Waconda, I appreciate your post, and I think I can explain the "deadly oppression of audio-lingualism." That was a method that relied if memory serves only on situational phrases that were learned verbatim without students' seeing the written form, let alone knowing the grammar, which allowed for no creativity in putting the pieces together to form independent sentences, a la Chomsky. Sort of like, and I'm goig to open a can of worms here, doing whole language without any phonemic or vocabulary embedding. I know we are all embroiled in the debates about when/if to teach grammar in a communicative setting. My understanding is that communicative language that's complemented by some kind of structure (grammar, syntax, vocabulary) os what's turned out to work best. A new French text I'll be using has a separate grammar section to be learned independently by students, and it's introduced by Krashen! I've tried the grammar/structure enhanced comunicative
 approach and that doesn't work either. 
However, the real reason I responded is the point you made about many teachers having been star students, which makes us interested, passionate, and informed about our ffield of study and, I would venture, many others as well. This reminder is well worth our while to note that many of our students, for whatever reason, aren't quick studies, do not have intrinsic learning motivation, which I can't imagine, are not, without a great deal of motivation, interested in learning just for the sake of learning, do not find "reading for fun" a viable concept unless they're "interested" in what they read, and they're hard put to define what "interested" means. My current academic population, and thus my current filter, is very similar to that described so eloquently by Susan Jones (Academic Development Specialist Center for Academic Success Parkland College Champaign, IL  61821217-353-2056 sujones at parkland.edu Webmastress, http://www.resourceroom.net
 http://bicyclecu.blogspot.com ), the underprepared college student. 
And yet I don't feel I'm incapacitated by this kind of student, just that this kind of learnig/teaching learning style/history requires some kind of adult ed background to understand the population, the culture that's emerging, which is why language learning, even if it's students needing to learn standar academic language as opposed to their street/buds/texting etc. language (not to mention ELLs or LDs). It's these factors that have I think unjustly, led some faculty to condemn the a "bipolar classroom," where some get it and a lot don't. That's another way to desribe a differentiated classroom, or multi-level, which if we're English/language teachers or adult ed we're in all the time. Such teachers need to learn a whole new way of interacting with the current generation; I find my adult returning students to be a breath of fresh air and sanity, but I do try to understand and educate as much as possible the current younger learners, who have as many
 barriers as ABE or ESL students on a different register. This is where I believe technology and multi-media instruction is essental, or the PDA/cell phone/iPod apps, getting us out of the box. I've never wanted to be the sage on the stage, but very often students want to put me there, and see wanting to form circles for easier communication to be "kindergarten." I try to be the guide on the side, but there has to be some intrinsic motivation there for that to work. 
A long rant, and I'm sorry. But I've been trying to find ways to begin writing an article on the adult first-year transition couse I've been teaching, and I'm brainstorming on you guys. Thanks for your patience.
Bonnie Odiorne, Writing Center, Post University


________________________________

From: Waconda Clayworth <wclayworth at yahoo.com>
To: The Adult English Language Learners Discussion List <englishlanguage at nifl.gov>
Sent: Thursday, June 4, 2009 11:25:36 AM
Subject: [EnglishLanguage 4387] Re: [Technology 2056] Re: teachers as language learners

Hi and I am not sure why this appeared on my e-mail, but certainly
interesting....many teachers were star students which makes them
interested and to use this decades current buzz- passionate about
what they are doing-and informed...but many students are not
quick studies and even if it seems tedious need to acquire and
get language repeatedly without the deadly oppression of audio
lingualism....and 100 per cent agree that learning a second
language even if one is a quick learner really helps a teacher
to be emphathetic, to really understand that languge learning
is more than a task to be checked off on a to-do list...
I have managed 2 Roman languages and struggled with
an Asiatic one...and not any of that was easy, but think
that patience besides being virtuous can also be a learned
asset....
wec
 Peace in 2009 




________________________________
From: Michael A. Gyori <mgyori at mauilanguage.com>
To: The Technology and Literacy Discussion List <technology at nifl.gov>
Cc: The Adult English Language Learners Discussion List <englishlanguage at nifl.gov>
Sent: Wednesday, June 3, 2009 7:29:29 PM
Subject: [EnglishLanguage 4384] Re: [Technology 2056] Re: teachers as language learners

I'm also posting this interaction to the Adult ELL list, as it primarily
belongs there, I believe...

