Return-Path: <nifl-womenlit@literacy.nifl.gov> Received: from literacy (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by literacy.nifl.gov (8.9.3/8.9.0.Beta5/980425bjb) with SMTP id MAA06625; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 12:33:47 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 12:33:47 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <01JO3SAG6R169H1SBZ@mala.bc.ca> Errors-To: alcrsb@langate.gsu.edu Reply-To: nifl-womenlit@literacy.nifl.gov Originator: nifl-womenlit@literacy.nifl.gov Sender: nifl-womenlit@literacy.nifl.gov Precedence: bulk From: nonesuch@mala.bc.ca To: Multiple recipients of list <nifl-womenlit@literacy.nifl.gov> Subject: [NIFL-WOMENLIT:652] Re: Men's involvement X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0c -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Status: OR I missed the beginning of this discussion; however, I come back to the question "what is normal?" It seems unlikely that it is ever normal for women to discuss being battered in a mixed group of men and women. I am reminded of an ESL program we had here for students from Japan. For several years, only young women came, all from the same all-female schools in Japan. A component of music and singing was developed as part of the ESL program. One year a few young men were added to the course, and the singing was dropped, because it was thought they wouldn't like to sing. It seems "normal" in that case was what males liked to do, not females. When I was editing Making Connections I had long talks with the woman who wrote the chapter on safer sex. She was adamant that her material be used with women only. The chapter talked about women having some control over their sex life, refusing sex if possible when the man refused to wear a condom, and women being generally assertive around sexual issues. The author of the chapter said that if you want to get men to practice safer sex, you do not talk about women having rights; instead you talk about their self-interest. As well, it may be unsafe for women to talk assertively about sex in a mixed class when they have to leave the class but continue in contact with those same men outside the class. At 10:18 AM 4/6/2000 -0400, Ansongreen@aol.com wrote: <SNIP> >Creating "women only" topics seems really detrimental to the >construction of a sense of "normalcy" for learners, especially learners who feel silenced or disenfranchised by violence (Be it physical abuse or abusive systems.) Polarizing "us and them" "mixed classroom/ women's classroom" seems to make sense at first, but is this really creating a normal environment for learners to work with the issues? <SNIP> This discussion has been interesting because it echoes those of years ago about separatism in the lesbian community. People went around and around about it, for many of the same reasons we've been talking about here -- that need to explore power imbalances in a safe space, men automatically taking over leadership roles in mostly- or formerly-all-women organizations, and the sense that creating a separate organization is somehow reverse sexism or whatever. I taught for a while in an introductory women's studies classroom at a university. We were unable to officially specify that it be a women-only class, but strongly suggested to any men who applied to take the class that they avail themselves of other classes in the department and leave this one to be women-only. The first semester I taught there was a man in the class, who refused to be dissuaded, and there were many aspects of the class that just didn't work as well as the other two classes I taught that were women-only. There is something about a women-only environment, which many of these students had never experienced, that gives insights into what we deal with most of the time in a mixed environment. There is a safety to it that is illuminating of the danger we usually live in. Having said that, I agree that a "xxx"-only environment is not "normal." That is, it doesn't reflect the realities that we have to deal with in our daily lives. But many different kinds of groups have found advantages in coming together in what we used to call a separatist manner for a specific time and purpose -- people of various racial groups, for example, and definitely women. The women-only consciousness-raising groups set off the women's liberation movement, and created powerful knowledge for many of us 'way back then. A separatist group can give powerful insights that lead to strong and useful action for change. I believe that we do have to find ways to work together on issues of violence. I welcome men's voices and work. But know that there are times and places where it makes sense to have women-only spaces. Women at particular times, especially right after suffering violation, may not be up to the challenge of dealing with men at all for a while. That needs to be respected. Women's anger at violence, which is sometimes directed against all men, needs to be accepted, even as we continue to work for a more balanced point of view. These issues are difficult and emotional. We are all in process. At various points in the process, different strategies may make sense. We are all doing the best we can. Let's support each other and respect our different ways of dealing with a common problem. Sylvan Rainwater . Portland, OR USA . sylrain@teleport.com -------------------------------------------------------------- "The future masters of technology will have to be lighthearted and intelligent. The machine easily masters the grim and the dumb." --Marshall McCluhan, 1969 Kate Nonesuch Literacy Co-ordinator Reading and Writing Centre Malaspina University-College 222 Cowichan Way Duncan, BC V9L 6P4 Phone: (250)715-1420 Fax: (250) 746-3563
This archive was generated by hypermail 2b30 : Tue Jan 16 2001 - 14:46:36 EST