Inconsistencies, Part 2
Did you have to take your shoes off in Ohio but not Colorado? Post all of your thoughts about Inconsistencies on this blog post. (Click here for Part 1)
Labels: Gripes and Grins
posted by Glen at
9:00 AM
1.31.2008
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217 Comments:
If the TSA really and truly wants to cut down on the confusion, then perhaps they should ensure that the pamphlets they produce match the information on their website. One major example is the “Prepare for Takeoff – Permitted and Prohibited Items.” This brochure does not even come close to matching the HUGE list of items on the TSA website. Just giving this list a cursory look shows that the “Makeup, Medication, Personal Items & Special Needs Devices” listed on the website has been whittled down to “Medication and Special Needs Devices.” This only ensures that many flyers are having extremely expensive makeup and personal care items tossed in the “trash.” The “Food & Drinks” list did not even make it to the brochure. Travelers are relying on the data in these brochures when packing, but the brochures are poorly assembled. The TSA covers their butts by including the following statement: “The prohibited and permitted items list is not intended to be all-inclusive and is updated as necessary.” This statement continues on explaining that the TSOs have full discretion to decide whether an item is prohibited or not. SO FLYERS BEWARE – ANYTHING YOU BRING CAN BE DETERMINED TO BE PROHIBITED. I would really like to know what happens to all these items – even new, sealed products – that are “thrown out” by the TSOs. If you don’t believe me, then search in Google for “confiscated items” +airport. You will find numerous articles that show money is being made off these items – AT YOUR EXPENSE. Many of these items are being sold on eBay. I wonder, how many confiscated items did not even make it that far? Where’s the really good stuff – not just the knives and scissors?
The TSA needs to assemble ONE PDF file that contains ALL the information that a traveler needs to know for packing and flying. I have printed out 30+ pages from their website containing the required information. Some of it is duplicated from article to article, but I was unable to find ONE file that provides a traveler with the knowledge they need. I have the “Prepare for Takeoff – Permitted and Prohibited Items” brochure (2 pages) PLUS the expanded 8 page list from the website; “3-1-1 for Carry-ons –Prepare for Take-off” brochure (2 pages); “What’s New Basics” information regarding batteries (9 pages); 3 pages of the “simpliFLY” website section; 5 pages from the “Travel Assistant” section; and “New Policies for Lighters, Electronics, and Breast Milk” (3 pages). I am sure the TSA has at least ONE competent person on staff who could assemble all travel information into ONE PDF file that every traveler could then download and print when preparing for a trip. It would be much easier for the TSA to update ONE file than to update several webpages and brochures to make sure the data is consistent in all documents.
March 21, 2008 10:19 AM
re: I am sure the TSA has at least ONE competent person on staff who could assemble all travel information into ONE PDF file
What has TSA done to make you think they have a competent staff member?
March 21, 2008 12:39 PM
Thanks for encouraging dialog with the public through this blog!
This is a small point, but I can guarantee that thousands of hours of screener and passenger time have been wasted because of it. Some screeners are apparently unfamiliar with the details of some state driver's licences. My co-worker and I were just subjected to full searches at LAX because our older but valid driver's licenses were unfamiliar to all three of the screeners present. Maybe a simple photo booklet of various licenses would be of help to some of these more novice workers.
Thanks again!
March 21, 2008 11:06 PM
For all those complaining about inconsistencies...I'll admit that it is frustrating if when one group or location follows established procedures and another does not. However; do you not realize the value in inconsistent behavior from the security standpoint? Why on earth would we want to do the same thing, every time, every day? How easy would it be to observe, look for weaknesses to exploit, and beat the security? Our country is a country of spoiled brats.
March 22, 2008 2:17 AM
I travel often and have concluded that the 3 oz rule is silly. Please scientifically resolve the issue of toothpaste beyond 3oz as a real security threat. I went through a screening last week in Denver same time as a colleague. His 6 oz. toopaste made it through the screeen tucked away in his luggage while my 4oz tube in a clear plastic bag was pulled for trash. Enough already!!!!
March 22, 2008 12:33 PM
Why on earth would we want to do the same thing, every time, every day? How easy would it be to observe, look for weaknesses to exploit, and beat the security? Our country is a country of spoiled brats.
If TSA were doing it's job, then the terrorists would be caught. Screening for liquids, shoes, etc are pretty commonplace and as such should be standardized. If you are a TSA screener then I would suggest finding another job before you get fired for your bad attitude.
March 22, 2008 2:44 PM
I'm confused on the policies that cover carry on luggage. Recently, on the Detroit to Boston leg, the TSA in Detroit separated out the items I had in my quart size bag. the small tubes were place in a separate bag. Then, my my make-up bag was looked at. The TSA person separated out the items into 2 other quart size bags. So I figured that the rule was-a separate bag for different types of items. Remember, all I have is a carry-on bag for a short week-end trip. On the Boston to Detroit leg, TSA security at Logan Airport was very perturbed with me because I had THREE quart size bags with my items in them. I mentioned, (I suppose somewhat flippantly)talk to the TSA folks in Detroit! The TSA person said that he was being a nice guy letting me through-he could stop me from flying,(you know!!) Yes, I got the message only ONE quart size bag for my travel size toiletries. I made sure the make-up items were small size but they're in a make-up carry bag in the luggage of the carry-on piece. Was it a full moon or something?
What is the correct way to handle this problem?
March 23, 2008 10:17 AM
As a type 1 diabetic, I can take insulin and needles aboard. It does not escape my attention that it is all a person needs to kill with, inducing hypoglycemia in you normal folks. In other words, unless you want to prohibit all diabetics and large strong men from flying, there is no way you can force all potentially deadly things from boarding a plane.
Stop stupid inspections and start using common sense!
March 23, 2008 12:01 PM
Many TSA employees appear to be unfamiliar with TSA policies. After nail files and scissors were permitted, my wife's were nevertheless confiscated. Her suitcase lock, which was TSA approved, was nevertheless cut off--even though a nearby TSA plackard states such a lock to be acceptable.
March 23, 2008 4:44 PM
This statement continues on explaining that the TSOs have full discretion to decide whether an item is prohibited or not. SO FLYERS BEWARE – ANYTHING YOU BRING CAN BE DETERMINED TO BE PROHIBITED.
That one comment chills me to the bone. What if they decide to confiscate my laptop (company provided) or cell phone (again company provided) because they got a wild hair up? Would they give me a receipt? Where would it go?
I suspect the answer to the reciept would be no and that it would go into an ever growing pile of confiscated laptops to be sold on Ebay by a TSA employee interested in making a fast buck.
That one comment puts me on the offensive more than anything else TSA does.
March 23, 2008 7:14 PM
Anonymous said:
This is a small point, but I can guarantee that thousands of hours of screener and passenger time have been wasted because of it. Some screeners are apparently unfamiliar with the details of some state driver's licences. My co-worker and I were just subjected to full searches at LAX because our older but valid driver's licenses were unfamiliar to all three of the screeners present. Maybe a simple photo booklet of various licenses would be of help to some of these more novice workers.
Point of fact, these books are generally available at many airport checkpoints, for screeners to use. Either they are not available at LAX (which I doubt) or the screeners did not bother or think to reference them.
March 24, 2008 10:51 AM
Why is it that the TSA required that Continental not accept online boarding passes at San Jose (SJC)? That meant that all online boarding passes had to be exchanged at the gate, which was a waste of time and resources.
The proffered reason was that Continental did not use a gate reader. Well Continental and other airlines don't use gate readers at many of the airports they fly to. Clearly, this was an anomaly compared to the rest of Continental's system, and Continental agreed the policy didn't make much sense.
This procedure has now been changed just very recently, but only because it was brought to Continental's attention and they worked to get the restriction lifted.
Answers? A rogue station?
March 24, 2008 1:47 PM
I have a metal knee, and so am subject to additional screening each trip to the airport (twice a week). Fine. But that process has no consistency. Some screeners are so focused on getting their little memorized speech out - even after I've sat down in "the position" ready to go, and pointed out that I do this twice a week - that I swear, I could be wearing a rubber clown nose and standing on my head and they wouldn't notice. Can you just make these folks.....I don't know, smarter?
March 24, 2008 3:27 PM
Frankly, I felt much safer flying around Nicaragua out of Nicaraguan airports last month than I did in US airports. This despite the dire US Govt warning that Nica airports "did not meet US government security and safety standards." The Nicaraguan security personnel were both far more polite, and far more thorough than US TSA employees.
Sure, at every Nica airport there were always a couple grim-faced folks wearing fatigues and carrying AK-47s watching your every move, but the security screeners showed impeccable courtesy and customer service, unlike the cattle-drive, body-cavity search TSA screamers I encountered at both DIA and IAH.
At the Nicaraguan airports, no matter how tiny, both my carry-on laptop bag and camera case were inspected meticulously---every little compartment unzipped, every SD memory card popped from its plastic holder, every ziploc bag with camera or computer gadgets opened, and even my tiny plastic earplug box (for snoring roommates and loud boat and plane motors) opened and inspected. Plus a third (!) surprise carry-on bag inspection right on the jetway boarding the flight from MGA to IAH.
All the while with all the polite, bilingual Nica screeners saying "We're very sorry sir, but we do need to inspect your bags. Is that OK? (well, of course it's OK, your buddy has an AK-47). Did you enjoy your stay? When you get on the plane back to Managua, be sure to get a seat on the left side of the plane, so you can see the lake and the volcanos. No glass bottles on the plane please, but you can pour your beer into a plastic cup and carry it on that way...." and so on.
The only polite US homeland security person I met the entire trip was the immigration agent at IAH. Every TSA employee was very gruff, very bored and most were downright rude. The TSA screamers I ignored completely, which seemed to make them more rude. Sorry, I don't even acknowledge screamers.
Send the entire TSA staff to any private-sector, company customer service seminar, and make them pass the final exam. Their inspections of my bags were cursory and useless, and their attitude bad. That compared to the 'sub-standard security' Nicas, who went over my bags with a fine-toothed comb while treating me like an honored guest in their country.
March 25, 2008 3:48 AM
To the passenger that has metal knees and is upset that he must listen to our "memorized speech" each time they are screened. It is listed in our Standard Operating Procedures that we recite that narrative and ask those questions prior to all screenings. The TSO's are only doing what is required of them, those that are not doing it, if identified, are subject to discipline. While I agree with you that seasoned travelers should be spared some of the "tediousness" of the recitations at the beginning, it is a part of the complete process, not a matter of making the TSO's as you put it, "smarter".
March 25, 2008 10:37 AM
Well lets talk about sitting in an airport waiting for my delayed flight and watching a woman and her two daughters kniting with 12-18 inch long wooden, plastic, or metal needles!
What the heck! I can see this as an issue or because they are women and may not be that strong to stab someone with these?
You will take a toe clipper away or a swiss army knife with a 1 inch blade but not some 12-18 inch needles with a point?
What about this?
Also I love the baggie idea; lets put all my liquids and gels in a baggie and still have it go through a second time. Oh this is not because you have less than 3.2 oz of a liquid but you need to make sure the container doesn't have more than 3.2oz printed. I have taken my toothpaste tube which is rolled up to maybe have an ounce of toothpaste but it was in a larger 4oz tube and was taken away. Go figure!
March 25, 2008 10:37 AM
I love the headlines on the www.tsa.gov web site: TSO finds firearm at Honolulu International Airport, and Brass Knuckles and Derringer found at LAX airport. Turns out the firearm, without ammunition, was improperly packed in checked luggage, the brass knuckles were a belt buckle, and the Derringer was a lighter. This type of sensationalism reminds me of a super market tabloid rather than a serious agency.
March 25, 2008 8:23 PM
To Anonymous who said “While I agree with you that seasoned travelers should be spared some of the "tediousness" of the recitations at the beginning, it is a part of the complete process, not a matter of making the TSO's as you put it, "smarter".”
If the policy is dumb, then the policy is dumb, and in this case the policy is dumb. People who make such policies need to understand that the traveling public and TSO agents are grownups not five year old children.
The goal of the TSO agent should be to protect the public rather than to follow a bunch of dumb policies. If this were the goal we wouldn’t see TSO agents confiscating gummy bears from children, frisking immobile 90 year old women, requiring frightened, crying toddlers to walk through the metal detector alone, harassing frequent travelers who have flown thousands of times through hundreds of airports, and all the other absurdities we frequent travelers have observed.
March 25, 2008 8:57 PM
To Anonymous who said “Our country is a country of spoiled brats.”
It would certainly be easier for the TSA if we were as docile as citizens of totalitarian regimes. Fortunately we still have a little spark to stand up for our ever-shrinking civil rights. Fortunately we can still look at a nonsensical situation and do something to make it better. Unfortunately some people prefer totalitarianism -- at least until they experience it.
March 25, 2008 9:05 PM
I couldn't agree more about the inconsistencies, though it does make sense to vary the routine to throw the bad guys off.
I pride myself on keeping informed about all the policies. In spite of reading all I could prior to a recent leisure flight, I found nothing to let me know if something like a small box of dry cereal was allowed, or cheese crackers, or anything edible (but not liquid). Because I had a concern about potentially taking a computer hard drive, I actually spoke to a nice man at the TSA, who assured me the snacks would be ok.
It is my understanding that having larger containers could potentially give evil doers space to mix chemicals and create trouble...so I understand that as well.
I was annoyed, at CLE, that seating available prior to entering security areas were removed. I prefer to sit down and pop on some disposable shoe covers over my socks so I don't have to walk on the germy and dirty floor.
When I returned from MCO, it was very busy and crowded, yet they did not have all the stations covered for the screenings. I paid very close attention to the signs and announcements. In CLE I was NOT required to take the quart bag out; nor was any mention made in MCO. Previously in MCO someone was repeatedly holding a 1 quart bag and telling people in line to have it OUT. This time nobody was saying a word about the bags, only about computers etc. So, my 1 quart bag, which was ready to be pulled if I needed to, and was right on top in my carry on, was inside it, and as I made my way through I was asked if the tote bag was mine.
While it was nice to know the TSA appeared to be doing it's job, it infuriates me when people poke around my stuff. And I had to look like an ignorant dummy.
OK, so be inconsistent airport to airport, but for crying out loud, inform us prior. No reason why there can't be a rolling sign with the messages repeated consistently as to what to do while in line.
It takes me five hours to drive to Toronto, but it made me appreciate all the more the civility of not dealing with this nonsense.
And by the way, I understand many folks who use the Disney Magical Express bus...they basically hand over their suitcases, so that the ARE out of their control for the duration...and how do THEY answer the questions when going through security or handing them over to airline personnel?
March 25, 2008 9:29 PM
We recently went BOS to LAX and back. The TSA person at LAX insisted that everyone was entitled to one plastic bin at the line. then when people had laptops or children, she appeared to make other rules causing confusion and delays.
The TSA officer's arbitrary one bin per person didn't make sense and created confusion as no one was familiar with it (and was thinking this is ridiculous). There are stacks and stacks of plastic bins, let folks use as many as they need and don't make up bin rules on the fly. Let's get the lines through as efficiently as possible and let folks get their items through the scanner the way they can. The runner for the bins can certainly handle running stacks to the back of the line.
Thanks for listening. This was in the LAX Midway terminal on Friday February 29 2008 around 10 AM.
March 25, 2008 10:17 PM
For a little less confusion: About Liquids, for Screening Officers and for Passengers
There is one good rule of thumb;
If it:
POURS…SPREADS…SQUEEZES. or.. SPRAYS
Then it is a liquid, paste, creme, lotion, gel or aerosol.
Jelly Bellies, grapes and crème-filled chocolates are ARE NOT liquids,
yogurt IS.
Once you determine if it is considered a liquid then at least two regulations do apply:
1- the 3.4 oz rule (that is per item and per the label, not how much is in the container
2- (Non-medication) liquids must be in a 1-quart zip top bag for you carry on.
Anything larger than 3.4 oz per the label, must to go in checked bags.
If you have liquid medication, it is best to take it out of the carry on and place it in a bin to be x-rayed separately.
If you have questions, you may ask for a supervisor at any time.
The Liquids guidelines are posted on the TSA. Website at www.tsa.gov and on signs or flyers at the airports.
Pepper spray, mace and little pocket knives are NOT allowed in carry on bags or on your person! Read the signs carefully at the checkpoint.
TSO Lori
March 26, 2008 3:15 AM
I am a TSO at an airport that is not listed on this blog and regardless of what you tell the passenger or show the passenger they still say they didn't know about the rules and regulations. So by saying that we need to provide a brochure with detailed instructions would be ridiculous. They will still tell us that they "were not aware" of the limits for the liquids. I think that if they want more information they can get it from the website. Our lists change quite frequently so that is why they don't have the brochure, although you have a good idea, it is just not practical.
March 26, 2008 1:05 PM
I play darts casually, and have been known to be absent-minded. I also generally try to avoid checking baggage when flying for short-stay trips, for obvious reasons. I recently flew from LAX to SLC for a weekend with family. On the return journey, I discovered that I had failed to remove my darts from my bag before leaving LAX. Yes, the darts had gone through security with nary a murmur at LAX, but at SLC, they were spotted. I was allowed to mail them to myself, which is fair enough since darts are a prohibited item. Strictly, I should not have been able to carry them from LAX to SLC, and next time I shall make sure that I do not attempt to.
On the return flight, I was going through security at the same time as a relative who was flying to OAK. In his carry-on, he had a gift which he had been given while in Utah: a letter opener. I cannot understand why my darts, with less than 1.5 inches of pointed tip and of a shape completely unsuited to attempted use as a weapon, are unacceptable while a letter-opener with a six inch long, pointed blade and a handle which makes it ideally suited to be used as a stabbing weapon is perfectly OK. If someone is able to explain this inconsistency, I would be very grateful.
March 26, 2008 7:21 PM
TSO finds firearm at Honolulu International Airport, and Brass Knuckles and Derringer found at LAX airport. Turns out the firearm, without ammunition, was improperly packed in checked luggage, the brass knuckles were a belt buckle, and the Derringer was a lighter. This type of sensationalism reminds me of a super market tabloid rather than a serious agency.
Sort of like a drowning man grasping at straws? When you have as much bad press as TSA does, you go for whatever puts you into the 'I done good' column, if just for a few moments.
March 26, 2008 9:10 PM
Anonymous said...
"I love the headlines on the www.tsa.gov web site: TSO finds firearm at Honolulu International Airport, and Brass Knuckles and Derringer found at LAX airport. Turns out the firearm, without ammunition, was improperly packed in checked luggage, the brass knuckles were a belt buckle, and the Derringer was a lighter. This type of sensationalism reminds me of a super market tabloid rather than a serious agency."
ANONYMOUS NEEDS TO BE AWARE of the fact if TSA didn't inspect these things, that some smart aleck is going to try to 'see if he/she can get a real one onboard by claiming it to be a fake'. I amsure TSA has thousands of reports about people "who tried to get a real weapon in, just to see if they could"
AND,..if you rob a bank with a fake gun, it is an 'armed robbery' just the same.
TSA is perfectly justifed in checking this stuff out. I want my children, grandchildren their grandparents to fly safe.
YOU cannot gaurantee that for me, but atleast TSA is making the effort. It is commonplace in our society to 'stand by and watch' an injured person and not help. I for one, do jump in and help, and so does TSA. There are those that "do" and those who "watch" them do it. If you don't want to be part of the solution, then you really should stay out of the way of those who do, and not be so judgmental. Who are you going to blame if (God forbid) the bad stuff happens again? I am pretty sure you are the kind who would blame TSA telling them they 'weren't doing everything' they could, right after you just told them they were looking to hard.
March 26, 2008 9:38 PM
Any comment on the latest inconsistency: forcing a woman to remove piercings, when TSA policy permits a private pat-down screening instead?
March 27, 2008 9:02 PM
I'd like the woman in Lubbock, TX (complaining about unfair screening) to view this video clip and then see if she still feels she was unfairly screened: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sUdUEOVdEuc
This clip, albeit in a different part of the world, shows just how real a suicide bomber can be - in everyday life. If you don't like to be screened - (1) wear stuff that doesn't alarm, (2) drive yourself if you have time and energy, (3) take the train or bus. Terrorism a real part of all of our lives - we must learn to live with it and learn to tolerate those who are trying to keep all of us safe on a daily basis. As Tom Ridge said at the beginning of TSA - We need to be right a million times a day and the terrorists only need to be right once. May God Bless us all and keep that ONE out of our skies.
March 28, 2008 6:54 AM
I'd also like to ask the blog to comment on the post above about a woman being forced to remove her nipple rings
:
http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/03/27/nipple.ring.ap/index.html
This just makes no sense. A visual inspection or pat down should be sufficient and there should never be a need to force someone to remove their piercings. The TSA website states that a patdown should have been performed, why did the screeners not know this?
