GLOBE Program Chat Room

[ HelpDesk/GLOBE - 0 - 06:57:42 ]
Welcome to the GLOBE Web Chat with Dr. Whit Smith of Georgia Tech. Dr. Smith is going to talk today about GPS technology and how it is used by GLOBE students and scientists. Please keep all comments on this topic. Conversation on other matters will not be included in the chat room.

 [ DrWhitSmith - 1 - 06:59:22 ]
Good morning. Any questions?

 [ HelpDesk/GLOBE - 2 - 07:05:48 ]
Good morning, Dr. Smith. Thanks for joining us! I think we are waiting a couple of minutes for schools to join in. If anyone is already in the chat room and has a question, please go ahead!

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 3 - 07:15:42 ]
Hello!

[ DrWhitSmith - 4 - 07:17:35 ]
RE: [WillowCreekRochMN] Hello!
Hello Willow Creek. This is Dr. Smith, the GPS scientist. How many of you are there?

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 5 - 07:19:38 ]
I am an 8th grade student from Rochester Minnesota and I am doing a project on GPS and would like to learn a little more about it.

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 6 - 07:20:01 ]
Just 1

[ DrWhitSmith - 7 - 07:21:26 ]
RE: [WillowCreekRochMN] I am an 8th grade student from Rochester Minnesota and I am doing a project on GPS and would like to learn a little more about it.
What is your name? Can you tell me a little about your GPS project, and can I help?

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 8 - 07:21:55 ]
I am especially interested in how GPS studies tectonic plates and earthquakes.

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 9 - 07:23:04 ]
My name is Jenna, My project is basically an overview of the history and use of GPS.

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 10 - 07:24:10 ]
Our earth science class has been studying tectonic plates and that Is why I am paticularly interested in this area.

 [ DrWhitSmith - 11 - 07:24:41 ]
RE: [WillowCreekRochMN] I am especially interested in how GPS studies tectonic plates and earthquakes.
Scientist do use GPS techniques to measure small movements in Earth's crust. The take two or more GPS receivers which perhaps are on different plates and record their locations and the changes. Combinations of receivers are available which can measure changes in centimeters over hundreds of kilometers.

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 12 - 07:25:02 ]
Also as a student pilot I have taken interest in its use as part of teh aviation field.

 [ DrWhitSmith - 13 - 07:28:02 ]
RE: [WillowCreekRochMN] Also as a student pilot I have taken interest in its use as part of teh aviation field.
I see one student named Jenna who I believe is working on a GPS project and is a student pilot. Is this correct? I also am a pilot. GPS techniques are used, in addition to all the other flight and navigation instruments, for getting planes from one place to another. Some folks are advocating doing away with many of the other radio navigation aids and using GPS along. As a pilot, that makes me a little nervous, however, all those radio navigation systems cost a lot of money to maintain.

[ WillowCreekRochMN - 14 - 07:29:21 ]
Yep one student (Jenna) who is a student pilot

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 15 - 07:29:52 ]
Do you personally feel GPS is justto new to replace all radio navigation systems?

 [ DrWhitSmith - 16 - 07:30:15 ]
Is Mr. Ryan there with you? Have you solo'd yet?

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 17 - 07:31:35 ]
Mr. Ryan is in and out of the room. No I cannot solo until I am 16. I am 14 years old right now. My dad is a pilot and has been teaching me. He is not a lisenced CFI but I will be starting "official" lessons soon.

[ DrWhitSmith - 18 - 07:33:26 ]
RE: [WillowCreekRochMN] Do you personally feel GPS is justto new to replace all radio navigation systems?
No, I do not believe that GPS is too new. Some folks still think that electricity is too new. However, what would happen if your GPS receiver were to break or there were to be some problem with the satellite constellation? Sometime during the last year, a technician left a GPS test transmitter switched on near an airport, and this jammed most of the local use of GPS until they found the transmitter. Using only one system is like putting all your eggs in one basket. You are learning to use the gyro-compass, magnetic compass, VOR, and lots of other tools for finding yourself when flying, aren't you?

