It is not unusual for certain groups to lobby for the relaxation of the
standards required for certification. Here in British Columbia, Chinese
speaking doctors lobbied for the removal of English language requirements
for obtaining their Canadian doctor status, claiming that Chinese doctors
treat mostly Chinese patients. These issues usually become quite emotional
and the certifying bodies have to fend off  accusations of bigotry and
racism etc. However, even Chinese doctors do not operate in a vacuum, and
quite rightly these pressure have been resisted. It is important, however,
that the English standards be based on the ability to communicate, not some
arbitrary level of grammatical accuracy.

Having said that, there is no question that the ability to communicate
effectively and accurately is one of the most sought after skills by all
employers. This is a fundamental element of competitiveness in the labour
market, not only for non-native speakers. Studies have shown that literacy
in the dominant language, not years of schooling, is the best predictor of
professional success.

Improving language and literacy skills of all members of our society
represents one of the best ways to improve societal and individual
well-being.

Steve Kaufmann
www.lingq.com

On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 6:14 PM, Steinbacher Mikal <
Mikal.Steinbacher at lwtc.edu> wrote:


> I think that is amazing and more than a little bit frightening.  If a

> doctor is treating a patient who doesn't speak the same language as the

> doctor, how on earth do they communicate??? I can't think of any other

> profession where at least profcient  oral communication is critical.  In the

> LPN, RN, and Dental  programs at LWTC, good oral communication skills are

> required for successful completion of the practicums.  Those who don't have

> them, do not get certified.  Even if they got certified, they wouldn't be

> hired!!!!!

>

> Mikal Steinbacher

> Instructor, ABE/ESL/English

> Lake Washington Technical College

>

> ________________________________

>

> From: englishlanguage-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of JoAnn Molnar

> Sent: Wed 4/1/2009 1:45 PM

> To: The Adult English Language Learners Discussion List

> Subject: [EnglishLanguage 4102] Re: certification of pharmacists via TOEFL

>

>

>

> Hi

> I checked the ECFMG (Educational Commission for Foreign Medical

> Graduates) 2009 Information Booklet. In the section Requirements for

> ECFMG Certification: Clinical Skills Component, page 7, it states

>  "IMPORTANT NOTE: Passing performance on an English language profi

> ciency test (such as the Test of English as a Foreign LanguageTM

> [TOEFL®]) is no longer a requirement for ECFMG

> Certifi cation."

>

> It used to be that students had to achieve "a score acceptable to

> ECFMG on an English language proficiency test (such as the Test of

> English as a Foreign Language(tm) [TOEFL®] or the former ECFMG English

> Test)" in addition to passing the clinical skills assessment. Makes

> perfect sense that English language proficiency was tied to CLINICAL

> SKILLS assessments.

>

> Now, it seems this requirement is no longer. Very strange I find this

> change to be--

>

> My neck of the woods  has a large medical community and I often hear

> complaints from native speakers (once they've learned I work in ESL)

> about dealing with non-native speakers-- from doctors to x-ray techs--

> in our local university medical centers, regional hospital, clinics etc.

>

>

> Does anyone know of any other assessment to use as a standard  rather

> than TOEFL or  reinventing the wheel? Our community college has many

> internationals in our medical technology programs and there have

> definitely been issues surrounding NNS students.

>

> I agree with the complaints about TOEFL overstating stating the English

> ability of the student.

>

> Thanks!

> JoAnn

>

>

>

> JoAnn M. Molnar

> ESL Program Coordinator/ Instructor

> Durham Technical Community College

> 1637 Lawson Street, Durham, NC 27703

> Phone (919) 536-7221 ext. 3229

>

>

> >>> Nancy R Faux/AC/VCU <nfaux at vcu.edu> 3/20/2009 10:58 AM >>>

> Pat,

>

> Your daughter in law probably had to take the ECFMG, a very rigorous

> exam

> for foreign medical school graduates to enter residency programs in the

>

> US.  There is an English language testing component to the exam besides

>

> all the questions related to medicine.

>

> Nancy

>

> *********************************************************

> Nancy R. Faux

> ESOL Specialist

> Virginia Adult Learning Resource Center

> Virginia Commonwealth University

> 3600 W. Broad Street, Suite 669

> Richmond, VA 23230-4930

> nfaux at vcu.edu

> http://www.valrc.org <http://www.valrc.org/>

> 1-800-237-0178

>

>

>

> Patmay1122 at aol.com

> Sent by: englishlanguage-bounces at nifl.gov

> 03/20/2009 10:34 AM

> Please respond to

> The Adult English Language Learners Discussion List

> <englishlanguage at nifl.gov>

>

>

> To

> yohogclc at earthlink.net

> cc

> englishlanguage at nifl.gov

> Subject

> [EnglishLanguage 4052] Re: certification of pharmacists via TOEFL

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Hi

> My daughter in law is a physician from Slovakia.  She had to take

> several

> different kinds of tests of her skill level and her English level to be

>

> able to apply for a residency program in the USA.  She didn't have to

> take

> the TOEFL.   All the testing was with the Kaplan agency.

> Maybe the pharmacist's association should re consider their

> qualifications.

> My DIL has good English but there are so many idioms etc that will take

> a

> long time to understand.

> Regards

> Pat in Pa.

>

>

> Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make meals for under $10.

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