Really, this sometimes this seems less about security and common sense than causing as much inconvenience as possible to someone when the drones at the checkpoint see something "different". Whether it's a Macbook Air or a small piercing it's plainly obvious that it's not a security issue, so why do screeners insist on doing the most inconvenient and illogical thing possible?
Removing body piercings causes a great deal of inconvenience and in many cases will cause the loss of the piercing. It's not a case of simply reinserting the piercing, but having to go through the inconvenience and pain of having it done all over again and go through the several month healing process. Please, please please fix this issue!
March 28, 2008 8:23 AM
Anonymous @ 6:54AM
You said "Terrorism a real part of all of our lives - we must learn to live with it and learn to tolerate those who are trying to keep all of us safe on a daily basis. As Tom Ridge said at the beginning of TSA - We need to be right a million times a day and the terrorists only need to be right once. May God Bless us all and keep that ONE out of our skies."
You, sir, are either a stooge for the current administration or a complete idiot. The only reason "terrorism" is a part of our daily lives is because of the restrictions on civil liberties enacted by a completely incompetent administration led by a "president" that has less smarts than my Blackberry.
Unfortunately it seems there are more sheeple like you than rational folks, in which case a once great country will soon be ranked alongside other banana republics such as Zimbabwe. ANYONE that would quote Tom Ridge has clearly lost the plot. "OOOOH Run she has a NIPPLE RING". Bloody puritans.
March 28, 2008 12:41 PM
This is supposed to be about security, not judgments on body piercing.
It's plain and simple if a metal detector is set off (and most times body piercings do not set off detectors), then the TSA staff should verify that it is a piercing as claimed, verify that it is not a security hazard and allow the passenger on their way. This can all be done with a pat down or visual inspection.
There is not a single circumstance that would require a piercing to be removed to verify that it is not a hazard.
Any one (like the previous poster) that believes that we need to give up personal freedom in exchange for security does not deserve the privilege that the US Constitution brings and the honor of living in the US - go and find another police state to live in!
March 28, 2008 1:26 PM
Once again I'm so glad our airport has camera's. As a TSA employee I honestly can't believe the nipple story as true. No way in h.e .double hockey sticks would that EVER happen at my airport!!!!!!!!!!!!
March 28, 2008 1:35 PM
Camera's you say?
Bob/Christopher etc, is this nipplegate something TSA will look into? That was a very disturbing abuse of power
March 28, 2008 5:17 PM
I recently flew from Hartford to El Passo. This was the first time that I had been through security since I had a seven inch long piece of stainless steel put on my right leg. I walked through the "metal detector" and it failed to detect it. I told the security screener about this deficiency in the equipment, but he just shrugged and told me to move on. I FEAR that if I had had a gun strapped to my leg I could have brought it on board. What good is this time consuming process if it is subject to that kind of error and lack of concern.
March 29, 2008 10:59 AM
ok. with the lady that had to remove her nipple rings it is part of our procedure. we cannot resolve alarms such as that one simply by patting the area down or visualy inspecting the area as we are not allowed to touch or ask to view these areas. i also know personnely that it is only painful to remove the piercings if it was just pierced about a day ago or so. just like any other piercing such as your ears or your belly button the skin cannot grow in such a way that would make it hard to remove. it creates a fiscula a layer of skin that surrounds just the bar or part of the ring making a sort of tube for the jewelry to sit in.
March 29, 2008 5:56 PM
I believe most of the inconsistencies experienced at different airports come down to the number of arrivals and departures at any particular airport, i.e. Lubbock, TX. I predict that the piercing problem would never have happened at Las Vegas, Portland, Denver, even Phoenix.
I generally fly with two digital SLRs, extra batteries, portable hard drives, battery chargers, and three or four additional lenses. All of my departures have been from Las Vegas. Never have I been pulled aside and had my camera carryon inspected. Flying into and out of Portland, Orlando and Denver, no problems. However, each and every time I have flown out of Midland Tx (my home town), I and my camera bag have been pulled aside for additional attention, every item in my camera bag was wiped down for explosive residue and visually checked.
My thinking is that the folks in smaller airports such as Lubbock and Midland don't get much traffic with extensive carryon electronic equipment and such.
Having an implanted defribrilator and gone through pat downs in lieu of wanding, I will say that the TSA agents I have experiences have been most professional in their conduct and remarks.
March 29, 2008 6:23 PM
If everyday all the people you interacted with told you how stupid you are, or asked you how retarded you have to be to get a job like this, woulnd't you think you would start to get worn down after a while?? This is our job, we get up every morning and work an eight hour day just like you. So if it bothers you that we are void of emotion or care, why don't you try treating us with a little respect. The next time you feel like telling a TSO how dumb you think they are, pretend you are talking to your son, daughter, husband, wife, mother or father. Wouldn't it make you sad to know that someone you love was being degraded every day at work? We can't control the rules, we just have to enforce them.
March 29, 2008 6:25 PM
Would you all like some Cheese with that wine. I have seen far too many posts with people saying they intentionally bring stuff through security that they know is not allowed to see if they get caught. That is insane! Why would you want to do that knowing your going to cause a delay to yourself and fellow passengers. FOLLOW THE RULES! Sorry if you do not agree with them all but they are in place for good reason. Most of the STORIES in this blog are false. I read one story in the gripes and grins section where a woman said 3 TSO's pulled a gun on her and held it to her head because she threw her apple core on the ground. We do not carry guns! FALSE!
The next time you have a trip and your are taking a plane do some research on the net and try not to pack your brain with the rest of your belongings.
March 29, 2008 8:21 PM
I think you people complain way too much.
March 29, 2008 8:25 PM
My other half flew from Louisville to Baltimore to NH on Friday. Despite having to toss a full, unopened soda bought just outside the gates- TSA was the best part of his trip. They were polite, professional, in good humor (he took some good-natured digs from one of the guys about his Sox sweatshirt)and even apologetic about the length of the wait due to the multitude of families in front of him in line.
My last two flights (Louisville to Laguardia round trip and Louisville to JFK round trip) I found the same situation that he had on Friday.
I am flying to Orlando and back this week- I only hope that I have the same experience.
That said- the most rude, most understaffed and most inconsistant TSA folks we have ever encountered were at Boston Logan. We would rather fly into NH and drive than ever deal with Logan again.
March 30, 2008 5:43 AM
I feel that consistency is a bit over-rated. Yes, I want the list of items you can't take on the plane to be enforced consistently. But.. the methods of screening should be RANDOMLY exercised so as to keep people (terrorists) slightly on edge.
Example: I carry a LOT of paraphenalia within my computer case, including a couple of 15' ethernet cables that could rather effectively be used as rope. You'd think that much wire would cause someone to ask "Why?" One time out of 20, I think my case should be manually searched, but it never has been sinced they stopped the gate searches just before you get on the plane.
I support the idea of "inconsistency" as to who gets checked for what and when. It'd make me feel MORE secure if randomly a TSA agent took 3-4 minutes and asked (politely).. "You've got 2 hours before your flight, let's see what you're carrying today".
March 30, 2008 6:38 AM
I think there SHOULD be inconsistency in checks such as the shoe policy. I know that I'm a bit out of the mainstream here, but by having slightly different policies at different airports, you ARE making it tougher on the terrorists. By having a single rule that applies everywhere, you allow the terrorists enough time to figure a way around that rule.
By having SOME rules that vary location by location, or even better, if you applied SOME rules randomly by time or date, you make life more difficult for the people who are trying to "get away with something".
Believe it or not, there is a difference between an "honest citizen" and the 30% of folks that I've met in security who whine and complain about the rules.
Stop being so self-centered folks! By whining about the fact that there ARE various rules for security, you are saying that you consider yourself to be above those rules! This is the SAME thing that the terrorists feel - that the rule of law doesn't apply to them.
If you truly cared about security, you would integrate yourself into the security process.. you should be on the outlook yourself for security problems.
March 30, 2008 6:56 AM
Flying out of Detroit Metro,my wife and I were asked to remove our hooded sweatshirts. Good thing we had t-shirts on underneath. Secondly, has anyone ever seen a TSA official smile?
March 30, 2008 7:11 AM
I've had mixed experiences with security in various airports I've been to.
I would say a few dedicated lanes for those who are experienced travelers, a few for families & those with disabilities that need more time to get through would nice as well.
I've had some screeners be rude towards travelers barking commands at people to remove coats and shoes and have bags etc ready for screening. I would say some bigger signs up before security check points reminding people what to do would be nice for those who dont remember or don't travel much or first time travelers.
I've had screeners be very helpful and nice and get people through in an efficient manner others not so much.
I've been to Ireland, United Kingdom, Canada, and Denmark, and the security personnel in those places not only are helpful but make sure things go as quickly and efficiently as possible, and also the screeners are very polite as i am some airports have to screen so many people.
March 30, 2008 8:01 AM
Please improve the following:
1. Lines, time required to be at the airport prior to takeoff. Both TSA and the airlines have made flying a stressful and time consuming activity. I don't understand how both can be un-prepared for the number of people arriving at the airport on any given day. Both TSA and the airlines have a database of flights and how many people are on them for each day, so how come both can't staff the airport so people only have 5 minute waits at security and check-in. Small airports seem to do this very well, hubs seem unable to do this and always have long lines (even on days when their are no cancellations/problems). Clearly, they are just understaffed.
2. I have been treated rudely several times for not following inconsistent policies. One time I was yelled at by a TSA agent for taking my boots off (that it was not required today) only to then get up to the metal detector and have another say I had to take them off, when I politely mentioned what I was previously told, they only put me down and their co-worker. People are happy to comply and understand the rules do change, but either be friendly in stating what you want or post a sign at security arrival (I know it sucks to say the same think all day but hey that is part of the job).
March 30, 2008 10:21 AM
Would you please ask your employees to stop yelling at everyone in line waiting to go through security. I get really annoyed at the nazi storm trooper act that really doesn't produce any positive effect. Mostly I think you guys do a pretty good job and are generally well behaved and polite. I am also aware that there are idiots in every occupation, however, no one likes to be treated like cattle. Work on emphasizing a little more sensitivity and common courtesy in your training.
March 30, 2008 10:49 AM
FOLLOW THE RULES! Sorry if you do not agree with them all but they are in place for good reason.
I do obey the rules and still get grief from your TSOs.
Oct 2002 O'hare:
TSA gate inspector wants to remove medical tape on a 12 inch (30cm) incision to see staples (visible through translucent tape)
Numerous occasions unlocked tool chest given to TSA and locks either cut off, left off, or not relocked. Please tell me how this is my fault.
Laptop bag fully emptied (part of my job requires IT stuff)as a local procedure (O'hare again). Grey bin filled, top to bottom and front to back. Nothing but rudeness from TSO's.
TSA writing STUPID in permanent marker on the side of a coworker's tool chest.
Screamed at by bellowing/raging/R. Lee Emery wanna-bes.
Tell me how threats from TSA types make me safer. Please tell me how I can travel with tools (including IT equip) and have some assurance that it will arrive in one piece and secure?
Most of the STORIES in this blog are false.
Are the items I posted above false? You don't know. I do.
I read one story in the gripes and grins section where a woman said 3 TSO's pulled a gun on her and held it to her head because she threw her apple core on the ground. We do not carry guns! FALSE!
Perhaps this was a case where local policies allowed for a TSO to carry and project lethal force. When you have an organization with no built in controls you often have examples of outrageous behavior.
March 30, 2008 11:12 AM
My husband and I flew from Madison to NYC (LGA)this week for a professional conference. We had no trouble going through security in Madison. TSA employees are terrific here! When we fly we usually have a laptop, pda, cellphones, digital slr, many sd cards, mp3 player, and a portable dvd player. We take up a lot of bins. I also must carry medication with me and an epinephrine pen. No problems in Madison or any other city we've flown into or out of. However, at LGA they must have different rules. We must take DVD players out of their soft sided cases. Okay fine. We can do that. But when my husband, by way of apology, said to the TSA screener that we weren't used to that, the screener unloaded on him, yelling that this was policy at all airports and all of the other airports were doing it wrong. He was very rude and then another person joined in the bullying session. My husband, who is one of the nicest people I've ever met, kept his cool but was unnerved by the process. TSA employees in this particular city should be trained to be polite. We certainly didn't mind removing a dvd player from a soft sided case. We just don't think we should be yelled at.
March 30, 2008 11:14 AM
I fly twice a month, to work and home. I've noticed the TSO's make this up as they go. I spent many long years in law enforcement. So I know what and where they should look. And 90% of they time they do not look. Because their to busy looking to see what kinda clothes is packed, what interesting things are packed and so on. Every one knows or has seen the fresh rookie straight out of the police academy? With the attitude of I'm the law and you do what I say and when I say. Well I would have to say that about 95% of the TSOs I come across
try to or do abuse their power just to see if they can get away with it. They all need some interpersonal skills training. Just to watch they way they deal with passengers is disgusting at times. Their rude, and all the yelling that they do is very uncalled for. And they wounder why passengers act like they do. Try talking in a calm and lower tone with out the smart eleck remarks and you'll get a better response. No one like or wants to be yelled at.
March 30, 2008 11:17 AM
I would like to see the basics of the metal detector process outlined on signs to be read while waiting on line. Each airport is different in what they want. Some want all shoes off, others want certain shoes to be taken off. Some airports want a certain amount of items in the tub while others want shoes to go directly on the conveyer instead of in the tub. People would be more cooperative if they knew exactly what to expect as they were approaching the conveyer belt. While in Orlando one TSA screamed his head off at every person approaching the bag scan. He looked and sounded annoyed because he had to keep screaming the directive over and over again. A posted sign might have helped this unpleasant situation. That or a looped recording to save his voice.
March 30, 2008 11:51 AM
Dear TSA,
I travel around 26-40 weeks out of the year working for a technology company and part of my job is on-site support. As part of my job I am required to carry a small bag of tools to verify installs and correct minor OEM mistakes. My comment is in regards to the interpretation of the seven inch rule. 90% of the TSO's I interface with question the items I carry and I have to debate my way through the checkpoint narrowly clinging to my much needed tools. Every single one of those TSO's has a different take on what I should be able to pass through with and every TSO targets a different item as "dangerous" from screwdrivers to a crescent wrench? Yes! I had a 6.5 crescent wrench confiscated. I'm not quite clear on what threat that item posed, but they took it. I have lost around a dozen tools in the last year. Some were probably out of range for the 7 inch rule. Others clearly weren't. In bringing this up, when will you come up with a clear guideline for people who have to carry-on tools? The seven inch rule is generic and leaves it wide open to opinion. Maybe a little education with the TSO's on what to look for when it comes to tools would be great. Sometimes I come across a TSO who has zero idea what any of the items in my bag are and has to go get a supervisor who also has no idea what any of them are, and that slows things way down. I don't have an option of checking my bag everywhere I go because of my travel schedule, so it only leaves me with dealing with this option and when I have to waste 20 minutes at the checkpoint alone due to lack of education about the items I carry, it can send the frustration level skyward. In closing, it would be nice if you came up with a standard, policy, and clear guidelines for the end users on what will be accepted so I don't have to buy anymore tools and get held back gratuitously, it would be much appreciated.
Thanks,
Chris
March 30, 2008 11:55 AM
Hi there. I would like to say that I support the TSA and feel grateful that you guys are there to protect us. However, I do have two comments.
Firstly, I am a farmer from Hawaii. When I go to the mainland US I bring back small packages of seeds, the same kind that anyone can buy in a garden shop. The amount of seeds in any one pack is less than a tablespoon. Seeds are very sensitive to radiation. If you X-ray them, most of them will not germinate. Although most TSA screeners have been kind enough to let me through with my seed packets, there have been some who insist that my seeds must be X-rayed, which destroys them, wastes my money and kills living things. (Hey, I know it's not a dog or a baby, but if you were a farmer you might feel that way about your plants too.) Despite being told that the X-ray will kill the seeds, and my offering to open the packets so the inspectors can see that they are seeds, they refuse, and insists on X-ray. This burns me up. If I mail the seeds or put them in my checked bags, they are subject X-ray and to extremes of temperature that also will effect germination.
Could you please have some guidelines for seeds? If you policy is that they are not allowed, so be it, but I would like to request that you consider allowing so many ounces of seeds, especially if they are pre-packaged.
My second comment is about TSA employees' moods and attitudes. I'm a cheerful happy go lucky person (hey, I live in Hawaii). I smile and say hello. I treat everyone with politeness. I value good manners. I would LOVE IT if TSA would have regular workshops addressing putting forward a positive image to the public. Honestly, many TSA representatives seem to have a mood disorder, lots of gruffness and hostility, which is really unnecessary. I (we) pay their salaries through taxes, and I can tell you, if I had a farm hand who acted like that they would be given a chance to improve their attitude and if they couldn't, it would be the end of the line. I know they have a difficult and stressful job, and I appreciate all that the TSA representatives do for our country. But the agency has to make them realize that being polite, positive and cheerful will actually make their job easier and improve how they feel every day. It will also decrease attrition.
All that being said, I just want to say "Thanks" and "Aloha"
March 30, 2008 12:00 PM
I just wish the TSA screeners would follow their own rules. I was at an airport recently and I read all the signs posted while in line. The signs said that one did NOT have to take off one's shoes if they were flat. So I did not take off my shoes when I arrived at the pass throughs. I politely pointed out that there was a sign just a few feet away that said no shoes were to be taken off! Oh well, how sad that when passengers want to follow the rules they change on a whim. Now the screener did call someone to inform them of the sign but I heard a voice come over the radio that said "I don't care what it says" I think that is the key to all these problems, the screeners DON'T CARE!
March 30, 2008 12:42 PM
To the anonymous poster who complained about the "little woman" and her children being able to knit in the airport: Read the TSA brochure! They are allowed! Believe me, they are not pointy and really couldn't be used as a weapon, even by a strong man.
March 30, 2008 12:51 PM
I fly out of Orlando 3-4 times a year and they have there act together. Great overall job from an airport that sees thousands of tourist every day. I wish that was the same for Buffalo's airport. The first tsa agent is sitting on a stool and the expierance goes down hill from there. There is no effort on anyones part to speed the process. It seems like we are interupting there time. I have stopped showing my military id to the agents why? Because everytime i do they move me over to the side and i receive the frisk down. R they looking for safe people to check or potential terroists?
One comment about liquids. Why do people need to put liquids into the baggy to get past security when all they have to do is go to the bathroom and take them back out of the baggy? It is not the amount of liquid it is what the lquid is....
March 30, 2008 1:09 PM
I travel at least once or twice a week. I do not ask for any special treatment by TSA because of my airlines travel status. I have adapted to their regulations, restrictions and all of the idiosyncrasies at each of the various check stations at each city.
Believe it or not being prepared has made my travel experience more pleasureful rather than all the complaining you folks are doing. I get to watch so many of you bitch and complaint when for the most part it is your lack of preparation that causes the rest of those in line the biggest headaches and delays.
Now I don’t necessarily agree with all the regulations either. Some of them are a bit on the hair brain idea. But do you really know why we cannot take more than 3 ounces in a container and why it has to be in the bag. Believe it or not we are not privileged to all the reasons why our security has the regulations they have in place at any given day. We may not understand why they don’t make it more stream line. But we would want the next shoe bomb wearing idiot to have an advantage by “learning” the system of the screening process.
Those of you that are complaining here are the very same people that will be complaining and demanding where the security was when we have the next 9-11 event! Which is it going to be people? You cannot have it both ways. When you do have to travel don’t forget that the TSA personnel at the gates are only there to enforce the current rules. When was the last time you thanked the TSA personnel as you went through the screening process? They are doing their jobs.
March 30, 2008 1:57 PM
There are many inconsistancies. In Indiana we had to take off our shoes, but got to pick what line to go in (the shortest of corse), but then in Mexico we didnt have to take off our shoes, and there was a guy telling us what line to go in. He put us in the LONGEST line, and when we asked him, in Spanish even, he said we had to stay in the line we were assigned to. Talk about power trip! We nearly missed the flight! People behind us in the initial line were long gone, and us, yep still waiting to walk through the metal detectors. Someone please give these people standards and training. How are we supposed to know what to do, if nothing is consistant!!!!
March 30, 2008 2:08 PM
How many times in the process must a person show their boarding pass? I show it to the ticket agent and then I wait in a line to sow it to one TSA official before boarding a tram to the gates. After leaving the tram I wait in another line to again show my boarding pass to another TSA person
before going to the screening process. I then show it again to still another TSA person after going through the metal detector. Are all of the subsequent viewings of the boarding pass necessary just in case the previous screener missed it? It just seems like a huge duplication of effort. It just cannot be an efficient process
with all of this redundancy. This was in the Tampa airport by the way.
