I do so hate to be treated as an idiot.

There may well be an overlap in the two realms you mention, that is,  
locating information and deducing something from it, as in  1.  
looking up campaign money information and 2. wondering if it  
influences voting behavior, is in the realm of overlap.  You take  
something simple and ask a question of it, which may lead to other  
work in finding more patterns.  The 2 may go together, may be part of  
a pre-existing train of thought, as in, as in "money, I wonder about  
its influence, if there is one, in elections."

And the student may be building on the implicit suggestion from the  
teacher--why did the teacher bring this (money) up in the first place?

Andrea


On Jul 29, 2009, at 5:31 PM, Michael A. Gyori wrote:


> Hello Andrea and all,

>

>

>

> I’m not sure I understand your response.  You appear to be  

> disagreeing with something that I didn’t write, or intend to write.

>

>

>

> My point was one of distinguishing locating information and  

> thinking critically.  If I show a student a list of campaign  

> contributors and ask how much a particular person contributed, the  

> process is one of finding surface text information.  That, in and  

> of itself, is not an act of critical thinking.

>

>

>

> On the other hand, if there is a purpose for the search other than  

> finding information, that may very well be a different matter. For  

> example, if a student is looking for a contributor to determine  

> whether to vote for a candidate, then we are no longer dealing with  

> surface text features but with their use for a particular purpose  

> (such as not to vote for that candidate).  That process may very  

> well reflect critical thinking patterns.

>

>

>

> I believe that literature on reading strategies and reading  

> comprehension measurement rubrics will support this view.

>

>

>

> Hopefully this clarifies a potential misunderstanding.

>

>

>

> Michael

>

>

>

> From: englishlanguage-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:englishlanguage- 

> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Andrea Wilder

> Sent: Wednesday, July 29, 2009 8:49 AM

> To: The Adult English Language Learners Discussion List

> Subject: [EnglishLanguage 4649] Re: computers for families programs 

> +learnerempowerment

>

>

>

> I don't agree.

>

>

>

> Politicians present themselves in certain ways, show certain faces  

> to the world.  Do we accept this performance, or do we probe to see  

> what is in back of it? We test it out, I hope.  Who gives to the  

> politicians campaign will influence matter, I think, and I want to  

> know how the politician is likely to vote on certain matters-- 

> development, say.  This may influence who I will vote for in the  

> fall elections.

>

>

>

> Before you locate who gives what, there is an impetus to find this  

> out, for some reason it seems important to have this knowledge....

>

>

>

> HOW ABOUT THE LOBBYISTS WHO GIVE HUGE SUMS TO WASHINGTON POLS TO  

> INFLUENCE THEIR VOTE ON HEALTH CARE?

>

>

>

> Andrea

>

>

>

>

>

> On Jul 29, 2009, at 1:28 PM, Michael A. Gyori wrote:

>

>

>

>

> Hello Andrea and all,

>

>

>

> “…finding out who contributes how much to campaigns” is in and of  

> itself not critical thinking but an act of locating information.   

> Critical thinking comes in when an individual has a reason for  

> accessing that information (what can I do with it and why?) and  

> perhaps the wherewithal how to do so.

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> <image001.jpg>

>

>

>

> Michael A. Gyori, M.A. TESOL

>

> Owner-Teacher

>

> Maui International Language School

>

> Phone 808.205.2101 (U.S.A.)

>

> Fax 808.891.2237 (U.S.A.)

>

> E-mail mgyori at mauilanguage.com

>

> Website www.mauilanguage.com

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> From: englishlanguage-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:englishlanguage- 

> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Andrea Wilder

> Sent: Wednesday, July 29, 2009 5:27 AM

> To: The Adult English Language Learners Discussion List

> Subject: [EnglishLanguage 4640] Re: computers for families programs 

> +learnerempowerment

>

>

>

> Academic work requires critical thinking as studies are built on  

> each other.  The student has to find the crevice in between the  

> arguments if she is too "colonize" this site independently.  This  

> requires a different type of brain work--questioning.  The Thai  

> student mastered a rubric she could use to judge the validity of   

> the articles she studied with different criteria.  it is a  

> necessary skill to be mastered if one is to achieve a good grade.  

> Enough lee-way was given by teachers that she could choose the  

> material and topics she wanted to master and write on that.

>

>

>

> I should imagine that critical thinking around elections would be  

> of use to students coming to the US.  Example: finding out who  

> contributes how much to campaigns.

>

>

>

> Andrea

>

>

>

>

>

> On Jul 29, 2009, at 10:52 AM, Steve Kaufmann wrote:

>

>

>

>

>

> The brain learns from experience and massive input of information.  

> It seeks to create patterns from this anarchy of stimulus using  

> comparisons and metaphors. The brain is neither precise nor logical  

> in organizing this information. The Thai student will form her own  

> ideas from a variety of input, so will the student of French. I  

> think that the role of the language teacher is to allow the student  

> to learn the language from content of interest to him or her. It is  

> not to impose ways of thinking.

>

> Each teacher's approach to critical thinking will be individual to  

> him or her.  As long as the teacher's ideas were presented in the  

> language I was learning, and to the extent that I found them of  

> interest, I would listen. I would not just accept them. If I found  

> these views uninteresting it would turn me off. Especially if I  

> felt the teacher was preaching at me or trying to tell me how to  

> interpret what I read.

>

>

>

>

> -- 

> Steve Kaufmann

> www.thelinguist.blogs.com

> www.lingq.com

> 604-922-8514

>

> ----------------------------------------------------

>

> National Institute for Literacy

>

> Adult English Language Learners mailing list

>

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>

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>

>

>

> <image001.jpg>

>

> ----------------------------------------------------

>

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>

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>

> EnglishLanguage at nifl.gov

>

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>

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>

>

>

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> EnglishLanguage at nifl.gov

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