Remarks With Recipients of LEAD Scholarships

PRESIDENT DAVID ARNOLD: Good evening and welcome. It’s a pleasure for us to welcome all of you to the American University in Cairo (AUC). It’s a pleasure for me to welcome the wonderful LEAD [30 recipients of USAID-funded Leadership in Education and Development] students again for the second time in 2 days. It’s great to see you. I think we’re cutting into your study time with all of these special programs. But I think tonight is a particularly special occasion because we have the opportunity to welcome to our campus the new Under Secretary for Public Diplomacy and Public Affairs the Honorable Karen Hughes. It’s noteworthy to mention that Under Secretary Hughes was sworn in just 2 weeks ago so she’s very new in her job. But she is no stranger to the world of communication and public diplomacy. She has had extensive experience and I think is regarded by all as being the consummate communications professional. And I think there’s no better set of qualifications for the challenging job that she has taken on now as the new Under Secretary. Joining her here today and on this trip to Egypt, her first visit here in her new capacity, is Dina Habib Powell to my right who is the new -- also new Assistant Secretary of State for Educational and Cultural Affairs. While she’s new in her job she is not new to Egypt. She has a very special relationship with Egypt and with AUC. She was born here before moving to the United States when she was 4 years old. She told me she did not speak a word of English when she went to live with her family in Dallas, Texas and her mother Hoda Soliman was actually a graduate of AUC, so this is the daughter of an AUC alumnus. And we’re delighted to welcome her home. Ahellan we Sahelan.

ASSISTANT SECRETARY DINA POWELL: Thank you.

PRESIDENT ARNOLD: We also, accompanying the Under Secretary and Assistant Secretary is our colleague here in Cairo Mr. Stuart Jones who is the Charge d'Affaires at the U.S. Embassy here in Cairo. Stuart worked in Turkey before and has recently moved here with his family and we’re delighted to welcome him here tonight. I think as many of you know Under Secretary Hughes has worked closely with President Bush before he was ever the president dating back to his days in the State House as governor of Texas. She’s worked in the White House holding very senior government positions and is now assuming the senior responsibility in the State Department. She is here to engage in a dialogue and I am now going to turn it over to her to initiate that dialogue. Welcome, we’re delighted to have you here.

UNDER SECRETARY HUGHES: Well thank you so much President Arnold. It’s wonderful to be here at the American University of Cairo. I’ve heard about this wonderful institution for years and so it’s great to actually be here and especially to see all of you all because you’re our future. And the reason I took this job is because I believe so strongly in the importance of fostering a sense of greater understanding between my country and the people of Egypt and people throughout the world and people of different countries and cultures and faiths because I think it’s really important to our shared future together. And that’s why I agreed to do this job. I’m here to talk a little bit about public diplomacy and I wanted to tell you first of all that public diplomacy is really people driven. It’s about people and it’s about our policies. Because we recognize that all policies affect people and their lives. I thought we might start off by telling you -- I’d like to hear a little bit about you and I thought I’d tell you a little bit about myself. I am a, you heard my title but that’s the fancy stuff. I’m really a working mom and I have a grown daughter and a 10-year-old granddaughter and I have a son who just went off to college. I just took him to college just like you all last week and so that means that I know a little bit from him about text messaging. But I’m not cool enough to know how to do it. I know it’s important and I know y’all are really good at it but I’m not. One of the things we were talking about on the plane over here today is that each of us as an American has a unique American story. In my case I’m the granddaughter of Pennsylvania coalminer and a Kentucky railroad engineer. And my dad was in the United States Army all his life. My mom worked at home rearing her two girls and I started off my career -- I went to college and wasn’t sure what I wanted to do. When I, like many of you may feel, I don’t know if you all know yet what you really would like to do after school, but I wasn’t sure and I started off as an English major and then on the way I was intrigued. My curiosity was peaked by journalism so I started my career as a journalist. And worked in television journalism and then gradually I found myself falling in love with the political process because I realized that the impact that the decisions that were made in the political process had on people’s lives and that’s what drew me to this in the very first place. So that’s a little bit about me. I’d like to thank your Charge for being here today. I’d like to let Dina say just a couple of words about herself.

DINA POWELL: Thank you. Ahelan we Sahelan.

