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From: "Andres Muro" <AndresM@epcc.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <nifl-esl@literacy.nifl.gov>
Subject: [NIFL-ESL:9382] Re: Accept English Only donation?
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Tanya, et al:
I apologize if I called anyone a fascist. It wasn't my intention. I think that the rhetoric itself is fascist. You said that a lot of Americans resent immigrants for not learning the language, etc. I don't think that Americans as individuals are fascist, but the anti-immigrant rhetoric is a form of fascism, and it is wrong.
Fascist rhetoric succeeds in climates of fear and ignorance and it is disseminated by political groups w/ specific agendas. They are not borne out of individuals. In fact, research has shown that the majority of Americans are indifferent towards immigrants but their indifference is swayed during times of economic crises when politicians use immigrants as scapegoats. Why don't they vote? because a lot of them are not citizens. Even if they vote, they don't campaign or contribute generously.
As I said before, the rhetoric can work in a climate of ignorance and misinformation. Recently a poll in California showed that 70% of those polled believed that they were in contact with nature. Seventy percent also believed that, nowadays, humans live among dinosaurs. Another poll regarding the most recent military conflict showed that most people in support of the armed invasion thought that the US was doing this in retaliation for the 9-11 attacks.
You mean that polls show that the majority of the polled think that we live among dinosaurs and support an armed conflict for the wrong reason? How could this be? Well, lets look at the facts:
According to the National Adult Literacy Survey, 90 million Americans adults would score in the lowest to levels of a five level literacy test. This is below the literacy skills of a high school graduate. Approximately 40 million adults can read simple words and short sentences. Another 50 million can read and make sense out of short paragraphs consisting of simple sentences. So, essentially, we buy the rhetoric disseminated in the public media (mostly TV) because we are unable to read critically.
So, we live in a climate of ignorance. During economic hard times, it is easy to fear and blame what we don't know, the immigrant. So like you say Tanya, many Americans resent immigrants because they come to the US and they refuse to learn the language.
However, these Americans don't know where the orange, apple, grape juice, and milk that they drink comes from while they are having breakfast. They also don't know where the lettuce and the chicken that made that caesar's salad came from. They also don't know where the beef and pork that they ate for dinner came from. They don't know who cans their veggies, bottles their beer, kills the cows and pigs and harvests the oranges, apples, lettuce, grapes, etc. The reason they don't know this is because when politicians badmouth the immigrants for not learning the language, they forget to mention that the same immigrants live in atrocious conditions , with no health care, access to education, public schools or other services harvesting the food that we eat every day. So, when people thank god for their food, they can also thank the poor immigrant.
There is a secret among corporate heads. The Mexican workforce is considered one of the most productive workforce. However, most people are not aware of this, because nobody disseminates this message. However, the media has been fast at disseminating the ever popular image of the guy with the big sombrero and a bottle in his hand, napping, with his back on a saguaro. Of course, nobody has ever seen this, since putting your back on a Saguaro will hurt your back. However, if you were to walk into a garment factory in El Paso, you would have seen the thousands of Mexican women making the clothes that the people of this country wore. This women never got welfare, and worked for low wages in atrocious conditions with no retirement packages. When NAFTA took their jobs to Mexico, these women, many in their 50s and 60s were stripped of their livelihoods with no alternatives. when social services suggested that they sought welfare, they would start to cry. They wanted to work.
The media, politicians, and groups like English only are quick to portrait the laziness of the migrant and blame the economic and cultural crises for them. Maybe they should also remind us where our food comes from,
Andres
>>> ttweeton@comcast.net 09/02/03 09:17PM >>>
I don't remember who the statement came from, but the resentment towards
immigrants who don't leaner English is a form of fascism. It is trying to
impose one person's beliefs upon "the other".
Andres I NEVER said that I believe in the English Only movement. Please
don't insinuate this and put words in my mouth. If I felt that way I
wouldn't be in the business I am in!
Of course you know that I said many Americans are resentful towards the
immigrants who don't learn English. You don't have to like that statement,
but it is reality . I Why do you say I am imposing beliefs?? I am just
stating facts. Why are you trying to deny how many people feel?? You
Andres are sounding very resentful yourself. I hear from these Americans
who make these kinds negative of comments to me very often. . If you feel
that the resentment statement is untrue and unjustified and is of a
fascist mentality then you are calling a whopping number of Americans
fascist. I don't think they would care for that label particularly, AND
would find you ungrateful . Your statement isn't particularly
constructive. It starts us down a slippery slope............. of name
calling. Isn't it for all of us to figure out a solution? Not to sling
mud?? I have always been for finding solutions. Understanding the problems
on BOTH sides and finding the solutions is the only way to go. Tanya
----- Original Message -----
From: "Andres Muro" <AndresM@epcc.edu>
To: "Multiple recipients of list" <nifl-esl@literacy.nifl.gov>
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2003 4:30 PM
Subject: [NIFL-ESL:9369] Re: Accept English Only donation?
> I am not pointing fingers at anyone in particular. However, I am claiming
that the rhetoric of English only is fascist. It starts with the premise
that immigrants come to the country, take advantage of everything that
America offers but refuse to learn "the language". Someone earlier stated
that the refusal of immigrants to learn the language created resentment. I
don't remember who the statement came from, but the resentment towards
immigrants who don't leaner English is a form of fascism. It is trying to
impose one person's beliefs upon "the other".
>
> >>> fyi@americanliteracy.com 09/02/03 11:45AM >>>
> > This is starting to sound like Hitler's "Mein Kampf" ("My Struggle",
not sure how to
> > spell it). However, the rhetoric is the same.
>
> Andres & all,
>
> (Hello, moderator. Anyone home?) When you say that "this is starting to
sound like Hitler's 'Mein Kampf'" what particularly are u referring to? Give
us a quote. When u go
> to the extreme of saying that someone is starting to sound like Hitler, it
seems like u are playing the racist/fascist card, especially when u don't
name names or quote any quotes. Are u saying that Tanya is a fascist? or are
u saying that Tanya is 'beginning
> to look a lot like nazi'. No wonder the conservatives in our ranks don't
speak up. It's a chiller. Indeed, i am chilled to the bone at the prospect
of now being titled xenophobe
> (or worse) for defending T.
>
> Never-the-less,
>
> Joe
> > Hitler starts by saying that in the beginning, he didn't hate the
jews. He just
> > noticed that they were different. They had different customs, live in
their own
> > communities, spoke differently, had a different religion, etc and took
advantage of
> > the German economy. He also noticed that they refused to live, act and
behave like
> > "true Germans". He claims that he would go and talk to them and tell
them to ,
> > but they refused, continuing to live their different ways. He felt
that this was
> > detrimental to Germany, and eventually he started murdering millions
of them.
>
> Chilling.
>
> > same rhetoric is being applied to immigrants. Some Americans claim
that they don't
> > hate immigrants, but that they act differently. America offers
immigrants the
> > opportunity to change, and to be "good immigrants" but they refuse.
So, Americans
> > start resenting them for behaving differently.
>
>
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