[ WillowCreekRochMN - 19 - 07:34:59 ]
Yep, Im just beggining with all the navigation stuff but Im enjoying it.

[ WillowCreekRochMN - 20 - 07:35:48 ]
None of the planes I fly have GPS yet. (Cessna 150s and 172s) But one has something similar I think it is called Loran.

[ DrWhitSmith - 21 - 07:35:58 ]
RE: [WillowCreekRochMN] Mr. Ryan is in and out of the room. No I cannot solo until I am 16. I am 14 years old right now. My dad is a pilot and has been teaching me. He is not a lisenced CFI but I will be starting "official" lessons soon.
Even though you are 14, you can still fly with him. My younger brother wanted to be able to fly. I got my license when my younger brother was still a teenager so that he could fly with me.

 [ GREERSTUDENTS/BRUNSWICK - 22 - 07:36:35 ]
WHAT IS THE LARGEST GPS IN THE WORLD?

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 23 - 07:37:25 ]
I do fly, I just havent soloed. I am about a year and a half away from soloing on my 16th birthday. My future goal is to fly for an airline or study GPS aviation technology.

 [ DrWhitSmith - 24 - 07:40:19 ]
RE: [WillowCreekRochMN] None of the planes I fly have GPS yet. (Cessna 150s and 172s) But one has something similar I think it is called Loran.
Have you used VORs yet? I believe that is an acronym for VHF Omnidirectional Receiver. There are lots of VOR transmitters located all over the country, typically at or near airports, which facilitate your "connecting the dots" as you fly. I believe that LORAN stands for Long Range or Low frequency Radio Navigation. It is a technique predating GPS which requires multiple stations to send pulses. The time difference between pulses is compared. For a set of 3 or more LORAN signals from know locations, you can determine your two dimensional (not altitude) location. LORAN will be removed from service during the next few years because people are beginning to move to GPS. GPS can give you 100 meter accuracies, whereas LORAN would typically be to the nearest mile or so.

 [ mike - 25 - 07:41:44 ]
what kind of GPS do you recomend

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 26 - 07:42:17 ]
I am not very familar with VORs

 [ DrWhitSmith - 27 - 07:42:32 ]
RE: [GREERSTUDENTS/BRUNSWICK] WHAT IS THE LARGEST GPS IN THE WORLD?
The largest? The largest antenna, heaviest receiver, furthest satellite, the highest altitude measurement? What is your name, how many are there, and where are you? Hi, I'm Dr. Smith.

 [ DrWhitSmith - 28 - 07:43:10 ]
RE: [WillowCreekRochMN] I am not very familar with VORs
You will be. Ask you father about it. You can see the VOR transmitter locations on the charts.

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 29 - 07:43:33 ]
What improvemnts could be made to make GPS safe for use as a replacemnt for all radio navigation units?

 [ DrWhitSmith - 30 - 07:44:41 ]
RE: [mike] what kind of GPS do you recomend
What is your name, how many are there, and where are you? Hi, I'm Dr. Smith. Have you used any GPS receiver yet? I cannot recommend a specific brand, however, I soon shall be presenting a "Scientists' Corner Letter" talking about the various and available receivers.

 [ mike - 31 - 07:45:25 ]
can you fit a GPS in a remotecomtrol air plane?

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 32 - 07:47:02 ]
Mike: where are you from and what grade are you in? (If your a stuent)

 [ mike - 33 - 07:48:03 ]
mike reynolds and matt 2 noble jr. high

[ DrWhitSmith - 34 - 07:48:04 ]
RE: [WillowCreekRochMN] What improvemnts could be made to make GPS safe for use as a replacemnt for all radio navigation units?
"What improvements could be made to make GPS safe for use as a replacement for all radio navigation units?" This depends on how you want to define "safe". Are car's safe? I understand that you have a lower probability of dying in an airplane accident than in an automobile accident. As an engineer, and I am an engineer, I believe that safe probably ought to be defined as lowering the probability of "unsafe" events occurring. We often confuse this with "feeling good", but it also is desirable to feel comfortable with the instruments which one uses. I personally prefer a combination of instruments. Therefore, if one fails or I get confused with one, I can move to another.