March 30, 2008 2:27 PM
Looking forward to my first Express Lane security screening; hope it works and that the "special" pass so one does not have to remove shoes, "jackets" (more on "jackets" later), etc. every time!
Why do some airports get to hide their going through you stuff when others will open right in front of you?
Why can't the TSA change gloves for every case? I know that the gloves are to protect them, but it turns my stomach to have my clothing and other personal items by filthy hands/gloves. Ditto for bins that are covered in gunk, and I set in my baggie or clothing to have it come out dirty!
Why does Chris at Jackson Hole know that, eventhough, he'll be reported for, literally!!!!, slamming my bag down onto the belt to the back, nothing will happen so a smug, condescending smirk and a "so what" response when I ask for his name?
Why 24 (yes, I counted) TSA sitting in IAH where they could see massive lines and checking their watches for the five minutes they have left? Then walking deliberately slowly to their stations. That day 2 hours in line; other days 1.5 hours. In the last four years have never been in that line less than 1 hour.
Why DFW has the most rude TSA? Want my story on my shoes disappearing for 30 minutes in DFW?
And, yes, the inconsistancies!!! Too many to even remember in the last 5-6 years.
Kudos to the crew at HDN except for the hidden examination table. Kudos to the crew at COD except their lack of continuous control of the bag once it has been searched (they sit on a cart that is not always w/in sight of the TSA). Kudos to PKB especially on the crack-of-dawn shift.
You really need to have some sort of set up in which someone can empty a baby bottle or a personal nalgene, etc. w/out leaving security altogether and w/out having to ingest the total contents.
March 30, 2008 2:38 PM
I do not understand why it is that the people that work at the Starbucks, etc and the flight crews can move to the front of the line at the check point. We are the customers, what happened to the customer is always right? It never fails that this happens to me when I am running late due for a flight normally because of long lines at the airport. Is there any other business that treats it's customers this badly? I spend approx 75,000.00 per year on flights.
March 30, 2008 3:00 PM
I'm sure you've heard this before, but I'm posting to increase the frequency of which you hear these complaints (and in case you haven't heard these).
I travel fairly frequently (I've boarded 20 airplanes so far this year) and there are several inconsistencies with TSA security check points:
- The sensitivity of the metal detector varies. Sometimes I get through with my belt on. Other times I have to go back and take it off...depends on the airport.
- Some airports REQUIRE that shoes are taken off and other don't. Of the airports that don't require the removal of shoes, sometimes the shoes trigger the metal detector and other times they don't (even with the same pair of shoes).
- Sometimes travelers are required to keep their boarding pass with them and sometimes they're not. This depends on the airport. The funny part is the TSA personnel don't seem to know that the rules vary by airport. They speak to travelers as if we should know their specific rules. My home airport is ORD. There's a woman there (I've seen her a few times) who gets annoyed at travelers that keep their boarding pass in their hands! I guess she gets tired of everyone trying to show her their pass. Not sure what the harm is. She could simply say thanks & have them move on. Instead she makes obnoxious announcements telling people to put their boarding passes away!
That's all I've got. I think everyone would get through security faster if they knew in advance that they must take off their shoes and belts, that they must keep their boarding passes in their hands, and any amount of metal (even high iron in the blood) could potentially set off the detector. I've gotten into the habit of always removing my belt and shoes, and keeping my boarding pass in my back pocket as I go through...just in case.
Thanks for listening! Keith Harrison
March 30, 2008 3:16 PM
TSA,
I travel 35-40 weeks a year and I have very few problems with the rules and regulations. The problem I have is with either incompetent, uneducated or power thirsty TSA employees. In Seattle, on a trip to Anaheim, I was asked about an itme in my carry-on. It was a 7 inch socket wrench handle. I had checked with TSA a few days earlier and confirmed that as long as it was no more than 7 inches, it was legal. When the agent pulled it out of my bag, he looked at it and said it was too long. I told him it was exactly 7 inches and that I had confirmed with TSA earlier that it was legal. He then took it over to a stand and held it up against something on the top of this booth and came back to me and said it was an inch and a half too long. I knew he was wrong and asked to see what "scale" he was using to measure it with. I was told I couldn't go into that area and I could either mail it or check the bag. I asked to see a supervisor and he told me he was the supervisor. I was furious but knowing you can't win that battle, went back to the ticket counter and checked the bag. When I arrived in Anaheim, I immediately went to a hardware store and bought a plastice ruler to measure the handle. Surprise, surprise, surprise!!! It was exactly SEVEN inches long. Now that's a reason you have furious passengers and why your agency cathes all the grief it does. We have no recourse against some power thirsty "wanna be a cop" mentality. The next time a situation arises and I know I am in the right, I will ask the local police (or port) authority to get involved and will file a complaint against the TSA individual.
Thank you,
Kirk in Seattle
ps If you would like to contact me:
NFLDeepSix@aol.com
March 30, 2008 3:16 PM
In your directions for the blog you say you expect people to be respectful in what they post. What about the TSA people being respectful of us? Most of them I have encounter in many airports are not respectful, they are rude, expect me to do what ever they ask, depending on what mood they are in, they treat me like I am a terrorist. There is never any kind of consistently from trip to trip of what is allowed and not allowed. Food should not be an issue, especially an unopened item, in plastic that is small. Or fresh fruit. So you take this from us so you can have lunch. There is no rhyme or reason. Flights are long and difficult and you would like to have a small snack. The food in airports is not what a healthy person whats, nor do I want to pay the high prices of food in airports. Sometimes you do not have time to buy anything in the first place. I sometimes think all of you are in this together so you can all profit from the terrorists. I in general do not have a problem with doing things to protect myself and others in this terrorist time of ours. But some common sense on a lot of this would go along way. I think you all have gotten way out of hand with your demands. I think it is a control issue on your part, lets see what we can get them to do today, next week or next month. One guy wanted my purse to go one way and me the other way, no way in hell, so you can steal something out of it. My purse does not get out of my sight and you should not expect anyone to let their personal belongs be out of their sight. I know someone that had something stolen from her bag, you know it happens more often than we hear about. This new deal about charging us to take the same amount of baggage for 20 years plus, we are now reduced to take only one bag. Is this for the airlines or for you all, or are all of you profitting from this? What does it matter if you take 2 bags, as long as things are not overloaded? Flying is a pain in the butt now on so many levels!!! And it does not have to be, everyone has just gotten way out of line on so many things. Passengers can not even say anything to you, or question you that you do not gang up together against the passenger that said something. I would hate to have a job like yours.
March 30, 2008 3:17 PM
I travel for business every week all over the USA and western Europe. Please answer me this! why is there so much inconsistency in TSA protocol regarding items allowed and removal of items? I'll travel through three different airports (in the US) on the same travel day and be required to do different things at all three airports (remove all electronics at one airport but only the laptop at the other...). Just when you think you understand and thus, prepare for the TSA requirements (which facilitates faster through put!), the TSA changes requirements.
My other frustration is to be in a long TSA line with maybe one or two lanes open but many TSA staff just standing around. Here's a concept, OPEN ANOTHER LINE!!! My job requires me to be as efficient as possible, why can't we expect the TSA to be functioning the same way? After all, we are paying for it! I think it's time for the bureaucrats to step aside (yes, I know, it's job security and it makes you feel important!) and let the TSA do the job they are designed to do!
March 30, 2008 4:04 PM
I bought TSA-approved combination locks for our luggage when we went on a family vacation 2 or 3 years ago. No problems that trip, but ...
May 2007, using those same TSA-approved locks, I attended my brother's retirement ceremony in Tucson. Problem #1: Combo lock missing after return trip. Inside was a TSA slip saying it was cut off because they couldn't open the (TSA-approved) lock. Huh?!? Thought they had keys for all those special, approved locks?
July 2007 my son returned via Atlanta from a month in Germany as an exchange student. Problem #2: Another missing a lock. Again, a TSA slip saying it was cut off because they couldn't open the (TSA-approved) lock. Hmmm, lazy or vandalism? Problem #3: Six carefully wrapped/cushioned bottles of special German beer(can't get it here) bought as a gift for his dad were totally unwrapped. No problem IF re-wrapped after inspecting. Instead they put unprotected glass bottles back in the suitcase. Between beer stink and glass shards, the bag I loaned him and its contents were ruined!
Bottom line: I'm out two locks, one piece of luggage, and the contents of that suitcase. All because someone couldn't or wouldn't do their job correctly.
To give credit where due, though: Going through security in Tucson 3/6/08 a TSA employee was extremely kind. I should have known better but had packed a jar of salsa in my carry-on, not my checked luggage. Instead of confiscating it, he ran the salsa back down the terminal to the security checkpoint and handed it to my mom.
--Lynn C.
March 30, 2008 4:33 PM
Yes the terrorist have won and Bin Laden and company are layghing thier @@##$% of.
When TSA opens luggage they should be required to place thier name and contat info inside the luggage. I have had merchandise stolen from inside my luggage with a TSA checkes sticker on the bag.
Also I agree wuth another poster that has metal implants, Hips as was his and my case. I go through security trip the detectors and I go stand on a pad and wait till someone waves the wand. I tell them that I have artificial hips and even though there is nothing present in any pocket I have been requested to submit for a private screening in order to fly. Since when would a TSA employee know where to look for a scar from an implant.
All in all I will sacrifice time and drive to a location rather than be subjected to the humiliation that TSA puts passengers through.
March 30, 2008 4:57 PM
Anonymous on March 30, 2008 6:56 AM
says that inconsistencies make it harder for the terrorists. So do you some how specifically know that terrorists are trying to cause harm with their shoes, toothepaste, olive oil, or sweatshirts? None of the new items being scrutinized at airport checkpoints since the 9/11 attacks have been used to cause any damage on any flight.
The fact that millions of innocent people are hassled daily at airports, and the fact that our time and money is being lost on this nonsense is likely just as pleasing to "the terrorists" that you speak of.
You should also know that many inconsistencies that occur at TSA checkpoints are not part of any strategy rather they are based on the personality, mood and training of the TSA employees. Through my non-TSA related airport job and my frequent travels I have witnessed and experienced daily inconsistencies and tremendous differences in employees conduct and their ability to deal with people and the task at hand.
March 30, 2008 5:27 PM
It is increasingly frustrating that the TSA staff from airport to airport interput the rules so differnetly. I recently flew from Omaha to San Diego with my 2 cats. They were each in their own airline approved carrier and in a pet stroller. I was told I need to take the cats out of the bags and carry then through the security check point as their stroller and carriers went through the X ray. Traveling alone, I asked if I could carry one cat through put her in her carrier (after it had passed the xray), then step back through the metal detector to grab the other cat and carry her through. I was told that I was not allowed to do this because I would not be allowed to touch the stroller or carrier and then step back through the metal detector. Don't the TSA staff have travelers step back and forth all the time if they set off the detector?? I was lucky. Another traveler carried one of my cats and I carriered the other. I have flown with my cats several times and this is the 1st time I have ever been told I was not allowed to take on cat through and then grab the other.
March 30, 2008 5:41 PM
I travel several times a month and have come to expect minimal seucirty from TSA. After 9/11, I had a swiss army knife that slipped into the lining of my suitcase so I had no clue it was even there but for one full year it traveled with me with no indication through TSA... Unintentially I have gone through TSA in LaGuardia with a bottle of water, through several other airports without having to take out my my carry-on liquids and lastly in Richmond where TSA allowed someone to go through security after telling them they did not have photo ID. The whole thing is ridiculous and we are no safer today. Maybe if TSA wasn't so concerned when their break was or about me taking off my shoes and would pay attention to what is on the screen in front of them I'd feel better. It would be great if the training was across the board and the same at every airport as well as having the same quality people - maybe take some lessons from security people in Las Vegas... Its sad and if people think we are any safer, they are mistaken...
March 30, 2008 6:11 PM
My husband and I just recently flew roundtrip from RDU to LBB. We had exactly the same items in our carry on bags when leaving RDU and we did when leaving LBB to come back home...sailed right thru RDU without a problem. Both of us were "selected" for additional screening when we presented our driver's license and boarding pass to the agent at security. All of our carry on bags were emptied, wiped down and checked...as were our shoes. One would think if things were ok going from RDU to LBB that they would also have been ok coming back. Neither of us triggered the metal detector as we both had already removed everything but clothes and placed them in the bins for screening. Only remaining metal items on were wedding rings and the metal screws in my husband's ankle! Still have no idea why we required the additional screening other than the fact that the agent spent a full 5 minutes scrutinizing our driver's licenses before allowing us to move thru metal detector then be patted down and almost strip searched. A little consistency would go a long way.
I found the comment interesting about selecting those passengers who have arrived 2 hours prior to flight time for extra screening because they have the time. So because I follow the rules and arrive 2 hours early like I am asked to by TSA I get punished by having to endure additional screening? Next time I will arrive an hour before departure and see if it helps move me along.
Don't get me wrong...I am no opposed to security screenings at the airport. I feel that we have to do whatever is necessary to make air travel safer for all of us. Just make it fair also. I am in medicine and if I treated my patients the way some of the screeners treat the passengers I would be looking for another job. We are paying their salary...treat us with a little respect and maybe we will return the favor.
March 30, 2008 6:39 PM
"I am sure TSA has thousands of reports about people "who tried to get a real weapon in, just to see if they could"
Provide even one iota of evidence to back this type of TSA sensationalism reporting up. If it were not for the 1000's of TSA horror stories and the absurdity of Mr. Ridge's comments about only needing to be right one in a million times. The facts that many many in government and the public sector are making millions and millions of dollars on this whole "terrorists are everywhere" concept, it would be nice to see or read even a few credible "wins" for this department. Otherwise it is just so much hyperbol and fluff and just a really annoying aspect of air travel, because as we all know the only way a terrorist can do evil deeds is by use of an airplane, car bombs, bus bombs, IED's and such things are just made up stories in the press every single day.
March 30, 2008 6:57 PM
I just flew into Philly this past week from Providence and was amazed by the fact the travelers with children can bring sippy cups through the check points but I cannot bring a water. I understand the need for breast milk for infants but sippy cups? Come on now, they should have to do the same as everyone else. Buy your childs drink on the other side. And the three ounce limits and quart sized plastic bags. What is the difference if it is in a plastic bag or brought out for inspection from a toiletries kit.My gel deoderant made it through withouta problem buty my toothpaste had to be discarded because I did not have a plastic bag. There are way too many inconsistancies.
March 30, 2008 8:24 PM
One issue that I have had is how TSA employees get upset with you when you don't know exactly how their line works. For example, in Greensboro you always have to had your boarding pass to a TSA employee before and after the metal detector. When I tried to had my boarding pass after the metal detector to a TSA employee I was spoken to like I was an idiot because someone had already checked it. Its not my fault they all operate differently, they need to be trained to be much more polite because the systems ARE very much different and various airports.
March 30, 2008 9:40 PM
Good Evening TSA,
I have a concern in regards to what I experienced when I took my mother to the airport for an international flight. She is an elderly woman who takes a great amount of medication daily. She had documentation from all her doctor's abotu the medication that she takes and the specific reasons she takes them. Before her flight I checked the TSA website in regards to her medication and was able to determine that all of her medication can be placed in the same carry-on bag and she would still be allowed another carry-on bag for clothing, etc. Well, when I took my mother to the airport we were berrated and told that she is not allowed to have a carry-on for her medication and that she has to check it in with the remainder of her luggage. I then had to explain to the worker that I did research and found that she is allowed to have her medication with her on the flight and that not allowing her was discriminatory against her. After me saying this and then me opening her medication carry-on bag she was allowed to take her medication carry-on bag with her. I was wondering if it is possible if the TSA can inform thier workers and the general public of this right to have their medication with them becuase I am sure that this is not the first time a passenger with documented disabilites was denied this right. Thank you so much.
Sincerely,
Anonymous
March 30, 2008 9:40 PM
It is baffling why SEATAC consistently and chronically has the longest and fewest security lines, much higher wait-times and apparently least active TSA staff (more TSA officers loiter around unopened security points instead of opening up more security lanes) compared with the busier, larger hubs like LAX, SFO, BOS and IAD.
Is it the airport, weather, latte or typical northwest efficiency?
March 30, 2008 10:27 PM
We were between flights in Portland, Oregon, and my 3 year old daughter was hungry. My wife and daughter left the 'sterile area' to goto the food court. Upon trying to re-enter, they refused to let the three year old in because the screener in Medford had written on her ticket in the wrong place! They forced my wife and daughter to endure 'extra screening' which included both of them to be patted down. When they got back towhere I was (I had our 1 year old and all the carry ons with me), my wife was on the verge of crying. I went back to the security area and asked why they were forced to go through this embarrassment. NO ONE could answer my simple question. Even the several supervisors could not come up with an answer. One said one thing, another the complete opposite-in fact, two of them began arguing policy!
IF YOUR SUPERVISORS DON'T KNOW THE RULES, HOW CAN THE LINE WORKERS THAT ARE BELOW THEM???!!!
and..
IF YOUR SUPERVISORY WORKERS DON'T KNOW THE RULES, HOW THE HELL DO YOU EXPECT THE PUBLIC TO KNOW THEM?
It seems to me that you have your work cut out for you. If you were a private comany and I was the boss, I would have fired the whole lot of them in Portland that day. But your employees are protected Civil Servants, whose incompetancy can be overlooked.
After all, you're ONLY in charge of keeping the skies safe for the flying public (Not to mention the people on the ground!)-RIGHT?!
I mean, it's not like you had to make sure my hamburger was fully cooked...
March 30, 2008 10:27 PM
It is baffling why SEATAC consistently and chronically has the longest and fewest security lines, much higher wait-times and apparently least active TSA staff (more TSA officers loiter around unopened security points instead of opening up more security lanes) compared with the busier, larger hubs like LAX, SFO, BOS and IAD.
Is it the airport, weather, latte or typical northwest efficiency?
March 30, 2008 10:31 PM
Let me just get right into it. I fly 3-4 times a month on average and have no patience for this any more. Here's a horror story and a few things to think about:
1. I have never seen more incompetent TSA personnel than those at JFK airport. They are by far the rudest, crankiest, and most stubborn. Last time I flew in there they pulled this 80-something year old grandmother off the line for a special search. Seriously!? Honestly, what do you think poor old granny is going to do?!? What made it worse was that she didn't speak much English, so TSA security decides to watch her struggle with her oversized carry-on (I thought TSA was supposed to carry a person's bags when they get pulled aside!), and drag it over to the quarantine zone. Not once did any of the TSA workers offer to help her as she struggled, and when another flyer that she was with (looked like her son) tried to help her, security swooped in and literally grabbed him and dragged him across the ground. By this time poor granny was crying and looked shell-shocked and TSA just made her stand in the quarantine zone while they harassed her son. TSA ignored her and ignored the pleading of all the other passengers waiting in line that were trying to get the poor woman some medical attention because she was hyperventilating! Way to go TSA! Thanks for harassing poor travelers as they are just trying to go visit family.
2. Oh, but at least we all know that you are saving us from the evils of bottled water and hand lotion. Has anybody else realized that all the over-priced items (waters snacks, magazines, etc.) that they sell after you get through the security checkpoint all come in through that same security checkpoint that you do?!? Someone want to tell me why I can't bring in my own bottled water if that's the case?!? Maybe TSA is getting a kickback from all the airport vendors!?!
3. I tried bringing my $350 custom made pool cue as a carry-on on a trip to Boston. Little did I know that pool cues are considered "deadly weapons" by the TSA. Well I didn't find this out until after I waited on line for 30 minutes, and passed my duffel bag and pool cue bag through the x-ray machine. Then TSA informed me that a pool cue is a "deadly weapon" and that I could either throw it out or go back to the airline desk and put it with the checked baggage. Well I didn't have a choice, so I chanced it getting broken by all the other checked luggage. Then I waited on line for another 20 minutes to go through security again. Here's the kicker that I realized when I unpacked later that night...I had my pocketknife (with a 2.5 inch blade) in my duffel the whole time. I had forgotten that I had put it in there. Well that pocketknife made it through 2 security scans. Thank God I'm NOT a terrorist! But once again, I'm glad to see the TSA doing such a great job!
4. Think about this...TSA airport security screeners get paid $14.63/hour to "protect" us. Ever notice that the people they hire are the bottom of the barrel, bootscraping, trash that can't get jobs elsewhere, and who get their kicks from harassing poor old granny on her trip to Florida?
5. Last week I got through security with a bottle of Gatorade. Glad to see TSA is so thorough with their screenings! Or maybe you only screen certain flavors...is that why my orange Gatorade got through? Must be. Thanks for really doing a great job! Well, at least I didn't have to go and buy another drink for $5 a bottle after I got through security. Sorry you didn't get your kickback.