UNDER SECRETARY HUGHES: I want to introduce two other people that I brought with me and they’re United States citizens. And I’m a firm believer that, we met this afternoon with a group of young Egyptian students, former high school students, now university students who came to the United States to visit. Once I think once people come to the United States to see for themselves, they see a very different side of our country. One of the students told me you learn that you just can’t look from the outside in you have to look at the inside of a person’s heart. And so I’m a big believer that some of our citizens are some of our best representatives. So I brought with me Kareema Duab who is a PHD student in Arabic Linguistics in Washington at Georgetown--is it Georgetown University in Washington--and Bill O’Brien who is a teacher in Wisconsin. And Bill was recommended for this trip by -- many people know President Bush is a Republican, he’s a member of the Republican Political Party. I am a, work for the President and had been a Republican. Bill was recommended for this trip by one of our Democratic Senators, Russ Feingold. Because I believe it’s very important that in public diplomacy we work in a very bipartisan way. It’s not about the political party. It’s about our country and about American and our relationship with Egypt and with the rest of the world. So with that said I thought I’d just break the ice with introducing ourselves a little but what I’d really like to hear from is each of you and I’d like just have you quickly if you would introduce yourself, tell me what you’re studying and maybe you can tell me one hope for the future or one dream you have for the future. Whether it’s something you want to do or something you want to maybe you want to have a child or just one of your hopes for the future. And then we’ll start from after that we’ll start, I’ll be glad to take any questions or comments or thought that you have.

(Introduction of participants)

UNDER SECRETARY HUGHES: Thank you. It’s amazing as I look out on your faces and I realize you’re all unique individuals and yet I think if I was sitting on a college campus almost anywhere in my country the United States of America I would hear almost the same answers I just heard -- that I would hear young people who wanted to be successful and help their country. People who wanted to serve others, people who wanted to own their own businesses. People who wanted to start advertising companies or develop a new invention or get involved in international development or foreign affairs and so it’s a reminder I think even though we live a long way away, there are a lot of things in common with our young people and your young people. With that I’d love to just throw the floor open for you all to talk with me about anything that’s on your mind. What you worry about, what you hope for, what you think you might have in common with America, what you think might divide our two countries. Our country as you know is a very strong ally and partner with Egypt. We respect your very rich heritage and culture and we had a wonderful opportunity this afternoon to tour and see some of your wonderful cultural heritage. You are the cradle of civilization and I think -- I told the press on my airplane today that I think we’re arriving here at a time of promise in Egypt. A time when there are some economic reforms under way. A time when -- how many of you are 18? A couple of …Were you able to vote? Any of you vote? Is it 19? You voted? And did you have a choice of candidates on the ballot? Were there several names on the ballot for you to choose from? That’s the first time that’s happened in the history of Egypt. Now the election was a step – we’re still we were hoping it’s a step that can be built on in the parliamentary elections that the candidates will have more access to the media that would be more opportunity for a campaign that they’ll be international observers allowed to observe the parliamentary elections but there was a step that for the first time. You and the other people of Egypt who went into the polls had more than one candidate on the ballot. And that’s step toward participation in the democratic process and so we think we’re arriving here in Egypt in a time of promise. On the other hand we know we face -- America faces a public diplomacy challenge here. A lot of opinion poles show that Egyptians many of them while they admire some things about America also worry about others so I just wanted to invite you to talk with me about any of those things. Yes.

QUESTION: My question is what is the image the American citizen has about the Egyptian citizen especially women in Egypt without involving any government or political issues.

UNDER SECRETARY HUGHES: I think the American people have a very good image of the Egyptian people. Everywhere I go there are a number of Egyptian Americans. In fact, I travel with Dina so everyone who’s an Egyptian American is very proud of Dina and so they always come up and say "I’m from Egypt too." Egyptians are really very fully integrated into American culture. We were in LA recently and a woman was at a university there and introduced herself to us and said you know I’m from Egypt too. And I Dina I’ll refer to you since you probably hear a lot more of it but I think by enlarge Americans have a very positive image of Egypt. I do think one of my goals in my new job is to encourage Americans to study and learn more about other cultures and other countries. I’m going to be encouraging young people from my country to come to places like Egypt to participate in exchange programs. Because I really think that’s the key to fostering greater understanding between our people in our country and people in different countries across the world.