[ GREERSTUDENTS/BRUNSWICK - 35 - 07:49:01 ]
We are 25 students at C. B. Greer Elementary School in Brunswick, Georgia. We have recently joined GLOBE and have purchased a small GPS. Someone came from our county government came to demonstrate a much larger GPS which he wore on a backpack. We think these must be "receivers" and we are wondering if there is a larger one.

[ WillowCreekRochMN - 36 - 07:49:59 ]
That sounds right to me. As cool as GPS is Its always nice to have a "Plan B" or backup.

 [ mike - 37 - 07:50:05 ]
seventh grade

 [ DrWhitSmith - 38 - 07:51:03 ]
RE: [mike] can you fit a GPS in a remotecomtrol air plane?
Yes, Mike, you can fit a GPS receiver into a model airplane. They now make full receivers which are smaller than a wallet. These can be embedded in anything which needs to know where it is. You could build an automated model airplane which could fly to a known destination. Some of the latest military technologies take advantage of this idea.

[ DrWhitSmith - 39 - 07:52:34 ]
RE: [WillowCreekRochMN] That sounds right to me. As cool as GPS is Its always nice to have a "Plan B" or backup.
It is neat, however, there are a lot of ways there could be problems, and I should prefer to have options which I intuitively believe. Personally, I like visual navigating the best. I like looking for the landmarks.

[ WillowCreekRochMN - 40 - 07:53:03 ]
Does the military use GPS for Stealth Technology?

[ DrWhitSmith - 41 - 07:55:11 ]
RE: [GREERSTUDENTS/BRUNSWICK] We are 25 students at C. B. Greer Elementary School in Brunswick, Georgia. We have recently joined GLOBE and have purchased a small GPS. Someone came from our county government came to demonstrate a much larger GPS which he wore on a backpack. We think these must be "receivers" and we are wondering if there is a larger one.
The handheld GPS receiver is the minimal configuration which is accurate to about 100 meters. The larger backpack versions are used with another remotely located receiver to make much higher accuracy measurements to perhaps the nearest centimeter. Scientist can and do use special GPS techniques to measure small movements in Earth's crust. The take two or more GPS receivers which perhaps are on different plates and record their locations and the changes. Combinations of receivers are available which can measure changes in centimeters over hundreds of kilometers.

[ LINDADELACERDA - 42 - 07:55:19 ]
I AM INTERSTING ON HOW YOU GUYS DO THIS

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 43 - 07:57:11 ]
RE:[ LINDADELACERDA - 42 - 07:55:19 ] I AM INTERSTING ON HOW YOU GUYS DO THIS- Where are you from and what grade are you in?

 [ mikeBerwickMaine - 44 - 07:57:19 ]
we use a GPS in our science class for Forest Watch AND GLOBE .

 [ DrWhitSmith - 45 - 07:57:27 ]
RE: [WillowCreekRochMN] Does the military use GPS for Stealth Technology?
The "stealth" technology is really your attempting to not be seen. To do this, you do not emit radio wave type signals and you may paint your plane black and paint it with something which absorbs radar signals or reflects them away from the folks who may be looking for you. But if you want to hide by flying through canyons or behind mountains, then yes, GPS can be used as a part of stealth techniques.

[ WillowCreekRochMN - 46 - 07:58:39 ]
Did the recent satelite crash effect GPS?