Let's hear it for the most incompetent government agency ever! Thanks for pretending to keep us safe. Keep up the great work guys, thanks for protecting me from bottles of hand lotion larger than 3oz.!
-Disgruntled Flyer #9
March 31, 2008 12:13 AM
The 3.4 ounce rule sounds reasonable, except for the fact that when shopping in any grocery store or drug store for "travel size" containers of shampoo, conditioner, lotion, etc., the smallest size one can find is 4 ounce containers (or .75 ounce toothpastes. The next largest size of toothpaste is 6 ounces). Traveling out of Mexico and through DFW, all 4 ounce and larger containers were confiscated. Can't Homeland Security coordinate container sizes with the product manufacturers to make air travel a "user friendly" experience? Does .6 ounce mean the difference between a safe product and a potentially explosive device?
March 31, 2008 12:34 AM
TSA Need to start re locking the very expensive TSA locks that passengers have to buy if they want their bags locked. On more that one occasions I get to my destination only to find my TSA lock missing from my suitcase. On one occasion I guess I can call myself lucky because my bag arrived at my destination with the lock opened and barely attached to the bag. What is the purpose of the TSA lock if you guys are not going to re lock a bag after is is screened?
March 31, 2008 12:44 AM
Each airport has a different policy. When you ask them why, they say (with a straight face no less) that it's to keep the terrorists guessing. But, from what I have seen, each airport is consistent in its own policies, so any terrorist just has to watch one check in procedure to figure it out. But, it's a huge inconvenience for any normal traveler just trying to get from point A to point B.
March 31, 2008 1:51 AM
The 3oz liquid, 1 gallon bag is silly. It wouldn't be that hard for one person to cram 4 3oz liquid bottles of explosive into one of those baggies (I believe it was 12oz of c4 that brought down the Pan Am flight. Or, if that wasn't viable, just make sure they travelled with another terrorist with his/her own plastic baggy of liquids. But, for the rest of us law abiding folks (particularly women), we have to figure out how to cram our liquid makeup and toiletries into that baggy (and some airports consider lipgloss and mascara liquids, while others don't). And, invariably, we end up having to throw something out, only to find later that the hand sanitier or lip gloss we accidentally left in our purse made it through the screening.
March 31, 2008 1:57 AM
Would someone please explain why you have to take a laptop out of it's case? Can't an x-ray machine see through the case?
March 31, 2008 2:03 AM
What bothers me is the new "training" that must be gone thru to be able to be "awarded" our uniforms? I think we need more information on that.
March 31, 2008 9:08 AM
As a frequent business traveler I agree with most all of the postings. What I find most frustrating is that this is another example of our Governments inability to implement and oversee another one of its agencies!
March 31, 2008 10:12 AM
Anon from Orlando: I'm just another fellow traveler ... but my understanding is the purpose of the quart-size baggie is to limit the total quantity of liquids you bring on board, not the individual sizes. This (in principle) helps to limit risk further; even if "bad stuff" makes it through the screening, there's a limit to the amount "bad stuff", leading to a limit to the size of the bomb someone could (hypothetically) make.
So, yeah, you could always empty the baggie out once you're on the concourse, but at that point, you've still just got a very small amount of liquid.
March 31, 2008 11:12 AM
I posted this also in the Liquids section, however, I would like to re-iterate it here because I feel it applies to Inconsistencies as well.
I agree with someone who posted earlier that I understand the reasoning for a lot of these rules many of you are complaining about. I am not here to complain about the rules, but more so about the clarification of some rules and the inconsistency in enforcing these rules.
I am a mother of a 9 month old baby boy. I have been flying with him since he was a week and a half old as my in-laws live in WA, and we live in PA. His father is also Military, so we travel a lot for that reason as well. My main concern relates to traveling with my son. I think the policy on traveling with children needs to be clarified. From reading the TSA website, it leads me to believe that I am able to travel with more water than would normally be allowed because it is for my son as long as I declare it at security. I have done this and depending on which airport I am at, have had to either empty all of his water from his bottles, had to mix formula into all of it (which formula once mixed only is good for up to two hours unrefrigerated), or I was able to go through with no problem.
I feel that this rule should be clarified and should be enforced consistently throughout each airport. I never know what I can take for him, including baby food, juice, water, and formula. And when traveling with a small child, it is much harder to just empty out all of these items or throw them away while trying to balance him, a carry on, and his diaper bag let alone if we are traveling with a stroller or car seat.
I feel that the rules should be clarified and consistent among what is printed, posted on the TSA website, and educated to TSOs. I tried explaining to one TSO at SEA that I had carried on the amount of water on my way from AVP to SEA and had no problem going through security and even gave him a printout from the TSA website. However, trying to fly back from SEA to AVP, I was told I either needed to make the formula there or empty all of the water. I also needed to go to the back of the security line (which I had already waited in for an hour) and start over once I emptied the water. This, I believe was completely unnecessary.
I appreciate the efforts the TSA has made to keep us safe while flying, however, a little consistency between airports and clarification of some procedures would be greatly appreciated, especially for those traveling with children.
March 31, 2008 12:06 PM
Anonymous Anonymous said...
Would someone please explain why you have to take a laptop out of it's case? Can't an x-ray machine see through the case?
Most people carry a lot more than just the laptop inside the laptop bag and all those items make clearing the bag much more difficult or result in more time on the other side of xray due to bag checks. Removing the large electronics although a pain to passengers actually greatly speeds up the process.
March 31, 2008 12:41 PM
I am currently a TSO working in PHL airport and I am amazed by some of the comments on this blog. While I understand the frustration of every passenger traveling, you guys have to understand that this is a job we signed up for and every job has rules. We are only following the policy that we all were taught in an 8 hour class, five days a week. So if you guys should be questioning anything, you should be questioning the people in Washington that actually write these policies.
What really frustrates me is that when people look at me, they only see the uniform and automatically I'm "the enemy" that's gonna take your liquids. What you people don't know is that I am a human being just like you: I have a 7 month old child, a wonderful husband, and I have a college degree(this goes to the person that said TSA should hire "smarter" people). I also don't like when we are categorized as being the same; just because one person from TSA was rude to you does not automatically make me rude...I am one of the most polite people you will ever meet; I say real words like "please" and "thank you", just like any human being would say.
All I can say is we are doing our job and you all should appreciate the fact that you do not have to do this challenging job and that time is not taken away from your family because you didn't want to take your shoes off or take your liquids out of your bag.
March 31, 2008 6:19 PM
I am currently a TSO working in PHL airport and I am amazed by some of the comments on this blog.
How many posts do you think are lies? How many posts do you think are accurate?
While I understand the frustration of every passenger traveling, you guys have to understand that this is a job we signed up for and every job has rules.
It is your job. If you don't like it then quit. Do you yell and scream at elderly, children, military members traveling under orders and in uniform? If you do those things then you have no right to that job. You have become what you were supposed to protect us against.
We are only following the policy that we all were taught in an 8 hour class, five days a week. So if you guys should be questioning anything, you should be questioning the people in Washington that actually write these policies.
We've tried and gotten nowhere. We've heard nearly every lie you could imagine from TSA and your credibility is worse than that of lawyers. Hey, but you can say that you're not at the bottom of the barrel. That honor goes to Congress, and FEMA.
What really frustrates me is that when people look at me, they only see the uniform and automatically I'm "the enemy" that's gonna take your liquids.
No, we don't know what you're going to confiscate since that is your priviledge to confiscate anything you deem a 'risk to transportation.' You've become a terrorist and the traveling public is afraid of your nearly unlimited power.
What you people don't know is that I am a human being just like you: I have a 7 month old child, a wonderful husband, and I have a college degree(this goes to the person that said TSA should hire "smarter" people).
So do some of the people that your coworkers torment with made up on the spot SOPs.
I also don't like when we are categorized as being the same; just because one person from TSA was rude to you does not automatically make me rude...I am one of the most polite people you will ever meet; I say real words like "please" and "thank you", just like any human being would say.
I try to avoid any conversation with TSA personel. I find the process unpleasant and want to be on my way ASAP.
All I can say is we are doing our job and you all should appreciate the fact that you do not have to do this challenging job and that time is not taken away from your family because you didn't want to take your shoes off or take your liquids out of your bag.
The Nurenburg defense doesn't protect anyone. For a college graduate to even attempt the 'I was just following orders' argument, speaks volumes.
April 1, 2008 1:08 AM
My mother has had double knee replacement and always sets off the metal detectors at the airport every times she flies. She knows beyond a doubt that when ever she flies she will have to go through extra screening. While flying from Miami Int to Newark Int she was throughly checked by an agent with a hand held metal detector and visually. On her way out of Newark Int back to Miami Int she set off the metal detector but the screening was incredibly lax. As soon as the agent found out she had knee replacement she spent more time telling my mom about her family and their story with knee replacement than checking my mother. She swiped her once with the metal detector and let her go. We both found this to be very upsetting.
Another fault that i found is that i was able to get on the line at the security check point even though i did not have a ticket. There was an agent standing at the beginning of the line but she did not ask anyone for tickets or ID. Once we reached the metal detectors i stepped off the to the side of the line (still inside the secure area) to see my mother off, i was there for at-least 5-10 min before the security agent i was standing in front of noticed i was there and asked me to leave.
I know people on this blog complain that security takes too long and is a nuisance but i would like to say i feel safer getting on a flight when i know that the TSA agents have been thorough. Security lines are already long as is, waiting another 10 min for a thorough screening is a small price to pay for safety.
April 1, 2008 11:20 AM
Inna,
Please take a bit of time to read the concerns addressed in this and other threads. Security is welcomed. Made up rules, inefficient practices, significant security omissions, Federal Employees who are rude, inconsiderate, marginally competent, etc. are the problem.
So is passing off employee whim as planned inconsistency to identify or frustrate terrorists.
April 1, 2008 12:51 PM
"Government Issued" ID needs to be better clarified. TSA does not seem to recognize FEMA, DHHS or other governmental ID cards (even at times from their same Agency).
There need to be mechanisms for Government travelers who have Government ID that denotes they have undergone the extensive fingerprinting, background checks and interviews by Homeland Security are ironically automatically selected for the more extensive additional TSA search and pat down because of the Government rules of travel booking which are one way tickets purchased less than 48 hrs in advance. These are likely the most prescreened and safe travelers and instead are treated like high risk.
April 1, 2008 1:54 PM
I recently traveled to and from Albuquerque. At the first security checkpoint, my driver's license and boarding pass were both scanned with a blue light device. I'm a frequent flyer, but this was the first time I have encountered this. Anyone know why or what the blue light is supposed to show?
April 1, 2008 4:33 PM
I'm a frequent flyer, but this was the first time I have encountered this. Anyone know why or what the blue light is supposed to show?
If you have a newer license then there are some UV (blue light) inks imbedded in the license that glow when exposed to the UV light. That is part of the anti fraudulent credentials instituted by the government under the real license program.
April 1, 2008 5:27 PM
"Anonymous said...
I'm a frequent flyer, but this was the first time I have encountered this. Anyone know why or what the blue light is supposed to show?
If you have a newer license then there are some UV (blue light) inks imbedded in the license that glow when exposed to the UV light. That is part of the anti fraudulent credentials instituted by the government under the real license program."
Write SSSS in invisible fluorescent ink on your license and find out what confusion is like.
April 1, 2008 5:50 PM
Why on earth would we want to do the same thing, every time, every day? How easy would it be to observe, look for weaknesses to exploit, and beat the security? Our country is a country of spoiled brats.
If TSA were doing it's job, then the terrorists would be caught. Screening for liquids, shoes, etc are pretty commonplace and as such should be standardized. If you are a TSA screener then I would suggest finding another job before you get fired for your bad attitude.
While I agree using the term "spoiled brats" would be inappropriate in a professional setting, this is a blog so the use of emotion is pretty liberal.
I am confused by most of these complaints... you want all or most of TSA fired yet you also say they are understaffed. Keep in mind that there are over 42,000 officers in this country. Given the human factor, it's impossible for them all to be perfect. Perhaps instead of focusing on how many terrorists TSA has not caught, look at how many terrorist attakcs have not happened since TSA began.
And the "customer service" complaints: if a cop pulls you over for a traffic violation, do you give him a hard time and complain about his lack of customer service? No, because you are not his customer even though your taxes pay his salary. You are not TSA's customer when you fly even though your taxes pay their salary. You are the airlines and airports customer. Which, isn't to say TSA shouldn't be courteous. I just think the extent of courtesy most of you expect is a little unrealistic and over the top. sometimes.
April 1, 2008 6:53 PM
" "I am sure TSA has thousands of reports about people "who tried to get a real weapon in, just to see if they could"
Provide even one iota of evidence to back this type of TSA sensationalism reporting up. "
Why don't you back up half of the intentional exaggerations and flat out lies you try to "sensationalize"?
Have you ever thought that maybe providing the proof you request could tell the real bad guys how to bypass security? If TSA posted all the details of all the threats they discover and prevent everyday, no one would fly. Just be blissfully ignorant and say "thank you".
April 1, 2008 6:59 PM
Anonymous Anonymous said...
Would someone please explain why you have to take a laptop out of it's case? Can't an x-ray machine see through the case?
An x-ray machine doesn't allow a screener to see into things as if were a true to life image. Think of it like an xray at the doctor's office. If the doc has you cover up with a led vest, than the xray won't be able to see inside your body. It also gives about the same type of image.
As for the poster who ripped apart the PHL TSO, you will never be happy. She was earnestly trying to let you know that not all TSOs are the stupid, thug-like bullies you complain about. I think you should feel fortunate that the biggest problem in your life is airport security. All though you seem very bitter and calloused, at least you don't have any other problems. Lucky you.
April 1, 2008 7:10 PM
wisconsin said
"You are not TSA's customer when you fly even though your taxes pay their salary. You are the airlines and airports customer. Which, isn't to say TSA shouldn't be courteous. I just think the extent of courtesy most of you expect is a little unrealistic and over the top. sometimes."
TSA Said:
"Our ultimate goal is to create an atmosphere that aligns with our passenger's need to be secure, while ensuring the freedom of movement for people. In doing so, our employees will assure customer confidence and ultimately establish a standard for passenger satisfaction.
Our culture provides passengers a secure and pleasant travel experience. We achieve this through highly-competent and dedicated customer service teamwork and respect. We strive to earn the respect and trust of all airline passengers by practicing the following five principles:
* Security that is Professional - Service that delivers positive lasting impressions with proper image and effective communications.
* Security with Customer Service - Service is efficient while maintaining the dignity of all passengers.
* Security that is Attentive - Service that acknowledges the passenger strives to minimize passenger anxiety and put them at ease.
* Security that Encourages Teamwork - Service of the highest quality resulting from combined individual efforts.
* Security that Protects Civil Rights - Service that is delivered with respect and equity."
They refer to passengers as customers.
April 1, 2008 7:41 PM
Just remember this; every airplane that has left american soil has landed rubber side down since 9/11.....
April 1, 2008 9:31 PM
As for the poster who ripped apart the PHL TSO, you will never be happy.
Hmmm, I frequently travel by air and am away from home 49 weeks of the year (sometimes getting home on weekends). I have expectations from my government that if they intrude onto my person and belongings that they respect both. That hasn't been the case with all of TSA operations. Admittantly some have been pretty professional (Rochester, MN) while others have been a nightmare (Chicago O'hare).
She was earnestly trying to let you know that not all TSOs are the stupid, thug-like bullies you complain about.
Pretty simple then, do something about those TSA inspectors that open up the fluid containers in checked baggage, fail to resecure cheked luggage after hand inspection, and who abuse passengers.
I think you should feel fortunate that the biggest problem in your life is airport security. All though you seem very bitter and calloused, at least you don't have any other problems. Lucky you.
I am expected to make my flights on time and as such get to the airport 2 hrs ahead of flight departure. I demand professionalism on the part of TSA employees. That is the minimum that we, as tax payers, should get for our taxes. I've witnessed many abuses on the part of TSOs and seen how an agency that runs open loop deals with passengers and am not pleased for either other passengers or myself. Happy? What concern is that of your's?
April 1, 2008 10:19 PM
"Pretty simple then, do something about those TSA inspectors that open up the fluid containers in checked baggage, fail to resecure cheked luggage after hand inspection, and who abuse passengers."
If there is abuse, then press formal charges. If you consider abuse to be asking you to declare your liquids or remove your shoes, then you are over-reacting. Whatever your abuse standards are, when being subjected to it, demand to speak with law enforcement. Every airport has law enforcement on post. And, no, they are not part of TSA or even DHS.
Do you have control of the behavior and skills of everyone you work with? It seems you are so bitter that that you want everyone at TSA to pay for the sins of a few officers you have had problems with. Have you ever tried to be nice to anyone TSA? (I know, your response will probably be :"why should I?" Seems like you just can't handle not being in control of everything. Whatever business you are in, I most certainly hope I will never have to deal with you.
April 2, 2008 10:41 AM
Dear Anonymous,
Anonymous said...
To Anonymous who said “Our country is a country of spoiled brats.”
It would certainly be easier for the TSA if we were as docile as citizens of totalitarian regimes. Fortunately we still have a little spark to stand up for our ever-shrinking civil rights. Fortunately we can still look at a nonsensical situation and do something to make it better. Unfortunately some people prefer totalitarianism -- at least until they experience it.
March 25, 2008 9:05 PM
In response to your comment, nobody is suggesting we all become docile citizens of a totalarian regime. What are you doing to make the nonsensical situation better? It's ironic how many complaints there are about the job TSA does, yet how do you suggest TSA process the millions upon millions of passengers and property in a professional and efficient manner? They will never make everyone happy; they can merely analyze risks and make attempts to respond appropriately.
April 2, 2008 6:53 PM
Dear Anonymous,
I'm not a TSA Screener, but tell me how many jobs in the world are doing their job when nothing happens? Millions upon millions of people and property are screened and you think all terrorists will be caught? That's unrealistic. TSA can only manage risk, not eliminate it. That's part of the problem with TSA's perception...it can never appease the public because the expectations are unrealistic.
If TSA were doing it's job, then the terrorists would be caught. Screening for liquids, shoes, etc are pretty commonplace and as such should be standardized. If you are a TSA screener then I would suggest finding another job before you get fired for your bad attitude.
April 2, 2008 6:55 PM
The best TSA story I have, is that my best friend was flying home from Iraq (in full fatigues) after a 16-month deployment. He made it all the way to Atlanta with his full size tube of toothpaste, - at which time he was accosted by TSA, and it was confiscated.
I find it such a joke that the TSA is seemingly "protecting our skies" one toothpaste tube and loafer at a time. Even our own military personnel who are on the front lines in Iraq actually PROTECTING the homeland, are treated with disrespect.
The TSA needs to re-evaluate its priorities, and methods by which it accomplishes them.
April 2, 2008 7:01 PM
Maybe it's just me....but if you spend $75k per year on flights, wouldn't you also complain if the Starbucks couldn't open on time or the flight was delayed because the aircrew couldn't get to the plane on time? How can the customers, you, get service if the employees are not able to transit to their assigned location in a timely manner? Darn'd if you do...darn'd if you don't.
Anonymous said...
I do not understand why it is that the people that work at the Starbucks, etc and the flight crews can move to the front of the line at the check point. We are the customers, what happened to the customer is always right? It never fails that this happens to me when I am running late due for a flight normally because of long lines at the airport. Is there any other business that treats it's customers this badly? I spend approx 75,000.00 per year on flights.
March 30, 2008 3:00 PM
April 2, 2008 7:09 PM
..."it would be nice to see or read even a few credible "wins" for this department. Otherwise it is just so much hyperbol and fluff and just a really annoying aspect of air travel, because as we all know the only way a terrorist can do evil deeds is by use of an airplane, car bombs, bus bombs, IED's and such things are just made up stories in the press every single day."
Seen what happened in Orlando recently? You really aren't that foolish to believe there are not dangers to our society are you?
April 2, 2008 7:15 PM
tso Lori said:
"For a little less confusion: About Liquids, for Screening Officers and for Passengers
There is one good rule of thumb;
If it:
POURS…SPREADS…SQUEEZES. or.. SPRAYS
Then it is a liquid, paste, creme, lotion, gel or aerosol."
Then went on to say:
"The Liquids guidelines are posted on the TSA. Website at www.tsa.gov and on signs or flyers at the airports."
Please post a link to where on the TSA web site it says the part about "POURS…SPREADS…SQUEEZES. or.. SPRAYS". Darned if I can find it...
April 2, 2008 8:35 PM
TSO from PHL wrote:
"What really frustrates me is that when people look at me, they only see the uniform and automatically I'm "the enemy" that's gonna take your liquids."
I'm one of those passengers that lays the blame for the sometimes adversarial nature of the passenger-TSO relationship squarely at the feet of an agency that doesn't do an adequate job of monitoring the behavior of TSO's manning checkpoints. This leads to some TSO's having an "I can do as I want, and there's nothing you can do about it" additude.