DINA POWELL: I’ll just add one thing since you asked specifically about Egyptian women. And I’ll tell you a funny story. My husband is American. And I overheard him one time saying, "I thought it would be tough to marry a strong Texas woman, but you can’t imagine how tough it is to marry a strong Egyptian woman.

(Laughter)

DINA POWELL: So he, he knows now very well, he’s married into the family that how strong Egyptian women are. How much they’re leaders in their families and leaders in society. And I always talk about how the Egyptian woman is the role model not just in the Middle East but all around the world. And as you well know, Egyptian women lead in so many areas in business, in culture. Here in Egypt but all around the world, so there’s a high regard for the Egyptian woman in the United States and I’m always proud to say I’m an Egyptian-American because of that.

QUESTION: How does the political aspect as the other leaders; what’s our duties and our expectations what are expected from us as from as a successful politician from you as an Egyptian woman from expectations of us as leaders? Thank you.

UNDER SECRETARY HUGHES: Expectations for you as young leaders? Well I would hope and you’ve I think one of most important things is that you pursue an education. We and you’re obviously doing that by your presence here at this great university. It’s so important. Education is really the key to opportunity to building bridges of respect and tolerance to being able to better yourself and take advantage of the opportunities that you’ll have in your life. I would hope that at a time when our world faces common threat of terrorism that you would join and work to speak out against the killing -- the taking of innocent civilian lives and indiscriminant killing that is a part of terrorism today. That you would work to build a better future -- a future of hope rather than a future of indiscriminate, as I said, killing because it’s so important at this time. Terrorism a lot of people look at terrorism and say well it’s -- America is concerned about terrorism. Well, as you in Egypt know, you’ve experienced terrorist attacks yourselves and you know terrorism is not just a threat to America. It’s a threat to civilized people in Egypt and a threat to civilized people the world over so I hope you would joint to speak out against hate and intolerance. That you would speak up for enlightenment rather than incitement.

I was talking earlier today that the fact that those of you who are interested in going into the media if any of you are I think the media has a responsibility to try to inform rather than incite and to try to allow people to make their own minds up rather than to influence the way people think. I think leaders have that obligation as well to serve people honestly and to be faithful and responsible, to be responsible in the way you live your own life and to try to make an impact on those around you. I was very touched that several of you mentioned serving others because I think that is so noble to want to help to build a better life not only for yourself and your own families when you have them but for your community and your country. And I think that’s something -- that spirit of service is very much a part of my country as well. Many Americans volunteer to help the needy, to help to homeless, to feed the hungry and that’s a part of our life in America and part of our culture many people feel it’s a part of their religious duty. And that’s people of different faiths that’s our Jewish citizens, our Muslim citizens, our Christian citizens, people of all different faiths and those with no faith at all feel it’s a part of life in America to give yourself in service. Both of your time and of your money. We saw an enormous outpouring -- by the way I want to thank the people of Egypt for your kind generosity to my country during our hour of need during the aftermath of the hurricane -- the horrible hurricane we had in America. Do you have any thoughts on that? Yes sir.

QUESTION: You were saying so many wars (inaudible) and sent many of high official soldiers to many places all over the world to save the world from the dangers of terrorism as it was played. Do you think that our part of this war society plans to end terrorism all over the world because I think ending terrorism is not or terrorism is not just specified in one place all over the world so as a whole world should cooperate with each other to end terrorism and living in peace I think.

UNDER SECRETARY HUGHES: Let me just talk a little bit about what happened in my country on September 11 and what a shock it was for the people of my country. I went to work on September 10 at the White House. We had been at the White House about six and a half months. I -- the President had just been inaugurated in January I had -- our entire campaign -- during the entire in America when the candidates run for office they’re asked thousands of questions. The reporters that you see in the back of the room, some of them were with us and they ask question after question after question and most of the questions on the 2000 presidential campaign were about domestic policy in America and education and health care and most of the questions -- I say that to say I never expected to wake up in the days after September 11 and find that America felt the need to go to war to defend our self against an enemy. The attacks of September 11 were a horrifying shock to the American people. We’ve only been attacked twice--at Pearl Harbor and then on the morning of September 11.