 [ DrWhitSmith - 47 - 07:58:51 ]
RE: [WillowCreekRochMN] RE:[ LINDADELACERDA - 42 - 07:55:19 ] I AM INTERSTING ON HOW YOU GUYS DO THIS- Where are you from and what grade are you in?
You are interested in how we guys do what exactly?

 [ DrWhitSmith - 48 - 08:00:09 ]
RE: [WillowCreekRochMN] Did the recent satelite crash effect GPS?
Are you talking about a crash during launch or the re-entry of a satellite?

 [ mikeBerwickMaine - 49 - 08:00:56 ]
Have you heard of Forest Watch (UNH-ozone pollution and white pine)

 [ DrWhitSmith - 50 - 08:01:03 ]
RE: [mikeBerwickMaine] we use a GPS in our science class for Forest Watch AND GLOBE .
Mike, what do you do as a part of Forrest Watch?

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 51 - 08:01:30 ]
The failure of the pathfinder satelite for communication systems? (80% of the pagers in the nation are currently down...this is recent news)

 [ DrWhitSmith - 52 - 08:01:33 ]
RE: [mikeBerwickMaine] Have you heard of Forest Watch (UNH-ozone pollution and white pine)
Mike, you guessed my question. Please tell me about Forrest Watch.

 [ DrWhitSmith - 53 - 08:05:21 ]
RE: [WillowCreekRochMN] The failure of the pathfinder satelite for communication systems? (80% of the pagers in the nation are currently down...this is recent news)
I was not aware of this. There are some pager systems which use satellites to transmit the messages from one terrestrial location to another where they are transmitted (from Earthbound transmitters) to pocket pagers. Thus, a lot of the messages would get stuck, and the system managers would have to switch to non-satellite back-up networks. It is possible that they could not have enough capacity to handle all the messages without the satellite channel.

 [ mikeBerwickMaine - 54 - 08:05:26 ]
we use GPS to find out the position of our 30 square meter study site and compare to a Landsat satellite image .

 [ ElBuenAyre - 55 - 08:05:33 ]
Hello Dr. Smith, We are in Argentina with Cyndy Henzel. how do they use the GPS in finding lost or stolen cars?

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 56 - 08:06:22 ]
The failure was broadcast just yesterday.

 [ GREERSTUDENTS/BRUNSWICK - 57 - 08:06:24 ]
Who invented the GPS and when was it invented? Who used it first?

[ DrWhitSmith - 58 - 08:08:57 ]
RE: [ElBuenAyre] Hello Dr. Smith, We are in Argentina with Cyndy Henzel. how do they use the GPS in finding lost or stolen cars?
Say Hello to Cyndy. We have a stolen car location system here in the United States called "LoJack". A unit in a stolen car listens for a satellite signal so that it can start transmitting a beacon. Police listen for this beacon signal. When they hear it, the go to it and find the car. This system does not use GPS. Are you referring to a system like this?

[ mikeBerwickMaine - 59 - 08:09:34 ]
Didn't GPS start with the Dept. of Defense?

 [ DrWhitSmith - 60 - 08:09:50 ]
RE: [WillowCreekRochMN] The failure was broadcast just yesterday.
I have not yet heard about it, and I do not use a pager.

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 61 - 08:11:18 ]
Good question...where did GPS start?

 [ DrWhitSmith - 62 - 08:12:47 ]
RE: [mikeBerwickMaine] Didn't GPS start with the Dept. of Defense?
GPS and some similar systems indeed were started for military purposes. They would be used to guide "smart" munitions to their targets. This system was used widely by Allied forces during the Gulf War in the early 1990s. However, there are far more civilian users now, and the US government is talking about making the entire system completely civilian. The Russians have a system similar to GPS, and now Russians, Americans, and everyone else use both systems.

[ ElBuenAyre - 63 - 08:13:04 ]
Yes this is what we mean. How did you become interested in GLOBE?