Please don't take that personally before I have a chance to explain myself -- I wish all TSO's were half as polite as you seem to be.
I'm going to be pleasant when I approach the checkpoint -- that's how I was raised. I will, however, admit that mentally I'm at "yellow alert" because of some of our experiences, to wit:
- I approach the metal detector and the TSO starts barking orders at me like a drill instructor when a normal tone of voice would have worked.
- The TSO yells at my girlfriend over a tube of lipstick in her bag when a civil tone of voice would have worked.
- TSO is yelling something at the passengers in such heavily accented English that we can't understand a word she says, then she gets mad because we didn't do whatever it was she wanted.
In all of these situations, the TSO chose to take what could have been a cordial situation and made it a negative one with unnecessary yelling. Who's treating who like the enemy here? I've noticed that the default reaction of too many TSO's is to yell.
A common complaint on this blog is that passengers are treated like criminals, prisoners, or cattle.
Another common complaint is that the TSO's are playing a game of "gotcha", particularly over 3-1-1. I've noticed an attitude of "the last passenger I dealt with was a doofus, so the next passenger is a doofus as well."
What makes it even worse is the lack of good, clear, explanations on the TSA web site of exactly what is considered a "liquid, gel or aerosol." I read a post earlier this evening where someone had printed out all the various know- before-you-go sections of the web site for reference, and ended up with 30 odd pages of printout.
Does the TSA as an agency realistically expect the traveling public to wade through all that?
Some TSO's have posted here about passengers not following the "simple rules." 30 odd pages of rules is not "simple."
I write procedures as part of my work. If I wrote multiple overlapping documents, 30 odd pages in all, and then called it "simple", I'd get laughed at. If our group yelled at people for not following our "simple rules", we'd get fired.
Another complaint voiced on this blog is that the TSO's treat passengers like they're stupid. It's not that the passengers are stupid -- the allegedly "simple rules" are not available in a form that is usable to an average person. Would you wade through 30 odd pages of printout, and then be able to figure out exactly what the rules are, especially given that they are interpreted inconsistently?
Now add this to the picture -- some TSO's have quite a chip on their shoulder, and look for ways to escalate a situation instead of de-escalating one. Read through this blog and look for cases where a passenger was asked "do you want to fly today", sometimes in response to a simple question. They come across as just mean spirited, authoritarian bullies.
Now back to your point. Are there some nice TSO's out there? No doubt -- I've encountered some, but not enough. Are there enough mean spirited TSO's to reflect badly on the TSO's as a group? Sadly, yes.
IMHO, until the TSA as an agency makes is priority to treat passengers as they expect to be treated and cracks down hard on the power trippers, some passengers are going to consider the TSO's as the enemy. That's cold comfort, but that's the way it is.
I'll sign off with a quote from Ghandi -- "you much be the change you wish to see". That's why I try to be polite in an increasingly rude world. Please keep being polite....
April 2, 2008 9:35 PM
Do you have control of the behavior and skills of everyone you work with?
No, but if a coworker goes off on a customer then the customer is within his rights to file a complaint. Several of my coworkers are now ex-coworkers because of this policy.
It seems you are so bitter that that you want everyone at TSA to pay for the sins of a few officers you have had problems with.
A few? Hahahahahahahahaha^100^100. I fly at least 2x a week to and from several airports around the nation and have seen some good TSA agents(few and far between) and have experienced many more who bark out orders (sorry, but I went through basic training 37 years ago and don't particularly need it now). I have complained. I complained about TSA approved locks being cut off, lost, mangled, etc. I've attempted to work with TSA and in return I get my tool chest (how I make my living) back at baggage check unlocked (must be too difficult to resecure the tool chest from baggage theives).
Have you ever tried to be nice to anyone TSA? (I know, your response will probably be :"why should I?"
Nice? What do you mean by that? I follow the procedures and do so silently, unless a TSA type attempts to separate me from my luggage. Sorry but I don't trust a single one of your coworkers to do what is right.
Seems like you just can't handle not being in control of everything. Whatever business you are in, I most certainly hope I will never have to deal with you.
Likewise, I stand a better chance of encountering you at a TSA check point than you do encountering me at work. I do control my belongings, some of which are signed out to me by my company. I take that responsibility seriously, unlike TSA workers who've damaged my belongings, and those of my coworkers, while TSA avoids any personal responsibility. Like Mel Brooks once said "it's good to be the king." TSA behaves like it is the king, above personal responsibility, above the law, arbitrary.
I view going through most TSA checkpoints as a visit (sorry proctologists) to a proctologist.
April 2, 2008 10:11 PM
If there is abuse, then press formal charges. If you consider abuse to be asking you to declare your liquids or remove your shoes, then you are over-reacting.
No liquids, ever through screening even before the ban was enacted. Hands too full to deal with them. Shoes off = not a big deal. Screaming TSO's = rude/inconsiderate but nothing illegal. Complaining to a cop about TSA types opening all containers in my checked luggage = you've got to be kidding. Another inconvience due to TSA, but nothing criminal. On the other hand, I will complain up the chain for outrageous conduct(not nescesarily illegal by any TSA employee).
Whatever your abuse standards are, when being subjected to it, demand to speak with law enforcement. Every airport has law enforcement on post. And, no, they are not part of TSA or even DHS.
I do speak with FSDs/AFDs about excesses in their airport (mostly luggage handling/resecuring secured luggage after inspection)and have drawn a blank. No one has a suggestion as to how I can travel with secured luggage (don't even start with TSA approved locks).
I've been screamed at by nearly incoherant TSOs on a power trip. A favorite line is "we don't do it like that at this airport. All of the other airports are wrong." Let's see 10 airports in 1 month and only one is different and they clain that they are the only ones doing inspections correctly? You wonder why, as a frequent traveler I doubt your veracity. FYI I once watched a baggage screener sit on the lid of my tool chest in an attempt to reclose the lid. After I told him how to repack it the lid nearly closed by itself.
Be professional and complaints from me go away. Do stupid stuff and they continue (i.e. abusing military traveling under orders and in uniform, the elderly/infirm, children). Pretty simple.
I do customer service all of the time and know how to ramp down an angry customer and do so that we all maintain our dignity. All I've seen TSA personnel is to escallate a bad situation (i.e. do YOU want to FLY today) and if you attempt to get a supervisor you often don't know if the 'supervisor' is either for real or just a buddy covering for his/her friend.
April 2, 2008 11:09 PM
A. Bridges said:
From reading the TSA website, it leads me to believe that I am able to travel with more water than would normally be allowed because it is for my son as long as I declare it at security. I have done this and depending on which airport I am at, have had to either empty all of his water from his bottles, had to mix formula into all of it...
This is a glaring example of why I perceive so many TSO's to be bureaucrats on a power trip. The TSA's "simple rules" make it plain that water for a child is OK if declared. How is it, then, that this passenger is required to either dump the water or mix formula with all the water? How does this help aviation security?
I also needed to go to the back of the security line (which I had already waited in for an hour) and start over once I emptied the water.
Where is this in the TSA's SOP's? Sounds like an on-the-spot punishment meted out by the TSO for her "violation" of the "simple rules".
April 3, 2008 8:24 AM
A previous anonymous poster said refering to the nipple ring issue, we cannot resolve alarms such as that one simply by patting the area down or visualy inspecting the area as we are not allowed to touch or ask to view these areas.
Excuse me? As per the news article the woman OFFERED to privately show a female tso officer they were in fact piercings. The inconsistancy of this is the fact thousands of women fly with bra's containing not only underwires, but small bits of metal hardware for adjustment or fastening purposes. These too will make a hand wand "chirp". How is it determined they are in fact parts of those womens undergarments since we dont see alot of womens bra's tossed into the screening trays.
Now i realize, and agree, any alarm on the metal detectors needs to be identified, But i highly doubt that "snickering male agents" that she heard as she was behind a screen trying to remove her piercings, exemplifies proper TSA policy.
I also find very little consolation in the fact TSA has done a turnaround regarding this case, from origionally posting on its site, the occurance was properly handled to policy will be reviewed.
Heaven forbid she would have had a genetial piercing. The TSA agents in quesion may well have passed out from extasy.
Another good example of the inadiquate training some TSA agents in at least some of our airports seem to have takes place in Memphis (MEM) every time we fly.
My spouse has not one but two (2) joint replacements, both hips. needless to say, the walk through detector goes berserk when she passes through it. Now again let me emphesise i understand the need of determining the cause, but the normal dialog with her goes something like this.
TSA: "step over here please"
spouse: "I have 2 hip replacements"
TSA wands her and gets alarms at both hips. pats down the hip areas and finds nothing.
TSA: "sit down in that chair and let me see the bottoms of your feet"
TSA: "stand up" and again wands her, pats down the hips and again finds nothing.
TSA: "sit down in that chair and let me see the bottoms of your feet"
(I guess i can understand this though, obviously in some airports bottoms of the feet ARE directly related to joints at hip level.)
TSA agent then calls another female agent over, they confer and this procedure is repeated 2 or 3 more times with the second and sometimes a 3rd agent present. and always some confusion about not finding anything.
Spouse has on every trip offered to show another female agent privately the surgical scars to show in fact she has had these surgery's, to no avail.
Now Denver (DIA) on the other hand, has they're act together, and apparantly has some responsible training procedures.
When the alarm sounds, she is always asked if she has a hip or knee replacement, hips are directed to one area, knees to another. hand wand, pat down, and done. very little delay and on our way to our gate.
so in some cases at least there are competant people in the TSA employ, sadly this doesnt seem to be all cases.
April 3, 2008 11:39 AM
Just learned a new nuance of this 3 oz rule in Rochester, MN. The fellow in front of me had an empty container confiscated because it was greater than 3 oz. I then had a rolled up tube of toothpaste taken away that had about two brushings left (say, .1 oz) because, at one point in time, this tube held 4 ounces.
This makes absolutely no sense:
* The fellow in front of me proceeded to buy a bottle of water in a *12 oz* container, which he then emptied, leaving him with exactly the same contraband that was taken away from him - an empty bottle > 3 oz.
* The notion that I could *ever* get toothpaste back into this poor crushed tube is absurd.
Is the purpose of this search to prevent large volumes of "liquid" in or is it to prevent empty bottles and tubes of toothpaste from getting through? What gives?
April 4, 2008 12:09 PM
I have had 2 episodes with TSA personnel in the past 60 days regarding toothpaste. The toothpaste I carry (and most others, I believe) only display content WEIGHT information, not volume. However, the information is displayed in ounces & grams! It is clear by the descriptions of limitations on liquids, gels, and pastes that the intent is to limit volume, not weight. However, TSA staff are apparently so lacking in training and/or education that they cannot discern the difference between the two concepts. I can carry 1 oz (by volume) of a gel that weighs 4 oz (by weight), and, if the container says 1 oz instead of 4, then I'm clear. However, if it says 4 oz, even though it is clearly a 1 oz (by volume) container, it would not clear. I wonder what they would do, if it said both! The solution - train TSA staff to understand the difference between volume and weight (the dead giveaway is when they see "4 oz (112 g)"), and explain that you are concerned about volume.
April 4, 2008 5:48 PM
Actually, I agree with the TSA policy of going by the label on the container, not the actual volume of the contents.
If you proceed on the basis of the volume of the contents, this would require TSAs to make a judgment as to how full each container is, and whether or not the amount of liquid in the container exceeds 100ml. This is going to be inherently subjective. (If my container is 9oz, and I'm allowed 3.4oz, then I can travel as long
as the fluid is no more than 37.8% of the container. Can you imagine anyone looking at a 9oz toothpaste container and coming up with an accurate guess as to how full 37.8% is?)
The advantage of the current rule is that it's objective. If the label says 3oz, it flies. If the label says 4oz, it doesn't.
We can argue all we want about whether or not the restriction on quantity of liquids makes sense ... and that's a useful debate to have. But if there's going to be a limit, I'd much rather that the standard be objective than subjective.
April 5, 2008 12:35 AM
"...I would really like to know what happens to all these items – even new, sealed products – that are “thrown out” by the TSOs. If you don’t believe me, then search in Google for “confiscated items” +airport. You will find numerous articles that show money is being made off these items – AT YOUR EXPENSE."
To whomever wrote this blog entry, at most airports it's the custodians who are making money off of your surrendered items. Most of the liquids are actaull "thrown in the trashcan" and taken out by the custodians. If they want to pilage through the trash, they can because it's considered "gargabe" after they take it off the check point. If you'd like to make a complaint about it, you should contact your local airport or the company that provides custodial services to that airport. Same goes for confiscated prohibited items (knives, tools, or other weapons) when it comes to disposal. A contracted company picks up the prohibited items for disposal. How they dispose of it is pretty much up to them once they take it off of airport property.
April 5, 2008 3:06 PM
I've never had any of the problems with security that people have described, and it's for two very simple reasons: I check my luggage, and I travel light. It has been my experience that people try to bring their lives with them when they travel, and they usually wind up trying to shove their lives into an overhead bin. I understand that certain items need to be carried with you, but do you really NEED to carry your makeup with you? Do you really NEED to carry your toothpaste with you? Do you really NEED to carry your nail clippers with you? Geez, just check it and save yourself the trouble. Think about it; do you really need to brush your teeth, do your makeup, or clip your nails while traveling and before you get your luggage back?
Now, before everyone starts with the "it's a free country" rant and the "I have my rights" rant, please understand that I'm not saying that you can't bring your life with you on a plane. What I'm saying is that every choice you make has consequences. If you want to bring all this crap with you, then you need to be prepared for the potential grief you will receive.
As for the other complaints of people (i.e. acceptance of drivers' licenses, broken TSA locks), all I can say is that if you do anything enough times, you're bound to have a bad experience here and there. I've had my luggage lost once, but stuff happens.
The bottome line, getting back to my original subject, is that things like the aforementioned complaints are going to continue to happen. The screeners are human, and the law of averages says that something bad is bound to happen to you eventually. The question I think you have to ask yourself is, is it easier for me to adjust to the system or is it easier for the system to adjust to me? Personally, I've adjusted to the system quite nicely.
April 5, 2008 3:22 PM
As for the other complaints of people (i.e. acceptance of drivers' licenses, broken TSA locks), all I can say is that if you do anything enough times, you're bound to have a bad experience here and there. I've had my luggage lost once, but stuff happens.
I've traveled since 2000 and before TSA came out with their 'TSA approved locks' neither had a lock cut off nor lost a lock. Since they introduced their program I've lost well over $100 in locks either due to failures or due to TSA not resecuring those locks. The TSA approved lock program has been a rather dismal failure.
April 6, 2008 6:53 PM
So here's another one that makes no sense. I'm a frequent business flyer and usually fly out of LAX. Last week I checked in at the self service kiosk at American Airlines and as usual was directed to drop off my bag and proceed to the security check point. I got in line to drop off the bag for screening but when I got to the head of the line I was told they wouldn't take my bag because it had a lock on it - a TSA approved lock by the way. The TSA agent said they now accepted only unlocked bags for screening so I could take the lock off or walk to the other end of the terminal and drop off the bag there since they accept bags with locks! The bag drop off points are identical with the same screening equipment so why do you have to run all over the airport to drop off the bag? BTW, the TSA agent couldn't answer the question either, she just stood there saying "take the bag to screening 1" over and over.
April 6, 2008 11:43 PM
The bag drop off points are identical with the same screening equipment so why do you have to run all over the airport to drop off the bag? BTW, the TSA agent couldn't answer the question either, she just stood there saying "take the bag to screening 1" over and over.
They lost the keys again and were down to just one set.
April 7, 2008 7:58 AM
Anonymous said: "I've never had any of the problems with security that people have described, and it's for two very simple reasons: I check my luggage, and I travel light."
Dear Anonymous, I travel light too, typically a carry-on size suitcase that I do not carry on, but check in, plus a purse. I still get selected for super-security every single time I fly. I am a tiny white woman in my 30s. I have no clue why I am subject to "special treatment" in airport security, and there is nothing I can do about it
"Do you really NEED to carry your toothpaste with you?"
Yes I do. I typically travel internationally, in long overnight flights, involving connections that often take 24 h between checking in and seeing my luggage again. I couldn´t care less about makeup but need both toothpaste and deodorant, or you won´t have a very pleasant time sitting next to me on your next trip.
April 8, 2008 6:38 AM
@Wisconsin 4/1 6:53 p.m.
While I agree using the term "spoiled brats" would be inappropriate in a professional setting, this is a blog so the use of emotion is pretty liberal.
I am confused by most of these complaints... you want all or most of TSA fired yet you also say they are understaffed. Keep in mind that there are over 42,000 officers in this country. Given the human factor, it's impossible for them all to be perfect. Perhaps instead of focusing on how many terrorists TSA has not caught, look at how many terrorist attakcs have not happened since TSA began.
-----
How many terrorist attacks were there using airplanes before the TSA took over? Using the Aviation Safety database at http://www.avation-safety.net, the last deaths due to airplane sabotage and hijacking in the United States before 9/11 were 3 deaths as a result of a hijacking on a Delta flight from BWI to ATL on February 22, 1974. You going to claim credit for those 27+ years without problems? And the report in the database doesn't have any details, so was that hijacking even by a method that the TSO could stop today?
Prior to that, you'd have to go back to 1962, and the bombing of Continental Flight 11, which was before there was really any security at all.
I'm still waiting for an answer to the question of why TSA-based security is better than the old system by which the airlines and airports were responsible, privately, for security.
April 8, 2008 3:42 PM
anonymous said:
I've never had any of the problems with security that people have described, and it's for two very simple reasons: I check my luggage, and I travel light. It has been my experience that people try to bring their lives with them when they travel, and they usually wind up trying to shove their lives into an overhead bin. I understand that certain items need to be carried with you, but do you really NEED to carry your makeup with you? Do you really NEED to carry your toothpaste with you? Do you really NEED to carry your nail clippers with you? Geez, just check it and save yourself the trouble. Think about it; do you really need to brush your teeth, do your makeup, or clip your nails while traveling and before you get your luggage back?
Then I guess the airline has never lost or had your luggage delayed.
I prefer not to have to arrive earlier to check luggage nor having to wait in baggage for my checked luggage to arrive (if it makes it). I prefer to travel light and keep it all in my carry-on. I know that Continental prefers it that way.
April 8, 2008 5:41 PM
"Inconsistencies" Is what it takes to catch the bad guys! If every airport was the same then the average traveler would find loop holes through TSA checkpoints, and if the average traveler can seek out loop holes imagine what a terrorist can find. Don't forget TSA is not the only one watching you go through the airport, so are the terrorist. Its your option to fly, take the Gray Hound if you don't feel safe!
April 9, 2008 12:44 PM
On 4/7/08 I went thru security at RDU. The short,young TSO man looked at my MI drivers license, made some comment about Penn State that I didn't get. When he mentioned something else about Penn State I said "I don't know about that." He proceeded to tell me that maybe I was asking for a body cavity search. I was so shocked that I said nothing more and didn't think to get his name or badge ID #. This is totally unacceptable and I hope to be able to contact the TSA at RDU to make a formal complaint. Talk about unchecked and inappropriate powers.
April 9, 2008 2:09 PM
""Inconsistencies" Is what it takes to catch the bad guys! If every airport was the same then the average traveler would find loop holes through TSA checkpoints, and if the average traveler can seek out loop holes imagine what a terrorist can find. Don't forget TSA is not the only one watching you go through the airport, so are the terrorist. Its your option to fly, take the Gray Hound if you don't feel safe!
April 9, 2008 12:44 PM"
So the terrorist is standing around watching you? Laughing, perhaps? Maybe he will invite you for a drink and chat you up.... Try not to be a security risk in the unlikely event that this occurs.
April 9, 2008 6:11 PM
I am a diabetic who wears an insulin pump. When going to the airport I never know if security is going to treat me like a criminal or a normal person because I am wearing an insulin pump. I have now gotten to the point of before I go to the security area I stop off at a bathroom hide the insulin pump where the sun doesn't shine and walk back out and go through security. So far this has worked, but it makes me wonder how many other people are hiding things like I am. Is security really doing anything? or is it just making people like me really good at sneaking things in?
April 10, 2008 1:16 PM
Newer insulin pumps do not have much metal in them. That they do not alarm metal detectors regularly is not a surprise. Sometimes someone with an insulin pump will be selected randomly or for some other reason for extra screening, and telling the screener that you are wearing an insulin pump is preferable to the screener trying to figure out on their own what it is they are patting down.