We have been attacked in our homeland only twice, at Pearl Harbor and then on the morning of September 11. I can still remember and I know Dina can, how frightened all our children were, how people couldn't imagine that people would fly airplanes into buildings full of innocent people. The President, in the immediate days after September 11, deciding that having had experience to acts of terror previously, the USS Cole, and the World Trade Centers, we had been through other attacks, not as large as that morning of September 11, but that we had to do something to identify those responsible and to strike back. And so, when we determined that Al-Qaida was responsible for the attacks of September 11, the President gave his speech in which he gave the Taliban an opportunity to turn over the leaders of Al-Qaida or face consequences. They refused to do so and therefore faced consequences. Subsequent to that, America felt we had to look at threats in the world in a new light of September 11 and the biggest threat, I think, to a bright future for young people here in Egypt and to young people in my own country, is the prospect that terrorists who want to destroy on a massive scale will be able to access weapons of mass destruction. The President was very worried about that prospect, particularly as he looked at the threats in the world, he was particularly worried about Saddam Hussein who had a history of using weapons of mass destruction when he gassed his own people, who was continuing to shoot at our pilots as we enforced the no-fly zone over Iraq, who was a destabilizing force in the region.

The President made a very difficult decision -- you know it's funny, as young people, if you just watch or listen to some of the discussions -- it sometimes makes it sound as if somebody just wakes up in the morning and decides to go to war. Well, I can assure you it is not like that. The world had worked for twelve years to try and get Saddam Hussein to live up to his international obligations. He had kicked out inspectors, the world had tried sanctions, they had tried the carrot, the Oil-for Food program -- they had tried. We felt -- the President felt -- when he had to go into Iraq that we were at the end of our rope and that we had to, after he had challenged Saddam Hussein to come clean and Saddam Hussein failed to do that that we had to go into Iraq. We made that decision regardless of how -- and I know many countries across the world disagreed with that decision -- but regardless of how you felt about that decision I think most leaders in the world now agree on two things: that the world is safer without Saddam Hussein in power, the people of Iraq are better off and the world is safer, and that it is very important that we allow Iraq to emerge from this current situation united and democratic, where its people are able to govern themselves. So we think that is very important and I think one of the things that I hope you all -- that I might ask you all to think about as students and as smart questioning young people is what is happening in Iraq today. And what is happening in Iraq today is you have a group of insurgents who are killing fellow Muslims, randomly and indiscriminately. I just read a story yesterday where a suicide bomber was in a bus and he attracted people onto the bus taking them to Friday prayers and then blew them up. And they were fellow Muslims, and they were civilians. And so, I think it is very important that people throughout this part of the world understand the situation in Iraq today and try to speak up and work with us to try to end this indiscriminate killing.

QUESTION: (Inaudible) of nuclear weapons in Iran and if in Syria with another war (inaudible) what outcomes like Iraq? (Inaudible.)

UNDER SECRETARY HUGHES: Well the world is very concerned about Iran's failure to comply with its international obligations. It has failed to do what it said it would do, and the United States of America is working in the way that the world has said it would like us to work in multilateral ways with the EU-3, to try to bring that situation to resolution. It's a very serious situation because Iran has failed to comply with its obligations, and as I said previously, the biggest threat to your future, and the biggest threat to the future of children throughout the world, is the prospect of nuclear proliferation and that nuclear weapons could get in the hands of terrorists.

Now the situation in Syria, we -- as Secretary Rice said the other day as she was asked about the regime change -- we are saying we want the regime itself that's in place to change its ways, to stop interfering in Lebanon, to stop fueling the insurgency in Iraq and to seal its borders so it will not fuel the insurgency and it will not help perpetuate the, again, indiscriminate killing that is going on in Iraq today.

QUESTION: Somebody said after the hurricane that for the beginning of the end of theory of one super power in the world. If America can't protect itself how can it lead us? What's your opinion?

UNDER SECRETARY HUGHES: Well this is a time of great challenge for America. We witnessed a natural disaster of staggering proportions. It's difficult -- I have not toured the hurricane site myself, but I talked with President Bush and with Secretary Rice who both saw it. It's difficult to describe the magnitude of the disaster and as the President has said, obviously we did not get help to people who needed help fast enough and we is at the Federal, the state and at the local level. We all saw those images and they unfortunately, the people who were unable to get out of New Orleans when the evacuation was ordered tended to be the oldest, the children, the handicapped, African Americans who lived in those communities, and they were the ones who unfortunately were not able to get there -- to get out when the evacuation was ordered.

