The process in the United States is not so different from the one you described.   I know this from personal experience.



Darlene



  _____

From: englishlanguage-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:englishlanguage-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Teresa Durkin
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 1:26 PM
To: The Adult English Language Learners Discussion List
Subject: [EnglishLanguage 2916] Re: US Immigration flow-chart



I appreciate the attempt at levity.  As I read some of the comments regarding the chart, it brings back vivid memories - of other countries!



Have you tried becoming "legal" in another country other than just on a tourist visa?  My family and I have in two countries.  To just go live as a normal person - to just get into the country not as a tourist - took us 2 1/2 years, finger prints and reports done by the FBI and our local law enforcement, physicals for all of us including chest x-rays and blood work, provision to the nearest embassy of no less than 3 certified copies of birth certificates (for all 5 in our family) and marriage license, plus the fees to have them officially stamped at the embassy, translation fees, and residency visa fees, and several visits to that country's consulate.  This all amounted to thousands of dollars.  Then, we had to repeat the residency visa fees, reams of "other" paperwork, and have the patience of Job to be repeatedly told, "That's not the right paper" or "Come tomorrow, we're too busy today", "No, we don't make appointments" plus a list of myriad other excuses every year for five years!  Then, we were good for five years before repeating it all again.  We did it because it was their law and we were guests in their country.  We were not allowed to hold jobs that would take from their economy.  We had to report to the local police station upon our arrival.  If we had not done so in a certain number of days, they would have come looking for us. Now, all of this was just to be a temporary resident, not to become a citizen.  I can't even begin to describe the frustrations and fears we experienced.  We were actually threatened with having to leave the county "immediately" with nothing but the clothes on our backs - all because the officials couldn't agree on how to renew our visas!



Both of these countries are friendly toward the USA.  My questions are these:  Is it okay for other countries to have laws regarding the entrance of "immigrants", but not for the US?  If so, why?  Why would any country just allow anyone to come in with no standards what-so-ever?  Should we just have open borders among all countries?  Is it okay to break the laws of one country because you don't agree with them or don't understand them?  When a person's first act upon entering the country is to break the host country's laws, I believe there should be consequences.  Certainly, we may need to revise our immigration system; I don't disagree with that.  Our system is flawed and very convoluted - no more so than the ones we had to go through, however.  (My husband actually flew to the capital city of the one country, spoke with the "head" of immigration and got nowhere!)  We have laws for a reason.  If we feel we have the right to pick and choose which we obey, we'll soon become like some of the countries these people come from.



These are just some thoughts from one who has been on the other side of the issue.  In the countries where we were, had we been in violation of their immigration laws, we would not have necessarily just been deported - which, by the way, they don't pay for - the individual does.  We could have very easily ended up in one of their prisons. And guess what?  They don't have any rules protecting foreigners from torture either. Their rules protecting their citizens do not apply to foreigners.



I give each of my ESL studens the name, address, and phone number of a bilingual attorney who helps immigrants.  Most are not interested in the least.  However, one of my students just returned from Mexico as a legal resident now.  She had to return to Mexico for about 14 months.  The attorney told her, "If you had come in legally in the first place, you would have saved about $6,000, and the time required to return to Mexico would have been far less than the 14 months."  If she would have just come in on a tourist visa and would have begun the process immediately, the attorney said it would have been much cheaper and simpler.



Just some thoughts!



Teresa

Lakeview Adult Learning Center



On 9/25/08, Brian, Dr Donna J G <djgbrian at utk.edu> wrote:

How about a little levity?  See this chart.



Follow this link for the original chart site. http://www.reason.com/images/07cf533ddb1d06350cf1ddb5942ef5ad.jpg



And here's the article about the flow chart that explains the various paths to legal immigration:

 <http://www.boingboing.net/2008/09/24/reasons-guide-to-leg.html> http://www.boingboing.net/2008/09/24/reasons-guide-to-leg.html





Donna Brian

Center for Literacy Studies at The University of Tennessee

djgbrian at utk.edu


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