April 13, 2008 6:17 PM
I have read most of the comments on how TSA is horrible with bad attitudes and not doing their job. I agree that from airport to airport our procedures are inconsitent. That is not because it's written that way, it's because the individuals at that particular airport are interpreting the procedures in their own manner and applying them as such, so complaints should be made directly to that airport and the TSA management their and not to TSA as a whole because most of us are doing our job to the guidelines that we are given. We do not come to your jobs and ask you to bend the rules for us, so we would appreciate if you would provide us with the same courtesy. Everyday we have people come in saying "i didn't know" and "well when did this start" and blah blah blah. Same nonsense, different day. If the people from Japan know the rules and the people from Germany know the rules, then there is no reason that the people from Ohio, or Kentucky or some of these other places don't know. Stop the lies people. The liquid ban has been going on for over a year, so to come in a say you didn't know or this must be new is ridiculous. Too many people come in begging to get things through they know they shouldn't have, and when you make an expection for them, these same people are the ones telling everyone we aren't doing our job because we let them through with something they shouldn't have. Stop testing us and just follow the rules. 3.4 oz!! Not a brand new 2 liter bottle of soda, not your 12 oz bottle of suntan lotion or you 8 oz perfume. The reason you come across screeners with bad attitudes or a no nonsense mentality is because we get tired of some passenger screaming at us that they didn't know the rules, or trying to sneak something in only to pretend they didn't know it was in their bag. After 8 hrs of the same B.S. your patience wears thin and you do become more rigid. Don't blame us, blame the clown in front of you for stuffing the 4 inch hunting knife in his kids bag and trying to pretend he didn't know it was their or the lady with a 2 liter soda holding up the line because she wants a ziploc back for it. These are real examples of the ignorance we deal with every few minutes.
Yes on the TSA website they have a few examples of items found and I can personally tell you that we have confiscated REAL guns, brass knuckles, and large knives not little belt buckles or lighters; so there are REAL threat items being taken daily and it's not an exaggeration or joke. If people stop trying to test us by bringing stuff in they shouldn't have, then we wouldn't have to waste as much time going through bags and checking people we don't need to. People always say " do I look like a terrorist?" Well since Jeffrey Dahmer didn't look like he ate little boys and Tim McVeigh didn't look like he was going to blow up the building in Oklahoma and since we don't know all of you personally, we can't really say if you are one or not, but we can say this.... If you don't want to be mistaken for a possible terrorist, then stop acting like one. Terrorists like to test security, beg to bring things they shouldn't, and try to sneak items in. We would love to not dig through your stuff if we don't have to, and you would love to pass through security without being stopped, so leave the extra stuff home and we can all have a better experience at the airport.
Thanks....
April 15, 2008 7:26 AM
So, between part 1 and part 2, I've seen a lot of complaints about ID checking. Seriously, how hard is it to put your ID in your back pocket before you get in line, and pull it out when you show your boarding pass? One, maybe two seconds? Do you also complain when you have to show ID to buy liquor or cigarettes, even if the last clerk didn't ask?
Sure, I have my fair-share of complaints about inconsistencies (such as giving out 8"x11" bags at the airport when the rule is 8"x7.5"), but I find that if I generally follow what's stated on tsa.gov, I never have a problem.
Also, attitude-checking before you get in line is a good idea as well. I find that politeness and a smile can make a big difference. If you get in line and give the evil eye to a TSO, do you really expect that they are going to be polite to you? Why not ask them how their day is going? If they grunt at you, oh well, not really an excuse to sit here and call them mindless drones who have no better job than to torture red-blooded Americans.
I'm not a TSO, and I'm not set up on here to say that rare good thing about TSOs and the TSA. The fact is, they are doing their job. And if your 6lbs of makeup and hair gel get confiscated, maybe you can live without it. And water/soda? You can't carry liquids through unless its a medical necessity or its in a bag, even I know that, they tell you that. Just be well hydrated beforehand. And on-board, drink plenty of water. No you can't have the whole bottle, but you can go up and ask for another glass as many times as you want (I got 5 on a 2 hour flight).
I do feel bad for parents who have to travel with children, but I feel less bad for you when you are going to stand there arguing with a TSO for 20 minutes over a bottle of water. I also feel bad for the little old ladies who get pushed around. And for those who may have replacement joints, who are wanded down. However, this is an unfortunate consequence of this new age of American travel, we all have to deal with it.
April 15, 2008 6:17 PM
Anonymous said...
I have read most of the comments on how TSA is horrible with bad attitudes and not doing their job. I agree that from airport to airport our procedures are inconsitent.
Well into your post your ask us to stop the lies.
How about TSA lies? Such as signs stating that ID is required to pass the checkpoint? Information on the TSA website saying 3 oz instead of 3.4oz/100 ml?
TSO's who state that if a medicine does not have a prescription it doesn't fly?
When TSA and TSO's stop lying and standardize checkpoint procedures then I will be willing to give you a break, but not one moment sooner.
The 120 hours of TSO training that Kip brags about is inadequate. TSA as an agency is a failure in many ways. Don't question my honesty until TSA demonstrates it's own!
April 17, 2008 2:31 PM
Kelly commented "Sure, I have my fair-share of complaints about inconsistencies (such as giving out 8"x11" bags at the airport when the rule is 8"x7.5"), but I find that if I generally follow what's stated on tsa.gov, I never have a problem."
That's an interesting inconsistency in and of itself. Looking at http://www.tsa.gov/311/index.shtm, the bag rule is "1 quart-sized, clear, plastic, zip-top bag".
Nowhere in there do I see that the bag is supposed to be 8"x7.5". What if different brands of zip top bags have different dimensions? Is the 8x7.5 "rule" official TSA policy, or some local interpretation?
Conceivably, a passenger could have a ziploc that's less then a quart in size. Is that OK? The rules say "quart sized", after all. A TSO could say that "your ziploc is too small - it has to be quart sized."
I recognize that a certain level of unpredictability is good from the security aspect. However, this is the sort of failure to adequately define standards that can lead to a lot of problems. My perception of the TSA's "rules" is that there's too many local interpretations because the underlying "rules" are not worded precisely enough.
I can just picture some TSO with a ruler, measuring people's ziplocs, then saying (or yelling) "your ziploc is 8.5"x7" and the rule is 8"x7.5", I'm going to have to take this.
Yes, I'm both hypothesizing and (hopefully) exaggerating at the same time, but in my experience, this sort of petty bureaucratic nitpicking is completely within the range of the possible. I have seen some incredible overreactions on the part of screeners (yes - yelling) because some passenger wasn't up to speed on some local interpretation of 3-1-1.
"Also, attitude-checking before you get in line is a good idea as well. I find that politeness and a smile can make a big difference. If you get in line and give the evil eye to a TSO, do you really expect that they are going to be polite to you? "
Good point, but I've said many times that the screeners are the authority figure at the checkpoint, and they set the tone. I've been at airports where the yelling starts the moment you approach the metal detector, before the passengers have said a word or done much of anything.
The TSA organization has managed to garner a reputation of managing by fear. As master Yoda put it, "fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, and hate leads to suffering."
I understand the aggravations of dealing with the public all day (been there, done that). I also understand the frustrations of working with people who don't play by the rules (am there right now). But neither excuses being consistently hostile in one's demeanor.
If I assumed everyone that I dealt with was an uncooperative doofus and yelled at them the moment they approached my desk, I'd get marched out of the building on the spot.
The TSA needs to get its act together on defining the rules clearly and consistently, and learning to treat people courteously instead of like criminals. That would do wonders for the collective attitude of the traveling public.
As I've said before, if the TSO acts like a person with a job to do and is respectful and courteous, I'll be as nice as I know how to be, and I'll give them the benefit of a doubt.
OTOH, if the TSO comes across as a power tripping bully, I'll be civil, but nothing more. Benefit of a doubt? No way! Step an inch out of line, and I WILL make a mental note of their name (assuming they're wearing a nametag) or their physical description and the time (if they're not wearing a nametag), and I WILL file a complaint with the TSA after my trip is over.
April 17, 2008 3:25 PM
Conceivably, a passenger could have a ziploc that's less then a quart in size. Is that OK? The rules say "quart sized", after all. A TSO could say that "your ziploc is too small - it has to be quart sized."
Too late. That has already happened.
April 17, 2008 11:40 PM
I hear all these same complaints on a daily basis as well as I see it take place at the checkpoints. I hear how TSO's are rude, yet I myself have stood at the checkpoint and had passengers come yelling at me from the top of their lungs about what ever issues they are having at the checkpoint. Respect you earn, and if you don't want me to be rude to you and yell, then don't do it to me. Just because I am at my job does not mean that I don't deserve respect. Just because some idiot yelled at you doesn't give you the right to yell at me. We can keep going in circles pointing the finger at one another, but what is that going to solve. We just need to be mindful of everyone and no matter what the circumstances are, be respectful with each other.
April 20, 2008 8:51 AM
"Respect you earn, and if you don't want me to be rude to you and yell, then don't do it to me. Just because I am at my job does not mean that I don't deserve respect."
Let me make this real clear for you, step out of line the slightest in any way, and I will file a complaint with your superiors, the police and my Congressman quicker than you can say "do you want to fly today?"
You do not deserve respect until you demonstrate that respect has been earned. So far TSO's have earned a lack of respect caused by their actions which implicate you even if your one of the good guys.
I on the other hand am engaged in a lawful endeavor that requires travel. I deserve to be treated respectfully because that is your job as defined by your agency. If I get out of line then you have certain tools to deal with the situation. Use them correctly!
It is up to you how the enviorment at the checkpoint is presented to the public. I hope that TSA improves on the negative perception that exist now.
It would make your job easier and my travel more pleasant.
April 20, 2008 12:33 PM
"inconsistencies" has been used over and over in this forum, take a moment to ponder this. TSA policies for the traveling public is available for reading on TSA.GOV, which mirrors the policies and procedures that govern its officers, who are also given the obligation of determining if your items represent a threat. Can your assumptions of "inconsistencies" be attributed to an officer making an informed decision on your specific/personal situation, and thereby interpreted negatively if you receive a decision that is unfavorable to you? Just because you were given an exemption by one officer at one airport, does not automatically mean you get a "pass" for the rest of your travels. Information is displayed on various media in and around the airport, how many people pay attention to them? There are even some airports authorities that are providing the proper baggies to make it easier for everyone. Lay Mans terms folks... Liquid, gels, creams, paste, aerosols.. if it feels wet when you place the contents in you hand... it's considered a liquid. 3.4oz. or less... as marked on the manufacturer label. half a tube of 6oz. toothpaste left in your bag for an officer to have to check does little to expedite you through the checkpoint... One quart size seal-able plastic baggie per person... kind of self explanatory. Rudeness from officers is a big issue, but can some of them be attributed to an officer making a decision of not allowing your prohibited items through the checkpoint and sticking by that decision no matter how you beg or plead or yell? Not to say that some of the officers can't do a better job of controlling emotions during these exchanges. As some can surmise I am a STSO and have been since TSA's inception, but I also worked for an airline for approx. ten years prior to joining TSA. I recognize the needed emphasis on better customer service interactions regardless of how the traveling public reacts, we must not loose our bearing. Something that is easy for some and needs some focus for others. I am also on the same side as those who think that, officers who dishonor the agency by stealing should at the least be fired, if not prosecuted and incarcerated. But to those who believe that all of the officers out there are untrustworthy discredits too many officers who perform the duty they swore to uphold consistantly with little to no recognition for their efforts. Those officers who don't rely or wait for acknowledgement for doing an outstanding job day in and day out do not deserve to be lumped in the same group as those who disgrace not only themselves but ultimately the nation whose character they soiled by committing illegal acts.
April 21, 2008 1:45 PM
To STSO who posted on April 21, 2008 at 1:45 PM.
So your saying what I have posted below are consistent with TSA policy and procedures?
See the problem? I suspect not!
"TSO NY said the following;
"that may be true, but without a prescription it doesn't go."
"It's all well to know the rules, but when you're on the checkpoint sometimes the rules get "changed" to suit the situation."
"TSA states that if those bottles are not labeled, they aren't allowed to go."
April 21, 2008 8:38 PM
To anonymous who said
So your saying what I have posted below are consistent with TSA policy and procedures?
See the problem? I suspect not!
"TSO NY said the following;
"that may be true, but without a prescription it doesn't go."
From the limited context that you provided I agree that TSO NY did not provide you with the correct information. TSA.GOV states the following
"You may bring all prescription and over-the-counter medications (liquids, gels, and aerosols) including KY jelly, eye drops, and saline solution for medical purposes."
What kind of medication did you have? Did you exhibit any kind of behavior that would have caused the officer to make the decision that he/she made. I’m not ruling out that the officer might have been in a bad mood, in which case you should have requested to talk to a supervisor. If neither of these were not to your satisfaction, TSA has a customer service department that you can email at TSA-ContactCenter@dhs.gov. I encourage anyone who has had situations like these to make an accurate report to provide TSA the chance to correct the problem or at the least provide the correct information.
April 22, 2008 4:59 AM
RE: From the limited context that you provided I agree that TSO NY did not provide you with the correct information. TSA.GOV states the following....
The statements I quoted were from a post by TSA NY on this blog. To date no one from TSA has made a post to correct this invalid information and most likely TSO NY is at work depriving travelers of their property illegally.
The point is that all TSO's do not know the standards or work outside of the standards. Being a person passing the checkpoint my knoweldge of the rules matters little. In the example given it is the responsiblilty of TSA management to know the TSO's degree of training and to supervise and provide correction as needed. As evidenced here this apparently does not happen!
Your question, "What kind of medication did you have? Did you exhibit any kind of behavior that would have caused the officer to make the decision that he/she made." does not really matter. If the items are not prohibited they should not be stolen from the passenger. If the passenger is displaying odd behavior then the correct action would be additional screening to resolve the concern instead of stealing the passengers allowed belongings.
The passengers only options are to request assistance at the check point which oftens leads to additonal retalitory screening and possibly missing a flight or having the property confiscated (it is not surrendered unless it is done willfully). Any actions taken after the fact does not restore the lost property.
To date TSA seems reluctant to correct rouge TSO's so most people relent to the abuse at checkpoints.
Yes there is a lot of information on the TSA website, however TSO's apparently cannot read or use different information. Ther are to many errors made by TSO's to be just isolated cases of poor training.
Lastly this part of the blog is titled "Insonsistencies".
Where would you prefer that we post these concerns?
April 22, 2008 12:25 PM
Our SOP does coincide with the information on the tsa.gov website but gives more detail. Liquids, lotions, gels, and aerosols over the size limit can be brought through for medical purposes or for infants. They still must be declared, and as long as it's a reasonable amount for travel it's allowable.
We aren't medical professionals and that reasonable amount statement in there is open widely to interpretation by the individual TSO's across all the airports. It's always better to ere on the side of caution, and just screen the oversized liquids a little more thoroughly since we aren't medical professionals.
Prescriptions aren't required and for that TSO from NY to state that was completely incorrect.
April 22, 2008 8:23 PM
re: Prescriptions aren't required and for that TSO from NY to state that was completely incorrect.
April 22, 2008 8:23 PM
I agree, however TSA and/or the Blog Team Operators have to date not made a post correcting the statements of TSO NY. It has been requested many times.
I have no option but to think that this TSO is at work today using these same flawed made up rules.
If this TSO actions causes a person to have their property taken from them it would be no different than stealing. Intent has little bearing, the TSO did not comply with Agency Guidance.
This TSO should be removed from any contact with the public, reduce in grade to the entry level grade and required to complete all entry level training and qualifications before working a checkpoint again.
After resuming work the TSO should be on a one year probation and if any incedent happens involving them terminated for cause.
TSO's must be held accountable for their actions. Then TSA might gain some respect from the public.
April 23, 2008 10:19 AM
Define a "case" as in for my laptop computer. I have a neoprene (fabric) cover for my leased computer, as I don't want it scratched or damaged in the screening tubs you use. Neoprene is commonly used in many things, including clothes...which you don't make them take off.
Repeatedly, I go right through the screening at DCA with my computer safely in its fabric.
Yet, on the return journey from MHT or BOS, the screeners insist it be removed, and of course, holds up the line.
Kindly define your policies, as to whether a thin layer of neoprene around the pc constitutes a "case". Is it HONESTLY an impediment to your XRAY process? Doubtful. If so, then I ask why your plastic tubs are not.
Define it. Educate your staff, and make this process less arduous than it need be!
April 24, 2008 4:45 PM
Get with it guys, the fact of the matter is pretty simple...
When TSO's go to work, they follow procedures established by their management, if they intentionally fail to follow procedures, they can be severely repremanded. This is no different than when YOU go to work and you dont follow what your boss asks you to do, plain and simple.
Yes there is much discression left up to each individual officer and also local policies at differing airports shape the decision making process, but if you follow what is described at TSA.GOV you should not have a problem, arrive prepared with suffieient time to pass security, and bring a decent attitude with you, trust me, you wont have a problem. Ask for a supervisor if you want to dispute a requirement, however if you are wrong, dont expect anyone to cut you some slack. . .
April 26, 2008 9:02 AM
I would like to know why some airports have a special security line for first class and business class flyers. The lines are much shorter than lines for economy flyers, and I can't help but believe that there is a difference in the screening, just because the screeners are made aware that they are screening 'higher income' passengers. The real complain however is that all passengers pay the same taxes, probably more in some cases, and that is what pays the TSA, not the exensive airline ticket, so why should they get special treatment from the TSA. I asked this question to the TSA director via email over a year ago and never got a response. It is not at all airports, but I know for a fact from a trip last month that San Jose, CA had a special lane for first and business class.
April 26, 2008 12:55 PM
In several recent trips i had several inconsistencies that really make no sense. I travel 60% of every month, and have a nice routine when going through security. Ever since the 3-1-1 was put into place i have been carrying my 1 Quart size bag. But time and time again i see folks with 2 or 3, or even 1 gallon bags go right through security with no issues. Then again in Charlotte, i was preparing to go through the checkpoint and i always place my laptop and my liquids in 1 bin to reduce the number of bins. The laptop is small and the liquids are not on top of the laptop, i was told they must be separated. Never before was that the case, so i had to get another bin. Then 3 days later in Louisville i put my laptop and liquids together and everything was fine. Why? The last one is the kicker, i was just coming home from Newark, and watched an employee going through security with a cart full of water and soda. Why is ok for them to put there liquids in the radar scanner but our liquids are not acceptable? You don't think once those liquids go through they cannot be given to someone of interest. Come on? Remember those are the same liquids we are allowed to purchase to bring on to aircrafts.
April 27, 2008 9:05 AM
I recently traveled with my wife from Spokane to San Diego and back. Trying to check-in (on line) the night before in Spokane, I received a message that I 'needed additional assistance' to check in. I thought, "ummm I hav been taqgged for security check." No doubt, when I arrived to the airport the ticket agent told me I was tagged for security; and the TSA agents seemed to enjoy yelling to one another "hey, I got a security here."
After a few days in San Diego we were preparing to return to Spokane and, wouldn't you know it, I received the same message when trying to check-in on line. Again, I had to do the whole body check thing.
My first point is NOT that I am irritated that we have extra screening; nor that people are chosen randomly (though that may be a legitimate complaint). My point of irritation is warning people that they are going to be tagged for security effectively undermines security. It is a little like the mall security person telling the teenager that they are going to follow them around for shop-lifting. I mean, do we really think terrorists how so stupid to not hand off a bomb or something when they get tagged for 'additionl check-in assistance.'
As frequent travelers, you know things canget even more stupid - and they did.
In San Diego, my wife and I were in the commuter terminal. As a REALLY small terminal, the gates are literally 30 feet away from the security station. Watching people make their way through the line, we say an older Asian couple get pulled aside with their bags. The security agenct pulled something like 4 jars of jam out of the wmen's bag and kindly explained that liquids of this size were not allowed.
All is well, right? NO. He next pulled out a full-size (7-8 inch) scissors from the women's bag. He looked at it, held the blades to hs hand (the blades alone were s wide as his hand - approx. 4 inches), asked another security agent if they were ok, they both said yes and the first agent put back in the women's bag.
Several others watched these scene happen and we were all speechless.
In what fricken world is strawberry jam more dangerous than an 8 inch scissors.
Both of these incidents point to the moronic nature of the TSA. How absolutely stupid can things be. I have watched little-old and clearly nice ladies have to take struggle to get their shoes off in front of hundreds of people; yet a full-length scissors is somehow ok!!!
There should be no quesion why people are frustrated with this behemoth (and costly) and yet amazingly innefective government agency!