 [ mikeBerwickMaine - 64 - 08:14:49 ]
In Forest Watch, schools from New Hampshire, Maine and other NE states monitor the health of white pine needles and possible cell damage done caused by ground-level ozone pollution.

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 65 - 08:15:46 ]
mikeBerwickMaine thats really neat...how does GPS help you do this?

 [ DrWhitSmith - 66 - 08:17:40 ]
RE: [ElBuenAyre] Yes this is what we mean. How did you become interested in GLOBE?
How did I become interested in GLOBE? I like working with students. I have worked with a lot of teenagers through my church, and I work with a lot of students where I teach and perform research. If you look at my web pages at http://www.gatech.edu/woodbury, you can see some of my students in action. I also work with radio navigation techniques. I did a big project in the late 1980s developing a technique to look for the terrestrial locations of transmitters which were using satellites, sometimes without the permission of the satellite owners. I do think that we have a stewardship responsibility to take care of our biosphere. So all of this combined, particularly working with the students, made me interested in working with the GLOBE program.

 [ mikeBerwickMaine - 67 - 08:17:49 ]
Are there any other similar projects being conducted elsewhere in the U.S. or anywhere? It would be great to contact similar programs.

 [ DrWhitSmith - 68 - 08:19:56 ]
RE: [mikeBerwickMaine] In Forest Watch, schools from New Hampshire, Maine and other NE states monitor the health of white pine needles and possible cell damage done caused by ground-level ozone pollution.
Mike, I think that lots of folks are listening and want to hear about what you are doing. Can you elaborate?

 [ DrWhitSmith - 69 - 08:20:52 ]
RE: [mikeBerwickMaine] Are there any other similar projects being conducted elsewhere in the U.S. or anywhere? It would be great to contact similar programs.
Projects similar to what?

 [ DrWhitSmith - 70 - 08:21:44 ]
RE: [WillowCreekRochMN] Good question...where did GPS start?
GPS and some similar systems indeed were started for military purposes. They would be used to guide "smart" munitions to their targets. This system was used widely by Allied forces during the Gulf War in the early 1990s. However, there are far more civilian users now, and the US government is talking about making the entire system completely civilian. The Russians have a system similar to GPS, and now Russians, Americans, and everyone else use both systems.

[ ElBuenAyre - 71 - 08:22:08 ]
What do the students that you work with help you do\/

 [ WillowCreekRochMN - 72 - 08:22:46 ]
I have tp be leaving now. Thank You DrWhitSmith. I have nejoyed participating. Goodbye from Jenna and Mr. Ryan. :-)

 [ DrWhitSmith - 73 - 08:23:23 ]
RE: [WillowCreekRochMN] I have tp be leaving now. Thank You DrWhitSmith. I have nejoyed participating. Goodbye from Jenna and Mr. Ryan. :-)
Goodbye Jenna and Mr. Ryan. Hello to everyone else.

 [ ElBuenAyre - 74 - 08:23:50 ]
What type of satellite does the LoJack use?

 [ mikeBerwickMaine - 75 - 08:24:07 ]
I have to go! Please follow up with questions. We're at Noble Jr. High in Berwick, Maine. Bye for now

 [ DrWhitSmith - 76 - 08:26:07 ]
RE: [ElBuenAyre] What do the students that you work with help you do\/
A lot of the students with whom I work help me with GLOBE and other research projects. The ones who work with me on GLOBE help choose and purchase GPS receivers, write and test the protocols and activities which you can see in the Teachers Guide, and check all the incoming measurements for errors. Other students help me to build electronic or mechanical devices for other projects. Most of them are engineering students here at Georgia Tech which is a college in Atlanta, Georgia (home of the 1996 Olympics).

 [ DrWhitSmith - 77 - 08:26:26 ]
RE: [mikeBerwickMaine] I have to go! Please follow up with questions. We're at Noble Jr. High in Berwick, Maine. Bye for now
Goodbye Mike. Hello to everyone else.