I want to assure you that Americans, our hearts, ached for those people as well and we have tried to learn the lessons of being better prepared. When the latest hurricane, Rita, hit my home state in Texas just over the last couple of days, I think we did a much better job of mobilizing, we learned the lessons from Katrina, and did a much better job of mobilizing the buses to get people who were not able to get out of the hurricane to help them get out better. But I want to reiterate that I think everyone was well intentioned. People were trying. The President of the United States, who is responsible for every American citizen, including the ones who were stuck in the Superdome and at the convention center, cares about those people, and he wanted to get help to them and he kept saying why are we giving -- he wanted to get help to them more quickly, so the intentions were good. We need to look at it. He has called for an investigation into why the results, why didn't it happen as fast as it should have, why weren't those people rescued earlier, and again we are trying to learn the lessons of that.

I do want to say that I saw in newspapers around the world some indications that maybe the help didn't come as quickly because many of the victims were African American and I want to assure you nothing could be further from the truth. My heart was breaking at those elderly people who were not able to get out as quickly as we wanted to get them out. I went down in my own neighborhood, I was home that weekend in Austin and the city put out a call for volunteers, because we had victims from the hurricane coming to Texas to be sheltered in our convention center, and there were people of every race and every background and I saw people -- drove up in cars with trunks full of new things they had gone and purchased to donate to the hurricane victims and they also drove up with their back seats full of old towels and sheets and pillowcases that they had gone through their own homes to give away to try and help people in need, so this was a great challenge. The storm was a staggering natural disaster and one of the good things about democracy is that we had reporters, we have a free press, and so we had reporters down there covering, and you saw the images and reporters saying where is the help and where are the rescuers and the government now has to answer for that and has to be accountable for that. There will be investigations and we will try to learn from that what we can do to improve and I think that's already starting even before we've had investigations.

I just want to add one thing, which is it was such a horrific disaster and some of my friends lived in New Orleans and I was so worried about them, but I also think it showed that America needs help sometimes too. That America isn't always perfect, and I think that's an important thing that I hear a lot of government officials say, but it's true. I'm very proud of the principles of America, of the people of America, but I am glad to see that we're not too proud like the President did to thank people like Egypt, the Egyptian people, for helping us, because I think ultimately we are a world community and none of us in the world community is perfect and when we reach out and take help from each other, and when we help each other I think that is ultimately what a future of hope will look like and it is what I hope for, too.

QUESTION: I ask a question about something related to us as lead scholars. This scholarship has a lot of benefits for us as we have high standard education and a chance to meet special leaders like you. But what is the benefit that you will get from this scholarship?

UNDER SECRETARY HUGHES: The American people? Well I hope we benefit by helping young people like you all throughout the world to become educated and we think that's a benefit. We believe as Americans that it is very important for young people to be educated, to have opportunity, to have a chance to achieve your dreams. I heard some very eloquent dreams here. That's really the heart of the American dream, is that in America, that you can work hard, you can get an education and you have an opportunity to improve yourselves. We don't think we own that aspiration. We want that aspiration for people across the world. We want that aspiration for you and your neighbors. We want -- we think that fosters a more peaceful world, we think that fosters a better understanding between our country and your country. It's amazing to me, as I go around the world, when I traveled with President Bush and met leaders around the world, how many of them have either studied in America, or participated in an American exchange program. We have that happen all the time and I think what that shows is that helps foster respect and understanding so maybe thirty years from now you'll be sitting up here talking with an American audience and I'll be retired somewhere, but you'll be talking with someone about your experience as a scholar, as a lead scholar, and how that gave you an opportunity to pursue an education and have a better life for yourself and I hope that happens.

QUESTION: In your point-of-view, and in Americans view as one of the most humanly developed countries in the world. What do you think would be more effective in the development for Egypt, as a country? Would it be focusing on the human development as for creating a humanly developed country or would it be focusing on the main current problems that Egypt is facing such as democracy, president elections, as mentioned by the U.S. President of States?