April 27, 2008 9:56 AM
I have found a great deal on inconsistencies when traveling with an infant. I have flown from Cincinnati, Louisville and Ft Myers. Some Tsa ask you to leave formula in the diaper bag, some want you to remove it. I have been asked to walk the stroller through and also to fold it up and have it Xrayed. It is difficult enough traveling alone with an infant. You feel stressed knowing you are holding up the line while folding up stroller, taking out formula, taking baby out of car seat, removing shoes etc. It would be great if TSA would assist you when they see you are struggling. If airports were concistent, you would at least know what to they expected as far as what needs to be screened. The biggest problems I have encountered have been while traveling through Ft Myers. Every airport I have departed from allows you to go to the front or a seperate line when traveling with a stroller. Not in Ft Myers. You must stand in the main line, which is fine. Once I got to the front of the line, I asked the TSA rep about removing formula from my diaper bag. He said to leave it in the bag since I was traveling with a baby. He said they would know it was formula. I assumed he knew the rules, even though I was asked to remove the bottle in Louisville. Louisville also pushed my stroller through the metal detector. The TSA agent in Ft Myers had me send it through the XRay machine (all fine). I also had a laptop in a seperate bag that I removed. Once my bags had gone through and I was trying to get my child back in car seat and then stroller, a female TSA agent approached me. She was quite upset that I had not removed the formula from Diaper bag. I told her I was very sorry and explained that I had asked a different TSA agent before sending bag through. I also showed her the gentleman that I had spoken with. I thought that would be the end of it. I put my diaper bag and seperate computer bag under the stroller and started to walk off. I was then approached by a different TSA agent by the name of Adam (can't find ID number). He asked me to give him my computer bag. I handed it to him and explained that it had already been screened and asked what was the problem. He would not even respond. I watched him open the computer and go through every pocket of the computer bag. I only had the computer, pad of paper, magazine and an ink pen in the bag. He then sent the bag back through the Xray machine. He brought the bag back and keep searching. Once again, I asked if there was a problem. He still did not say a word. At this point he had been searching my bag for approx 7 minutes. He finally pushes the bag back to me and starts to walk away. I asked again what the issue was with the bag ( as I did not want to have this same experience again). He told me he was not at liberty to say, but we was second guessing something in my bag. In my opinion, he was just trying to show me who was in charge since I sent formula through the Xray machine. I am all for security, but I think if there is a potential problem with something in your bag, you need to know what it is. We are all afraid to question TSA agents, in fear of not being allowed to travel. I will be traveling next week through Ft myers next with the same computer bag, stroller, etc and am anxious to see what happens. More training needs to be done with TSA to amek sure they are concistent. This would speed up the lines and keep people from getting as stressed. There are many TSA agents out there that think a little too much of their power. They need to get over them selves and realize the most important thing is keeping our palnes and airports safe, while still being friendly. It is sad, that many people have to start their vacations in such a stressed manner due to attitudes of TSA agents.
April 27, 2008 10:21 AM
Vendors have been vetted and have airport privledges. The companies that deliever the liquids, lotions, gels, and aerosols to be purchased in the sterile area are also cleared.
April 27, 2008 10:42 AM
I am 35yr old white single parent who frequently flies with my 6yr old daughter. Why is it that in Detroit I can go through security with apple sauce and pudding for her snack without a problem but when I try to return home from Fort Meyer's I am pulled aside and treated like a criminal? I was even told that 2 apple sauces and 1 pudding were excessive, how is that when we have a 4 hour lay over in Atlanta. I was told that I should buy her something to eat in Atlanta. Gee, maybe I am on a budget because I am, let me say it again A SINGLE PARENT!! Why is apple sauce and pudding considered a liquid, is it not a food, along the same lines as, oh I don't know, baby food?? This whole time while I am trying to figure out why the rules are different here than they are in Michigan and while I am trying to reign in my temper my 6 yr old is crying and starting to have a fit because she knows that they are telling us we did something wrong. Later she askes why that lady was so mean, I replied that she was just trying to do her job, but inside I was just as confused as she was. Get it together TSA, americans are not the criminals.
April 27, 2008 10:50 AM
Anonymous said...
Vendors have been vetted and have airport privledges. The companies that deliever the liquids, lotions, gels, and aerosols to be purchased in the sterile area are also cleared.
April 27, 2008 10:42 AM
So the vendor was vetted, so what?
What is to prevent an employee of that vendor from adding something to the shipment that is dangerous.
I was vetted for a Top Secret Sercuity Clearance, yet I must be checked each and every time I pass a TSA checkpoint. So does anyone else with simular backgrounds.
Your argument is invalid!
April 27, 2008 11:47 AM
What is to prevent an employee of that vendor from adding something to the shipment that is dangerous.
I was vetted for a Top Secret Sercuity Clearance, yet I must be checked each and every time I pass a TSA checkpoint. So does anyone else with simular backgrounds.
Your argument is invalid
You may have a top secret security clearance but you don't have an airport badge at that particular airport.We TSO's are required to ensure that the vendors badges are valid. My argument isn't an argument its the reason why vendors are authorized to carry liquids to the sterile area.
April 27, 2008 4:51 PM
My 87 yr. old disabled Father of Irish descent, who can barely walk at all, was asked to nearly undress in front of everyone. No one would help him undress, or get dressed back up (in front of everyone.)
The purpose of this is unclear, and abusive.
This doesn't help national security.
April 28, 2008 2:24 PM
Someone needs to start profiling again.
I get stopped everytime for a complete search -- I'm red-haired, green eyed, 55, a female with arthritis.
The time wasted on me does not help anyone, least of all national security
April 28, 2008 2:35 PM
We transfered planes in Chicago O'Hare, terminal 1, about 1:00 pm April 18 th this month. Since I have a hip replacement I was being checked out. I had taken shoes off as well as all the other requirements. As they were checking me, about 4 or 5 men slopply dressed jumped ahead of the line, didn't take off shoes and proceeded through the metal detector and proceeded on their way. Not one of the security personnel paid any attention to them. It was a direct violation of the rules that the rest of us had to apply with. Why didn't they get stopped? They appeared to be in gang type of dress. Were the security agents afraid to stop them? This line of security was one of the most strict that I have gone through. They were even going through the purse of a little old crippled lady with a cane, and then not even batting an eye of some hoods forcing their way through that would be a much greater threat.
April 28, 2008 3:40 PM
Anonymous said...
We transfered planes in Chicago O'Hare, terminal 1, about 1:00 pm April 18 th this month. Since I have a hip replacement I was being checked out. I had taken shoes off as well as all the other requirements. As they were checking me, about 4 or 5 men slopply dressed jumped ahead of the line, didn't take off shoes and proceeded through the metal detector and proceeded on their way. Not one of the security personnel paid any attention to them. It was a direct violation of the rules that the rest of us had to apply with. Why didn't they get stopped? They appeared to be in gang type of dress. Were the security agents afraid to stop them? This line of security was one of the most strict that I have gone through. They were even going through the purse of a little old crippled lady with a cane, and then not even batting an eye of some hoods forcing their way through that would be a much greater threat.
April 28, 2008 3:40 PM
Those fellows with their shoes on might have been airport employees. I'm not sure but if they had valid airport badges and their shoes don't alarm they can keep them on.
April 28, 2008 10:06 PM
You may have a top secret security clearance but you don't have an airport badge at that particular airport.
A few weeks back TSA found an airport worker in the ramp area with a handgun in their vehicle. I suppose since this person had an Airport Badge they were good to go?
April 29, 2008 11:08 AM
A few weeks back TSA found an airport worker in the ramp area with a handgun in their vehicle. I suppose since this person had an Airport Badge they were good to go?
April 29, 2008 11:08 AM
No it's obviously not good to go. That is why we screen employees and vehicles on the ramp. Who knows if there was a nefarious purpose for the gun, but I'm glad that the TSA is doing their job and screening employees as well.
April 29, 2008 12:29 PM
That is why we screen employees and vehicles on the ramp. Who knows if there was a nefarious purpose for the gun, but I'm glad that the TSA is doing their job and screening employees as well.
April 29, 2008 12:29 PM
The person and weapon was already past the checkpoint.
Good job at security? I think not!
April 29, 2008 2:13 PM
Airline employees do not for the most part go through the checkpoints. When escorting passengers perhaps but they have other access to the sterile area. TSA is piloting 100% employee screening at some airports, and does do screening of employees other than through the checkpoints. That is how the employee with the gun was caught by the TSA.
April 29, 2008 6:52 PM
Flying out of Detroit Metro,my wife and I were asked to remove our hooded sweatshirts. Good thing we had t-shirts on underneath. Secondly, has anyone ever seen a TSA official smile?
April 30, 2008 4:31 AM
CasinoGambling wrote:
Flying out of Detroit Metro,my wife and I were asked to remove our hooded sweatshirts.
And rightly so. Though this does fall in line with something I've said in other threads, where various airports have their own methods for dealing with such things.
At my airport, for instance, having a hooded sweatshirt on when you enter into the walk-through means you get sent over for additional screening and patted down to ensure that you aren't hiding anything beneath it.
Some airports extend the requirement for coat and jacket removal to hooded sweatshirts, asking that they be removed.
Under the guidelines, both options are correct and it'd be up to the specific federal security directors of each airport to decide how to implement the procedures.
Good thing we had t-shirts on underneath.
If you did not, you wouldn't have had to take them off. At that point though, if the hooded sweatshirt were your only line of defense between you being clothed and you standing there in your skin, you likely would have been sent over for the same pat-down that I mentioned above. Since I don't work at Detroit Metro, I can't precisely say that they'd do, but given that I am a TSO I have a fairly good idea, given that everything we do is generally along the same lines.
Secondly, has anyone ever seen a TSA official smile?
Yes.
May 1, 2008 11:58 AM
There are a lot of valid complaints in this blog. I recognize the frustration. We are not as consistant as we should be as an organization.
Firstly just to clear up one of the most damaging concerns...TSA does not confiscate any items. We have items that are prohibited from going past the security checkpoints. You as the owner of the prohibited items are told that it is not permitted past and may be checked as baggage, given to someone who is not flying, or mailed. If you choose not to do any of those things we are willing to dispose of them for you. You may not like your options but you do have them. The exception to this is when the police and or FBI are involved, at that point the items may be confiscated and used as evidence against you. If you aren't carrying a gun or throwing star mace etc. you will likely never have an item confiscated.
Secondly none of our officers are permitted to keep any surrendered items even if the passenger offers them as a gift. The largest part of these items which are voluntarily surrendered, are liquids, pastes and gels, and go directly into garbage cans to be disposed of by a contracted cleaning service. The exceptions would be those items that are flamable, toxic or otherwise hazardous, and liquor.The disposition of hazardous materials is the resposibility of by upper management and I don't know the details. Liquor, wine, beer etc is poured down a drain with at least one witness. This is done to insure the cleaning company workers don't take it and drink it, at least that is my understanding. I do not know what happens to the knives and scissors once they have been collected. I have heard it is possible to reclaim voluntarily surrendered items but as it is not something handled locally by the airport I don't know anything about the process or even if it is true.
I agree with the person who mentioned the fact that diabetics are allowed to carry insulin and needles. There will always be a risk to life and safety as long as customer service is being taken into account and," even if they are not," ie. large men etc.. There will never be perfect 100% security. The idea behind TSA is to limit the threats as much as possible while attempting to keep a balance with customer service.
I know that no matter how much we are allowed to do what we want ,when Mom or Dad say, "no," we think they are the meanest most unfair parents who ever walked the earth. Of course when TSA has told you," No you can't take such and such through the checkpoint." and you didn't give yourself enough time to check it in as baggage, or it's too far to walk, or too much trouble, and your ride already left, you think," TSA is just mean!!!"
To the person who wrote that inconsistancy is a good thing...YOU ARE DEAD WRONG! We have standard operating proceedures and we are expected to abide by them. The inconsistancies are to our shame. It is very embarrassing when I have passengers telling me their knife came through several airports, officers looked at it, decided it was small enough, and let it go. I only hope they are lying to try to persuade me to allow it past, which I can not do because no knives are allowed!!
In closing I'd just like to ad a reminder. We are not mean, as a rule, I realize we do have some people working for us that are. When we disallow something it is either because we are required to or through our interpretation of our proceedures, they are sometimes less clear than others, believe we are required to disallow said item. There is always an alternative to giving up your property. If you are not sure it is allowed send it by mail or in checked baggage, have your ride wait until you call and tell them you are okay. We really want you to make your flight without ever having to see us, the supervisors, that is.
May 1, 2008 3:49 PM
hsvtso said: "At my airport, for instance, having a hooded sweatshirt on when you enter into the walk-through means you get sent over for additional screening and patted down to ensure that you aren't hiding anything beneath it."
Dear blog team,
I never saw any TSA recommendation to avoid hooded sweatshirts in airports apart from on this blog. I certainly did not know that wearing them, or "clothes that do not show the outline of your body", as stated by another TSA blogger, made me an additional screening candidate. Could you please put an explanation regarding this point on the TSA site? I think we deserve to be warned that wearing tight clothes can help us avoid secondary screening.
May 1, 2008 6:07 PM
TSA Supervisor said: "The idea behind TSA is to limit the threats as much as possible while attempting to keep a balance with customer service."
Sorry TSA, from a quick look through this blog, the balance with customer service has long been lost...
May 1, 2008 6:20 PM
I was stopped at ORD airport by a TSA agent before I even entered the security line. She told me I could only have two carry-on items and I would need to consolidate my bags. I was carrying one small messenger bag, one laptop in a case, and one rolling bag. I am aware of the 2 item rule, and was prepared to put my laptop inside my messenger bag once I got past security since I would have to have it out to go on the belt individually. I asked if I needed to have my laptop out to go through the line and she told me I did. I then continued to walk towards the line when she stopped me again. With a sharp, "Ma'am you NEED to consolidate your bags." Didn't we just go through this? I proceded to shove my laptop in my bag, walk five steps past her, then take it back out again to prepare to go through the security line. What's up with that?
May 1, 2008 11:17 PM
Anonymous said...
"...I would really like to know what happens to all these items – even new, sealed products – that are “thrown out” by the TSOs. If you don’t believe me, then search in Google for “confiscated items” +airport. You will find numerous articles that show money is being made off these items – AT YOUR EXPENSE."
To whomever wrote this blog entry, at most airports it's the custodians who are making money off of your surrendered items. Most of the liquids are actaull "thrown in the trashcan" and taken out by the custodians. If they want to pilage through the trash, they can because it's considered "gargabe" after they take it off the check point. If you'd like to make a complaint about it, you should contact your local airport or the company that provides custodial services to that airport. Same goes for confiscated prohibited items (knives, tools, or other weapons) when it comes to disposal. A contracted company picks up the prohibited items for disposal. How they dispose of it is pretty much up to them once they take it off of airport property.
April 5, 2008 3:06 PM
for one... we throw them in the garbage. that garbage bag has so much thrown in it that if you seriously take something out of it to consume then thats your personal health. i NEVER ate or drank out the garbage and do not plan to. tsa DOES NOT take the trash out, there are airport workers. so if there is money to be made then you should look in their direction because if you look up while inside of a checkpoint there are TONS of cameras so there is no way a tso can go into the garbage pull something out and not be seen.
May 4, 2008 6:29 AM
Anonymous said...
Anonymous said: "I've never had any of the problems with security that people have described, and it's for two very simple reasons: I check my luggage, and I travel light."
Dear Anonymous, I travel light too, typically a carry-on size suitcase that I do not carry on, but check in, plus a purse. I still get selected for super-security every single time I fly. I am a tiny white woman in my 30s. I have no clue why I am subject to "special treatment" in airport security, and there is nothing I can do about it
"Do you really NEED to carry your toothpaste with you?"
Yes I do. I typically travel internationally, in long overnight flights, involving connections that often take 24 h between checking in and seeing my luggage again. I couldn´t care less about makeup but need both toothpaste and deodorant, or you won´t have a very pleasant time sitting next to me on your next trip.
April 8, 2008 6:38 AM
there are plenty of grocery stores and store aids (rite aid, duane reade, cvs pharmacy) that have TRAVEL SIZED products. you just have to ask for them. they have very small toothpaste, deodorant and shaving cream bottles. JUST ASK.
May 4, 2008 6:33 AM
Anonymous said...
On 4/7/08 I went thru security at RDU. The short,young TSO man looked at my MI drivers license, made some comment about Penn State that I didn't get. When he mentioned something else about Penn State I said "I don't know about that." He proceeded to tell me that maybe I was asking for a body cavity search. I was so shocked that I said nothing more and didn't think to get his name or badge ID #. This is totally unacceptable and I hope to be able to contact the TSA at RDU to make a formal complaint. Talk about unchecked and inappropriate powers.
April 9, 2008 2:09 PM
indeed it is unacceptable but....you didnt say anything either. so how can such behavior be stopped ?
May 4, 2008 6:38 AM
Anonymous said...
""Inconsistencies" Is what it takes to catch the bad guys! If every airport was the same then the average traveler would find loop holes through TSA checkpoints, and if the average traveler can seek out loop holes imagine what a terrorist can find. Don't forget TSA is not the only one watching you go through the airport, so are the terrorist. Its your option to fly, take the Gray Hound if you don't feel safe!
April 9, 2008 12:44 PM"
So the terrorist is standing around watching you? Laughing, perhaps? Maybe he will invite you for a drink and chat you up.... Try not to be a security risk in the unlikely event that this occurs.
April 9, 2008 6:11 PM
as crazy as it may seem in some aspect he is right. you are so into getting into security that you are probably unaware of what goes on around you. you ever see those "MEN IN BLACK" people standing outside the checkpoint ? most of them are private owned limo drivers waiting to pick someone up. ever notice how some...may focus attention more on the checkpoint than the exit lane in which passengers are leaving security to get their bags ? that the very same person whose name is on the piece of paper may have walked by them because they arent looking ? i have also witnessed (now im not really stereotypical) but i seen 4 guys who... in some eyes may fit the description of possible terrorists. gather around and talk and when approaching the line began to separate and i mean go into individual lines waay far apart from each other and then when done gather again and chat. now if that is the norm for you then you are naive but... tsa manage to pull them aside and question one passenger why he had luggage of only STACKS OF BOOKS in his bag and nothing more. no clothes, no shoes, no toiletry kit...nothing. but books. like i said if that is the norm to you then hey...be naive and believe what you want.
May 4, 2008 6:43 AM
Anonymous said...
I am a diabetic who wears an insulin pump. When going to the airport I never know if security is going to treat me like a criminal or a normal person because I am wearing an insulin pump. I have now gotten to the point of before I go to the security area I stop off at a bathroom hide the insulin pump where the sun doesn't shine and walk back out and go through security. So far this has worked, but it makes me wonder how many other people are hiding things like I am. Is security really doing anything? or is it just making people like me really good at sneaking things in?
April 10, 2008 1:16 PM
if you want your insulin pump smelling like... your private parts just to prove a point, then thats on you. its really not that serious. and your pump probably doesnt have enough metal to alarm it. and if it did you would go through additional screening in which when they wand you and hear the alarm go off in your private area they will call for a supervisor to assist and when you finally say its my insulin pump thats when they call for extra help because now then this sounds a bit insane and abnormal. in which they might call over police to study your patterns and make sure you are sane.... now... do you want all that attention just for a pump ???
May 4, 2008 6:47 AM
Matt said...
In several recent trips i had several inconsistencies that really make no sense. I travel 60% of every month, and have a nice routine when going through security. Ever since the 3-1-1 was put into place i have been carrying my 1 Quart size bag. But time and time again i see folks with 2 or 3, or even 1 gallon bags go right through security with no issues. Then again in Charlotte, i was preparing to go through the checkpoint and i always place my laptop and my liquids in 1 bin to reduce the number of bins. The laptop is small and the liquids are not on top of the laptop, i was told they must be separated. Never before was that the case, so i had to get another bin. Then 3 days later in Louisville i put my laptop and liquids together and everything was fine. Why? The last one is the kicker, i was just coming home from Newark, and watched an employee going through security with a cart full of water and soda. Why is ok for them to put there liquids in the radar scanner but our liquids are not acceptable? You don't think once those liquids go through they cannot be given to someone of interest. Come on? Remember those are the same liquids we are allowed to purchase to bring on to aircrafts.
April 27, 2008 9:05 AM
ummm thats probably because he/she is not flying therefore does not pose a threat
May 4, 2008 7:00 AM
Anonymous said...
Anonymous said...
Vendors have been vetted and have airport privledges. The companies that deliever the liquids, lotions, gels, and aerosols to be purchased in the sterile area are also cleared.
April 27, 2008 10:42 AM
So the vendor was vetted, so what?
What is to prevent an employee of that vendor from adding something to the shipment that is dangerous.
I was vetted for a Top Secret Sercuity Clearance, yet I must be checked each and every time I pass a TSA checkpoint. So does anyone else with simular backgrounds.
Your argument is invalid!
April 27, 2008 11:47 AM
if that employee/employer does in fact do that, then now you have a name and face to go with it and prosecution will come.
May 4, 2008 7:01 AM
Anonymous said...