Hello Gail,

I believe that ESL teachers should have experience learning a second
language at least as a foreign language, and ideally as a second language
(by having had to live for some time in a non-English speaking country).  My
sense if that at least many ESL teachers would further enhance their
teaching abilities by having themselves experienced what they teach.  The
challenges presented by learning how to play the piano or soccer are of a
different kind and may not directly inform issues related to L2 acquisition.


Thanks,

Michael
www.mauilanguage.com 


-----Original Message-----
From: technology-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:technology-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Troy, Gail 
Sent: Tuesday, June 02, 2009 9:40 AM
To: The Technology and Literacy Discussion List
Subject: [Technology 2056] Re: teachers as language learners

Learning other languages (bilingualism) is good; but, teachers need to
learn something out of their comfort zone. That may be another language,
playing an instrument, learning a sports skill, higher math etc; then
the teacher will experience the frustrations that the student
experiences.

Gail Troy, M.Ed
Nelson County Adult GED



-----Original Message-----
From: technology-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:technology-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Paul Rogers
Sent: Tuesday, June 02, 2009 2:15 PM
To: The Technology and Literacy Discussion List
Subject: [Technology 2049] teachers as language learners


Steve Kaufmann raises a very important point: teachers need to learn
other languages.
I refer to it as "putting the shoe on the other foot". 
Paul Rogers
805-258-3310
pumarosa21 at yahoo.com
PUMAROSA.COM


--- On Tue, 6/2/09, Steve Kaufmann <steve at thelinguist.com> wrote:


> From: Steve Kaufmann <steve at thelinguist.com>

> Subject: [Technology 2039] Re: Day 2 question to the list

> To: "The Technology and Literacy Discussion List"

<technology at nifl.gov>

> Date: Tuesday, June 2, 2009, 9:20 AM

> 

> I would also suggest that language teachers be asked to

> spend a little time learning another language using

> technology.

> On Tue, Jun 2, 2009 at 7:12 AM, 

> <adam.kieffer at spps.org>

> wrote:

> 

> 

> 

> "What will it take to help our colleagues (teachers

> and administrators) try

> 

> technology infused teaching and learning, too?"

> 

> 

> 

> I've had the role of technology coordinator for

> about a year now at my

> 

> school, which is the center of a larger, urban ABE program

> and I'm a

> 

> teacher by training. It's been one of my primary roles

> to do just what the

> 

> above question poses. During my experience the past year, I

> noticed that

> 

> several things are needed to help colleagues infuse

> technology into both

> 

> their teaching and learning:

> 

> 

> 

> 1. a desire to learn

> 

> 2. a positive culture of learning in the school/site

> 

> 3. an administration that values, and therefore plans and

> budgets for,

> 

> hardware, tech training and development and expects tech

> and computer

> 

> competency from staff and new hires

> 

> 4. time (for change, for training, for practice, for things

> to grow)

> 

> 5. persistance

> 

> 

> 

> -Adam Kieffer

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> ----------------------------------------------------

> 

> National Institute for Literacy

> 

> Technology and Literacy mailing list

> 

> Technology at nifl.gov

> 

> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please

> go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/technology

> 

> Email delivered to steve at thelinguist.com

> 

> 

> 

> 

> -- 

> Steve Kaufmann

> www.thelinguist.blogs.com

> www.kpwood.com

> 604-922-8514

> 

> 

> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----

> 

> ----------------------------------------------------

> National Institute for Literacy

> Technology and Literacy mailing list

> Technology at nifl.gov

> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please

> go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/technology

> Email delivered to pumarosa21 at yahoo.com



      
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