 [ DrWhitSmith - 78 - 08:28:40 ]
RE: [ElBuenAyre] What type of satellite does the LoJack use?
I do not know which satellite that LoJack uses, however, they have a web page at http://www.lojack.com/ which may discuss this.

[ ElBuenAyre - 79 - 08:30:47 ]
Thank you very much for answering our questions. Chau.(Argentine spelling\\\

 [ DrWhitSmith - 80 - 08:31:31 ]
RE: [ElBuenAyre] Thank you very much for answering our questions. Chau.(Argentine spelling\\\
That is what I am here for Chau. Are you leaving?

 [ HelpDesk/GLOBE - 81 - 08:47:43 ]
As we move into the second half of our GLOBE Web Chat today, we'd like to again welcome Dr. Whit Smith, our featured GLOBE scientist. Dr. Smith is from Georgia Tech and is talking today about the GPS and how it is used by GLOBE scientists and students. We welcome any questions on this topic from any schools in the chat room!

 [ Dave - 82 - 08:58:49 ]
Has the broken communications satellite affected GPS? What would happen if the same sort of thing happened to a GPS satellite?

 [ DrWhitSmith - 83 - 09:02:00 ]
Hi Dave. Where are you, what is your grade, and are others with you? I am not yet aware of the details of a broken satellite. Do you know which satellite it is?

 [ DrWhitSmith - 84 - 09:02:06 ]
RE: [Dave] Has the broken communications satellite affected GPS? What would happen if the same sort of thing happened to a GPS satellite?
Hi Dave. Where are you, what is your grade, and are others with you? I am not yet aware of the details of a broken satellite. Do you know which satellite it is?

 [ Dave - 85 - 09:02:47 ]
Is it true that the US Government is going to stop scrambling the GPS signals so that they will be more accurate?

 [ DrWhitSmith - 86 - 09:03:55 ]
RE: [DrWhitSmith] Hi Dave. Where are you, what is your grade, and are others with you? I am not yet aware of the details of a broken satellite. Do you know which satellite it is?
Dave, there are 24 GPS satellites in orbit. You only need to hear from any four of them to determine your location. Therefore, the system is quite robust in terms of satellites breaking. I believe that this was part of the design criteria for the system.

 [ Dave - 87 - 09:05:40 ]
Thanks. Gotta go.

 [ DrWhitSmith - 88 - 09:06:16 ]
RE: [Dave] Is it true that the US Government is going to stop scrambling the GPS signals so that they will be more accurate?
I understand that the folks who operate the Global Positioning System are planning to stop purposefully corrupting the signal which will make it more accurate. This is a hot debate because of the military implications. While it will be useful for civilian users, do you really want to give a potential enemy the ability to better locate targets?

 [ DrWhitSmith - 89 - 09:06:40 ]
RE: [Dave] Thanks. Gotta go.
Bye Dave. Hello everyone else.

 [ DrWhitSmith - 90 - 09:48:51 ]
RE: [DrWhitSmith] Hi Dave. Where are you, what is your grade, and are others with you? I am not yet aware of the details of a broken satellite. Do you know which satellite it is?
Several of you have asked about a damaged satellite. It is the Galaxy 4 satellite owned by PanAmSat (http://www.panamsat.com/). It is located over the equator at 99 degrees west longitude and 0 degrees latitude. It is in a special orbit which keeps it above that point. They lost service on this satellite yesterday which affects pagers, CBS television and radio, National Public Radio, and a host of other services. The company is trying to move another satellite into the place of the damaged satellite. Some of the services are moving to other satellites. PanAmSat and other satellite service providers are working together to make all services available again. These are communications satellites unlike the GPS satellites which are used only for navigation purposes. The GPS system is not affected.

[ HelpDesk/GLOBE - 91 - 10:00:31 ]
We are out of time at this point. Thank you Dr. Smith and thanks for all the excellent questions! This has been a most interesting chat! Bye all!
 
 
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