanish speakers in their classes (and there are many of those at the beginning level), start their teaching with Germanic based words (which have all those complicated spelling patterns) instead of creating early success experiences by introducing (oral) texts that use words that students can, with a little practice in cognate awareness, understand quite easily â€" The United States of America is a nation of immigrants â€"is understood more readily by a Spanish speaker than if we use “our country† or “this land† is used to refer to the US. While these types of sentences may not be the highest priority for everyday functioning, they nevertheless help to build a foundation in English that students can build on â€" plus get across a sense from the start that learning English, although not easy, may nevertheless is “doable† â€" whereas learning all the different sounds that English “e† can make, does indeed feel overwhelming.  Â

So I didn't mean to make the case that because my first language is German, English was easy for me (it wasn't). I meant to point out that all things being equal (which, admittedly, they never are) - "language distance" does matter.  That is, if I speak French and Spanish, learning Italian is not that much of a stretch and won't require the same effort that say, learning Chinese or, for that matter, Tamil would (given the same interest in the language, opportunity to learn, and aptitude)

An Eric Digest on language learning cites this example: At the Defense Language Institute in Monterey, California, for example, languages are placed in four categories depending on their average learning difficulty from the perspective of a native English speaker. The basic intensive language course, which brings a student to an intermediate level, can be as short as 24 weeks for languages such as Dutch or Spanish, which are Indo European languages and use the same writing system as English, or as long as 65 weeks for languages such as Arabic or Korean, which are members of other language families and use different writing systems.

So while “language distance† is not the only factor that makes language learning difficult or easy (there may be other, more important, individual factors), it definitely is a factor. And for L2 literacy development, not just general L2 acquisition which I am focusing on, the level of literacy in L1 seems to override other factors. In quite a few classes, I have seen educated Chinese speakers pick up English literacy much more quickly (after initial struggles) than Spanish speakers whose L1 literacy skills were a bit shaky.

I am wondering what the experiences of others have been who teach mixed classes where those without much education in the home country are placed in ESL Literacy classes side by side with students who are highly literate in L1 but have not yet acquired English of any sort, spoken or written. Â

Best

Heide Spruck Wrigley
Mesilla, NM



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