You may have a top secret security clearance but you don't have an airport badge at that particular airport.
A few weeks back TSA found an airport worker in the ramp area with a handgun in their vehicle. I suppose since this person had an Airport Badge they were good to go?
April 29, 2008 11:08 AM
no im sure they were fired then slapped with a felony fine and had to go to court to pay that wonderful 4 digit fine
May 4, 2008 7:03 AM
Anonymous said...
That is why we screen employees and vehicles on the ramp. Who knows if there was a nefarious purpose for the gun, but I'm glad that the TSA is doing their job and screening employees as well.
April 29, 2008 12:29 PM
The person and weapon was already past the checkpoint.
Good job at security? I think not!
April 29, 2008 2:13 PM
for one.. not EVERY employee has to go through security. there are other access points in the airport for employees who do not need to go through security to report to work. THUS the person got caught. so why the sarcasm ?? passengers definitely cannot go where that employee went because the alarm would go off instantly.
May 4, 2008 7:05 AM
Anonymous said...
hsvtso said: "At my airport, for instance, having a hooded sweatshirt on when you enter into the walk-through means you get sent over for additional screening and patted down to ensure that you aren't hiding anything beneath it."
Dear blog team,
I never saw any TSA recommendation to avoid hooded sweatshirts in airports apart from on this blog. I certainly did not know that wearing them, or "clothes that do not show the outline of your body", as stated by another TSA blogger, made me an additional screening candidate. Could you please put an explanation regarding this point on the TSA site? I think we deserve to be warned that wearing tight clothes can help us avoid secondary screening.
May 1, 2008 6:07 PM
wouldnt recommending passengers not to wear hooded sweatshirts result in tsa doing too much ??
May 4, 2008 7:08 AM
Anonymous said...
TSA Supervisor said: "The idea behind TSA is to limit the threats as much as possible while attempting to keep a balance with customer service."
Sorry TSA, from a quick look through this blog, the balance with customer service has long been lost...
May 1, 2008 6:20 PM
thats on the checkpoint. customer service on a blog ?? what exactly are you buying ? what product or service is tsa selling on this blog ?
May 4, 2008 7:09 AM
I am quite amazed that the new "black diamond lane" procedure, which was instituted mere weeks ago, has already given rise to the myth that it's for frequent flyers, 1st class passengers, and those with elite status with the airlines.
No, it's for people who are experienced with the security process, or have no carry-ons, etc., i.e., people who can get through the line quickly.
Admittedly, these two groups overlap significantly, but they are not the same! The gatekeepers for these "black diamond" lanes need to be informed of the difference.
May 4, 2008 12:15 PM
People are known to take only the bits and pieces of what they hear, such as 3 ounces but then they don't hear about the baggy. An even finer example is when back in august of 2007 a newspaper article was posted noting how disposable cigarette lighters were now allowed and within a day everyone believes they can bring lighters now, but then they get up to the checkpoint and find out that its not allowed until september 5th or 6th for instance. This is a major inconsistancy. I recommend training your officers first about this then establishing a set date to allow them and finally notifying newspaper and the media.
I'm sure this caused many angry individuals to complain about this across the country when this happened. I recommend learning from this mistake and not letting it happen again, "fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me!".
May 5, 2008 1:18 AM
for one.. not EVERY employee has to go through security. there are other access points in the airport for employees who do not need to go through security to report to work. THUS the person got caught. so why the sarcasm ??
Not sarcasm, the person with the weapon had passed a checkpoint controlled by contract security. TSA's supervision of the contract security was inadequate to ensure that no contraband made its way to the secured area. The person was on the aircraft ramp area, so I suspect this is a controlled area.
Had this person brought a bomb on he could have placed it on an aircraft or into a passengers checked baggage after it had been cleared.
Additionally, it proves the point that access to the ramp areas is not secure and is the most likely means of introducing contraband.
TSA is busy confiscating water and such and has a severe security whole that remains unplugged.
Hey, if your ok with that then so am I. I'm willing to take my chances that the next attack will not be via aviation.
May 5, 2008 10:40 AM
I originally posted this comment (on 4/15); I just wanted to come back and put my name on it. It's the same as before (just re-posted), I figure this would make it easier to keep track of what I say or in this case, have already said, and responses to it. Whether it's on the page or another one.
by D.Brooks...(Originally posted 4/15/08 under Anonymous)
I have read most of the comments on how TSA is horrible with bad attitudes and not doing their job. I agree that from airport to airport our procedures are inconsitent. That is not because it's written that way, it's because the individuals at that particular airport are interpreting the procedures in their own manner and applying them as such, so complaints should be made directly to that airport and the TSA management their and not to TSA as a whole because most of us are doing our job to the guidelines that we are given. We do not come to your jobs and ask you to bend the rules for us, so we would appreciate if you would provide us with the same courtesy. Everyday we have people come in saying "i didn't know" and "well when did this start" and blah blah blah. Same nonsense, different day. If the people from Japan know the rules and the people from Germany know the rules, then there is no reason that the people from Ohio, or Kentucky or some of these other places don't know. Stop the lies people. The liquid ban has been going on for over a year, so to come in a say you didn't know or this must be new is ridiculous. Too many people come in begging to get things through they know they shouldn't have, and when you make an expection for them, these same people are the ones telling everyone we aren't doing our job because we let them through with something they shouldn't have. Stop testing us and just follow the rules. 3.4 oz!! Not a brand new 2 liter bottle of soda, not your 12 oz bottle of suntan lotion or you 8 oz perfume. The reason you come across screeners with bad attitudes or a no nonsense mentality is because we get tired of some passenger screaming at us that they didn't know the rules, or trying to sneak something in only to pretend they didn't know it was in their bag. After 8 hrs of the same B.S. your patience wears thin and you do become more rigid. Don't blame us, blame the clown in front of you for stuffing the 4 inch hunting knife in his kids bag and trying to pretend he didn't know it was their or the lady with a 2 liter soda holding up the line because she wants a ziploc back for it. These are real examples of the ignorance we deal with every few minutes.
Yes on the TSA website they have a few examples of items found and I can personally tell you that we have confiscated REAL guns, brass knuckles, and large knives not little belt buckles or lighters; so there are REAL threat items being taken daily and it's not an exaggeration or joke. If people stop trying to test us by bringing stuff in they shouldn't have, then we wouldn't have to waste as much time going through bags and checking people we don't need to. People always say " do I look like a terrorist?" Well since Jeffrey Dahmer didn't look like he ate little boys and Tim McVeigh didn't look like he was going to blow up the building in Oklahoma and since we don't know all of you personally, we can't really say if you are one or not, but we can say this.... If you don't want to be mistaken for a possible terrorist, then stop acting like one. Terrorists like to test security, beg to bring things they shouldn't, and try to sneak items in. We would love to not dig through your stuff if we don't have to, and you would love to pass through security without being stopped, so leave the extra stuff home and we can all have a better experience at the airport.
Thanks....
May 6, 2008 7:08 AM
Let's forget about things like shoes coming off at one airport and not another and talk about a MAJOR inconsistency.
Why are there six year old children, SKY MARSHALS, and heads of State such as NELSON MANDELA, on the do not fly list?
We're looking for terrorists right? We're trying to catch terrorists. Using a list of names is bound to cause inconsistencies and problems since it is so easy to get a fake ID in the first place.
So, while the TSA and the Department of Homeland Security prevent Sky Marshals from boarding the flights that they are to protect (because their name is similar to someone on the watch list), a person ON the watch list only needs a fake ID to breeze onto a plane.
THAT is inconsistent and that needs to be addressed. This "super secret" watch list that is growing exponentially will soon make it impossible for anyone to fly. Heck, a friend of mine was cavity searched while they asked him questions about the Russian mob.
So how about we go back to things that actually work? Prevention, WELL TRAINED screeners, and a little thing called common sense. Looking for a terrorist by name isn't going to accomplish much, they'll just keep using aliases while non-terrorists get refused access to their planes and, apparently, cavity searched.
May 6, 2008 2:42 PM
To the diabetic pointing out that he's allowed to bring on medication which can be used to kill folks? Yup. And I can still walk onto a plane with enough explosives to bring it out of the sky.
And yet I have to pay $3 for a small bottle of water because I can't carry that on.
How about we end the Security Theater and concentrate on things that actually DO something?
Someone trying to bring on a hunting knife? X-Ray and metal detection catch that, arrest the idiot. Someone bringing on a liquid?
Technically speaking if ANYONE is allowed to bring on more than the prescribed amount of liquids, then it is "selective enforcement" and actually unconstitutional.
Don't get me wrong, common sense states that you let people bring on medication, however common sense (and numerous prominent scientists) has shown that no, the liquid explosive plot would not have worked.
May 6, 2008 2:49 PM
To anonymous who posted on May 4: "wouldnt recommending passengers not to wear hooded sweatshirts result in tsa doing too much ??"
If the TSA is selecting persons in sweatshirts for additional screening, we should be warned about this beforehand, so we can avoid being singled out for this reason.
Of course, I totally agree that selecting a person for addition screening based on the fact that this person is wearing a hood, or the tightness of their clothes, is ridiculous in the first place.
May 7, 2008 10:48 AM
Anonymous said...
for one.. not EVERY employee has to go through security. there are other access points in the airport for employees who do not need to go through security to report to work. THUS the person got caught. so why the sarcasm ??
Not sarcasm, the person with the weapon had passed a checkpoint controlled by contract security. TSA's supervision of the contract security was inadequate to ensure that no contraband made its way to the secured area. The person was on the aircraft ramp area, so I suspect this is a controlled area.
OK ONCE AGAIN BECAUSE IM STARTING TO BECOME ANNOYED. AIRPORT.. ARE YOU FOLLOWING ME ?? AIRPORT EMPLOYEES "DO NOT" HAVE TO GO THROUGH CHECKPOINTS. THERE ARE DOORS WITH ID SWIPES THAT THEY USE TO GO TO WORK. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE CHECKPOINT BUT NOW TSA NOT ONLY CHECKS AIRPORT EMPLOYEES BUT THEY ARE ALSO CHECKING PLANES BEFORE FLIGHT CREW AND PASSENGERS BOARD. CONTRACT SECURITY ?? AIRPORT EMPLOYEES SWIPE THEIR ID TO GAIN ACCESS INTO THAT AREA. WHAT SECURITY ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT ?? YOU HAVE BEEN SERIOUSLY MISINFORMED.
Had this person brought a bomb on he could have placed it on an aircraft or into a passengers checked baggage after it had been cleared.
Additionally, it proves the point that access to the ramp areas is not secure and is the most likely means of introducing contraband.
TSA is busy confiscating water and such and has a severe security whole that remains unplugged.
Hey, if your ok with that then so am I. I'm willing to take my chances that the next attack will not be via aviation.
May 5, 2008 10:40 AM
IF THE NEXT ATTACK ISNT WITH AVIATION THEN THATS NOT MY CONCERN AS I COULDNT DO ANYTHING TO PREVENT IT
May 7, 2008 12:41 PM
My beef? I have to transport a medication that needs to be kept cool at all times. The manufacturer has suggested that I use a long thermos with ice to transport the Byetta medication. TSA also suggest that I keep my original prescriptions with my medications. This has led me to attach my prescription to the outside of my thermos.
I have been to 10 different airports in the past year and have had to go through 10 different screenings on my thermos. Thank god I carry documentation and my glucometer at all times to show I am diabetic! I feel the TSA needs to better address a diabetics issue of transporting their medications and that all TSA agents perform the same screening. This inconsistency is very irritating as I am a road warrior who never knows if I am going to be pulled aside on an item the TSA says I can transport.
Helena S.
May 7, 2008 3:55 PM
re:OK ONCE AGAIN BECAUSE IM STARTING TO BECOME ANNOYED. AIRPORT.. ARE YOU FOLLOWING ME ??
.........................
I don't give a Rats Rearend if your getting annoyed.
Airport..Are you following me.
A person had a weapon on the ramp area of a supposedly secure area.
TSA is tasked to make sure that Civil Aviation is safe.
TSA failed, plan and simple.
If your not checking everyone entering the operations area then there is no reason to check anyone.
TSA=Theater
Not Security!
May 7, 2008 4:47 PM
Back on the subject of wearing hooded sweatshirts and getting pulled aside for additional screening. Why is a hooded sweatshirt considered any different than a regular sweatshirt? Is it the hood or the zipper that intimidates the TSA?
May 8, 2008 12:36 PM
Most hooded sweatshirts and sweatshirts of any type are rather bulky and items of interest could possibly be hidden. Does that mean every person getting a patdown has something hidden? Obviously not. Does that mean every person coming through with a hooded or bulky sweatshirt will get extra screening? Obviously not. But patting down someone wearing skin tight clothing in which nothing could possibly be hidden underneath really doesn't make much sense, so it's better to pick someone with bulky clothing on.
It's semi-random but using some common sense which we and our procedures are consistently attacked for not being routinely used.
May 8, 2008 9:08 PM
At the Ontario, California airport on Thursday, May 1 at 6pm, a young female TSA agent checking my ID and boarding pass asked why I had removed the receipt from my boarding pass (it's perforated). I explained that the receipt is not the boarding pass...it's my receipt for my personal records and not required for anything. (The Southwest boarding passes generated at the kiosk have a small perforated receipt). Well, the fact that it was detached threw her into a tizzy. Even though she had my boarding pass and ID (and the detached receipt that I retrieved from my wallet), she had to call other TSA agents over, get approvals, holding up the line, etc. (the boarding passes printed at home don't have receipts, so what's the big deal?). So I was "tagged" for the full body search, inquiry, etc. upstairs at the X-ray area, just because this TSA agent didn't know the rules.
May 11, 2008 3:13 PM
I went to Mexico City, and they would not LET you go through the metal detector without your shoes on. Most people were taking their shoes off and going through the detector since we were from the US and that's the way we are used to doing it. But they kept stopping us and telling us to go back, put our shoes back on, and go through again.
May 12, 2008 6:19 PM
Probably the best side-effect of the TSA's ramp-up following 9/11 was the sudden change from terse, unhelpful, discourteous, unknowledgeable agents to human, effective, courteous, knowledgeable ones. I found this remarkable at the time, but since then the pendulum has slowly and inconsistently drifted back in the other direction. Are we simply no longer engaging in the excellent training program that those initial post-9/11 employees obviously undertook? Or is it rather that we are no longer willing to offer the salaries that we did immediately after 9/11?
In either case, we travelers deserve to be treated as humans, and if the only way to do that is to spend more on salaries and/or training, I say do it.
Even better: Offer, at the cost of $1, a security line where the traveler is guaranteed to be served by one of these better-trained employees. Compared to $300 and $400 airfares, it'll feel like a drop in the bucket!
May 14, 2008 9:46 AM
I am having difficulty with one inconsistency at airports that can easily be handled. Why am I allowed to use a luggage cart in all airports except Orlando, Newark and a couple of others (that I am having trouble remembering.) Recently, I challenged TSA at one airport and they reversed this rule.
I am getting older and cannot lug my laptop and one other small bag any more, but I am forced to do so at a few airports that don't allow the carts. It sure would be helpful if this rule could be made consistent or to at least have additional carts on the other side of security.
Aside from losing the $3.00 paid for the cart with no indication that it will not be allowed through security, it is often a very long walk to my gate, especially in Newark, NJ.
One possible soultion, Pay the $3.00 for the cart, leave it at the front of security and get a token for another one on the other side where you could have "cehcked" carts ready to go.
Anyone else feel this would be helpful?
May 15, 2008 10:46 AM
I have two things, and for at least the first comment, I would like a responce.
My first comment is that very recently, my son was flying from miami to pittsburgh with his grandfather. First of all, they were both asked to show ID, in SPANISH. It is a good thing that my son spoke fluent spanish, because the tso did not speak english, and my father wouldn't have known what to do. My son is only 13, and he was asked for ID, and he had to correct 3 tso's (remember, they only spoke spanish) and was subject to additional screening because he didn't have an id on him. You should make shure the rule that anyone younger than 18 doesn't need an id is enforced, and that an international airport inside the U.S. should have some ENGLISH speaking tso's.
secondly, an easy to impliment suggestion. Many people would like more time before security to be able to take off their shoes, take things out of their bags, or to do other things. My other son has braces that he uses to help him walk, and they are difficult to take off, and I would also like this more room. I know that in many airports lengthing the checkpoint is not feasable, but what you could do is in one or two lines, across from the tables leading up to the x-rays, have some chairs that could be used. This would provide the same effect as lengthening the area before the x-rays, but in a more compact version.
May 19, 2008 2:33 PM
I want to thank the TSA employees for what they do for this country. We the American people have no idea the risk that you take on a daily basis. Please if you are an employee and you read this blog at all- which I recommend that you do not read it. Remember that you are dealing with people that already have anxiety because they are flying- We live in a country of whiners- that have completely forgotten what the concept of "liberty" and perfect union really mean anymore. I fly all the time. I put all my liquids in a bag. I take off my shoes because duh thats the rules. I can appreciate the rules changing because the threat changes. Thank you for all that you do and the changes that you are constantly making. My opinion is that TSA is doing its job- we have not had a hijacking or plane explosion since 9/11/2001. That is almost 7 years. I wish that the TSA had more authority like a police officer- maybe fine people for trying to break the rules. I think that if they did people would take them more seriously and that it would eliminate the whining. However, we do live in a great country where everyone has the right to whine.- and we all have to listen to them...God Bless America!!!
May 20, 2008 7:07 PM
I frequently travel with a laptop. Depending on which airport I'm at i can either place the laptop in a bin with its protective sleeve and my ziploc of liquids or I'm rudely informed that the laptop must be in a bin by itself. Which is it?
May 21, 2008 1:27 PM
Regarding the above comment on luggage carts -- YES! Your solution of a token/exchange setup is perfect, and should be easy enough to implement, if airports actually cared about the passenger experience. However, since they don't, here's an even more radical idea: FREE CARTS. Free carts in the ticketing area, free carts beyond security, free carts in the baggage area. This is the way it's done all over Europe, where having to pay to rent a cart for 5 minutes sounds unthinkable and appalling. So come on, America, we can do better.
May 21, 2008 11:50 PM
First of all, adding to the cart topic, it really isn't under the tsa athority, it would be good to have free carts AFTER security. This way, there would be no risk of loseing them. Second of all, I have a comment/suggestion. It would be very easy to gain access to the secure section of the airport by terrorists, by using online check in, while we law-abiding, non terrorists, can't. If it is so easy for a terrorist to get by the security checkpoint by just using a fake boarding pass, why are we not allowed to go to see our family off. Along with that, the ability to electronically check in without seeing an agent, and the fact that you do not need an ID to board a flight, this first of all, renders the no-fly list usless, and second of all, can alow someone to fly on someone elses name. By reinstating the ID check at the gate, and letting non-flyers into the secure zone (and maybe adding a security tax of 1-2 dollars to do so), the process will become safer (as ID's would be checked at the gate, and there would be more people to notice suspicious behavior in a 9/11 concous public), and fares would be lowered (as airports would charge less of a tax, as there would be more people to buy in their shops). The only change to the pre 9/11 system that would have to be made would be that people without boarding passes would only be able to bring through security one small personal item, and NO liquids (this would be less of a hassle for them, as they would be able to go and return those items to their cars, and there would be less prohibited items through the checkpoint for this same reason) For some airports (most notibly large ones like JFK), during peak times, this may be an issue, so it should be at the airport's discression. To impliment this, at smaller airports non-passengers could go through the regular line, but at medium-large airports, a one lane "well-wishers" lane could set up, and priority given to passengers.
May 22, 2008 5:19 PM
Anonymous said...
re:OK ONCE AGAIN BECAUSE IM STARTING TO BECOME ANNOYED. AIRPORT.. ARE YOU FOLLOWING ME ??
.........................
I don't give a Rats Rearend if your getting annoyed.
Airport..Are you following me.
A person had a weapon on the ramp area of a supposedly secure area.
TSA is tasked to make sure that Civil Aviation is safe.
TSA failed, plan and simple.
If your not checking everyone entering the operations area then there is no reason to check anyone.
TSA=Theater
Not Security!
May 7, 2008 4:47 PM
to this hard of hearing/seeing person. if tsa is on the checkpoint and an employee gets through to the ramp with a weapon. how exactly is that tsa's fault? that person only has to swipe his badge to get through downstairs. airport employees have the benefit of going wherever they please as they are granted permission with the issue of their badge. im not understanding at all how that is tsa's fault though.
the only other option would be to screen everyone at the same time at the same checkpoint but keeping in mind the thousand of employees PLUS the hundreds of employees who all clock in for work at the same time. means they would bump passengers ALL THE WAY to the back. but then again you would just come back here and complain about being bumped by airport employees causing you to miss your plane
May 27, 2008 6:37 AM
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