UNDER SECRETARY HUGHES: Well, I think there are a number of different things, first of all, as the President talked about in his second inaugural address, he believes that freedom is very important. Let me back up a little bit and explain that a lot of times people ask me about our policies and why won't you change your policies. We have had a very fundamental change in American policy toward the Middle East and that is outlined in the President's second inaugural address, which is one of the most important speeches of his presidency. And that is that, for as Secretary Rice has said, for about sixty years we sort of turned a blind eye to tyranny in the Middle East in the interest of stability. We thought that if we had stability that that would be best for the world and we would have security and it turned out that we got neither. And so, what the President recognized in his second inaugural and talked about is that what that led to is conditions that gave rise to a malignancy that was so deep and so pervasive that it would lead people, young people, who should have had a bright future, to get on an airplane and crash that airplane into buildings full of innocent people. So we believe we have to create space for young people to have an opportunity to achieve their legitimate aspirations, to become educated, to be involved in the political process.

That's why the President has talked about freedom as something that is not America's gift to the world, but is something that is our creators gift to every man and woman and every one of you in the world and so we think it is very important to have a political reform agenda to allow people to begin -- people the world over --you all want to be free to express yourselves, don't you? Do you want to be free to speak up? Do you want to be able to choose your leaders? Do you want to be involved in the future of your country? Of course you do, I see a lot of nodding heads. People the world over want that and so we think it is very important to work for that.

We also think development is extremely important and here in Egypt our USAID mission has moved from what they call from "aid to trade." That is while we still give aid for projects like the one I visited today to help Egypt restore and maintain its great cultural heritage, we also are trying to make investments in areas that help develop job opportunities that will have create skills, job training programs, things that help young people develop their skills. Scholarship programs like this one to help young people be educated. We applaud the progress that Egypt is making on economic reforms. You've made some very good progress on economic reform. So it's really a package. People need to be more free to express themselves, to participate fully in society, to have a legitimate outlet for their concerns, and their grievances, and their aspirations and people also need to have the economic development is also key so people can see a hope for a better future for themselves and their families.

QUESTION: Concerning the categorization of different countries in the world, why do the first world countries, or at least most of them, insist on interfering in the third world countries affairs instead of just offering help and guidance?

UNDER SECRETARY HUGHES: Are you referring specifically to America?

QUESTION: Just developed countries in general. Many of them --

UNDER SECRETARY HUGHES: What type of interference are you talking about?

QUESTION: They interfere in most of the third world countries' affairs, political, economic, not just helping them or offering help and guidance.

UNDER SECRETARY HUGHES: Well I think what you maybe referring to are the millennium development goals, is that what you're referring to, where most of our countries feel like in order to help this development we need to make sure countries are taking steps that lead toward good governance, toward getting rid of corruption, toward--in other words -- we believe that it is important to reward and respect those countries that are doing the right things to help make lives better for their citizens, not countries that are siphoning off money to corruption or money to enrich leaders or money that is not actually getting to worthwhile projects that help the people. So the millennium challenge and development fund is designed to reward countries that are taking the steps that we know will lead toward greater opportunities for people, that they are investing in reform, that they are engaging in good governance, that they are fighting corruption, that they are insisting on the rule of law. No one wants to impose on other countries. We do want to say that if we are going to spend money and help with money that we want it to be used effectively in a way that actually helps people.

QUESTION: Okay, back to the Iraqi issue. After like three years in Iraq and after getting rid of the Saddam Hussein regime, some people started to say that the USA is trying to impose democracy on the Iraqi people and have failed on its attempt to help the Iraqi people and to make Iraq better. Not only this, this Iraq is in a civil war between Sunnis and Shiites, so what do you think about this?

UNDER SECRETARY HUGHES: Well I think that ignores the terrific courage that has been shown by the Iraqi people, who nine million of them went out to vote in defiance of terror threats -- that they would be killed if they did so. They have elected a government; they have worked on a draft constitution and now have an opportunity to vote on that draft constitution in the middle of October. Iraqi troops are risking their lives at great risk. Many of them have been, unfortunately, murdered by the insurgents. But they are standing up at great risk and saying they want to enlist in the army and fight for the future of Iraq. And we are working for a unified Iraq. We want a unified Iraq. We worked very hard to partner and help during the -- along with the United Nations --during the drafting of the constitution to try to make sure that all parties have a voice in the drafting of the constitution which we think is a good constitution that will protect the rights of Iraqis. So, I think really, when you look at Iraq, the citizens are making very good progress on the road to democracy. The big stumbling block right now is the insurgency that is increasingly engaging in very indiscriminate killing of innocents and it’s killing for, unfortunately, killing sake and it involves fellow Muslims. It’s something that I think countries in this region and people of good conscience throughout the world should speak up about.

PRESIDENT ARNOLD: We have time for one more question.

UNDER SECRETARY HUGHES: Okay --

PRESIDENT ARNOLD: You get to choose --

UNDERSECRETARY HUGHES: Oh my goodness. Who's had their hand up the longest? Who is dying to ask something? You in the back of the room --

QUESTION: As our representatives of our countries call for and fight for respecting human rights, how can you face questions, directed to you, about violating human rights in Guantanamo and Abu Ghraib by the American army? Thank you.

UNDER SECRETARY HUGHES: Thank you very much. Like you, I was horrified when I saw the abuse that took place at Abu Ghraib. It was horrible. It was -- I think most Americans who saw that were terribly sickened. Now, being a democracy, and let me assure you what happened there is totally against the policy of our government. The President has made it clear he expects all prisoners to be treated humanely, they should never be tortured, they should never be mocked, they should be treated humanely and the President has made that very clear. Being a democracy does not mean that we're perfect or that crimes don't take place and what happened in Abu Ghraib was a crime. Those who were involved, have been, after investigations, after their rights were taken into account have been charged with crimes and in some cases convicted of crimes. And so being a democracy does not insulate you from problems like that. It just says that you will be open and accountable for them. The world saw what happened there, the American officials were asked about what happened there. I know here in this part of the world, one of the most widely watched TV of this was when Secretary Rumsfeld was called to Capitol Hill and interviewed by Congress and held to account and asked about what happened there. So, again, being a democracy does not mean that crimes won't sometimes take place, but I can assure you that what happened there does not represent my country or the people of America, they were crimes and have been treated as such.

Now Guantanamo is a very, very different and very difficult situation. What we have in Guantanamo is a situation that we have never faced before. We have enemy combatants, people who were on the battle field trying to kill our men and women in uniform, who don't wear a uniform of any other country, who have never signed the international conventions that govern prisoners of war, who swear allegiance to nothing except for the doctrine that they want to kill. They want to kill Americans, they want to kill people of different faiths, they want to even kill their fellow Muslims who don't agree with their interpretation of their faith. It is a very difficult situation and one that I can assure you is very widely discussed and frequently reviewed and loudly debated within America itself and within our administration as to how to best handle this situation. But I want to remind you, these are not young people who were protesting, these are not people who spoke out against the government. These are killers who were on the battlefield trying to kill American men and women in uniform and Iraqi citizens and Afghan citizens. And so we are treating them in compliance with international standards. They are being treated humanely. They have the opportunity to worship. They have been given copies of the Koran and are allowed to heed the call to prayer --the call to prayer is issued at Guantanamo. And, international organizations, including the International Red Cross have been allowed and a number of media representatives, have been allowed to visit to review the situation and to monitor the situation. In fact, I think the Red Cross is there now on a 24-basis, is that right? I believe they have the ability to be there on a 24-hour basis. So I agree, I understand that it's a difficult situation, because it is a different kind of war than we have ever faced before.

PRESIDENT ARNOLD: I think we're going to need to bring this to a close. I want to thank our guests, Under Secretary Hughes and Assistant Secretary Powell for being with us. Welcome Charge Jones.

I think you have a sense of why we think this is such a special group of AUC students. They are a little different from some of their colleagues in that they come from all over Egypt, not just from Cairo, and I think they are also a real testament to the excellence that you find when you reach out to talent pools beyond just the urban elites of Cairo because these are folks have come up through the government schools, the public schools, and who, in some cases I think are finding studying in Cairo is a bit like studying abroad. I think this is an unusual experience for many of them, they've adjusted beautifully, they're doing wonderfully in their studies and we want to thank them for taking time out of doing their homework tonight to come and meet our very special guests.

UNDER SECRETARY HUGHES: Well if the future of our world is in your hands, then I feel much better about it. So, thank you all so much for your time and I look forward to the opportunity to talk with you personally a little bit more outside.

PRESIDENT ARNOLD: We will adjourn to outside. Thank you all very much.