Andrea and Mary Jane:
  
  Thank you for your insights.  I don't see the posting of the  history of my math anxiety on this discussion. I never thought that  math anxiety and lack of financial acumen might go together, but I  certainly have both.
  
  Andrea, I wondered if you'd share a blank copy of your expense form with me off line.
  
  I'm also searching for a financial advisor.  I made the mistake of  going to someone who was "selling" a product and did horribly.
  
  Bertie Mo

Andrea Wilder <andreawilder at comcast.net> wrote:  Friends--

Small steps: 5 bank accounts for different purposes, I have done this 
since I was first married, someone questioned this practice and i was 
so embarrassed it took me a long while to talk about it again--years, 
and then the person who I told it to thought it was a fabulous idea.

Calendar for library books--I mark the due dates.  when I renew over 
the phone, I mark on the card in the back the new date.

Spending records;  I write down what I spend in cash.  I seldom use a 
credit card, I write checks.  My "financial advisor" gave me  work 
sheets to fill out, and they were a breeze because I am so dogged about 
expenses.  She said a lot of people don't  do what I do and this causes 
havoc.  So my kind of babyish habits drew praise.  By the way, in my 
looking around for a financial advisor, no one before her had given me 
such detailed expense sheets to fill out.

When looking for services, I ask my friends who they use, then check 
them out myself.

When doing taxes, I xerox and clip together my check stub info.

If someone who works for me botches up I job, I pay the person and hire 
someone else.  (This technique has caused my friends to question my 
sanity, but if a person doesn't do a job properly then they won't be 
able to do it properly the second time...)

And so on...I wonder  if  there might be occasions in math classes for 
group discussion on techniques adult learners  use to manage money?

Andrea


On Jun 23, 2006, at 7:04 AM, Mary Jane Schmitt wrote:


>

> Andrea's  description of her personal numeracy development is so real 

> and rich. Once a math professor of mine started the class with the 

> question: "How can a boring, heartless subject like math evoke so much 

> emotion?" I often think about that remark and maybe the answer is more 

> complex than we had bad math instruction. However, since I am a math 

> teacher, people do tend to share with me some horror stories about 

>  school math experiences that caused them to "check out" big time.

>

> When I read Andrea's story, I was interested in why one has to  divide 

> by 4 and then multiply by 3. Does the division by 4 get the quarterly 

> expenses? What does the multiplication by 3 do?  I think the answer to 

> alleviating  math anxiety/avoidance is to keep asking why -to  keep 

> sticking with the meaning behind the rules- if I know WHY you divide 

> by 4, and then multiply by 3, and can picture it in my mind, I tend 

> not to forget. It's memorizing rules I don't "get"  that makes me feel 

> anxious.

>

> Anyway, this morning I am finally getting it together to go to a 

> financial advisor for post divorce advice. The meeting is in 2 hours 

> and writing back to you is one way to avoid stuff- hmm have to go - 

> there's so much lint on my rugs and I would rather pick that than face 

> the REAL math music. I have noticed that many people who say they are 

> bad at math are great handling their money and a lot of math types are 

> not so great (case in point). I think the two types could learn a lot 

> from one another.

>

> Yours in the struggle,

> Mary Jane Schmitt

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Andrea Wilder 

> Sent by: womenliteracy-bounces at nifl.gov

>

> 06/22/06 05:42 PM

> Please respond to

>  The Women and Literacy Discussion List 

>

> To

> The Women and Literacy Discussion List 

> cc

> Subject

> [WomenLiteracy 352] Re: math anxiety

>

>

>

>

>

> Friends--

>

>

>  What I can contribute is personal experience, but  why not, it 

> probably

>  shows what numbers can do.

>

>  Soon after I separated from my husband income tax time came around.  I

>  knew i couldn't do  the math, but even assembling the documents was

>  overwhelming.  i ended up on the rug of my rented apartment crying 

> and  

>  picking fuzz off the  rug.

>

>  A couple of years later I had mastered the assemblage of documents, 

> but

>  i neglected to send in the completed forms until I got a letter from

>  the IRS.

>

>  Now, because i am a small business, I have to divide my expenses into

>  4ths and multiply by 3. I was so put together this year that I have

>  even put the little coupons in their envelopes--stamped--and written

>  down the reminders of tax time on my calendar.

>

>  Turns out I am POWERFULLY  MOTIVATED  to save  money, so I put in the

>  extra time to NOT SPEND on checks to the IRS.

>

>  The above reasons are why I feel it is REALLY IMPORTANT for women to

>  know the ins and outs of managing money.  I had to go out and get the 

>  

>  knowledge, and I sure wish I had had a helping hand, so I am really

>  STRONGY in favor of emphasizing the practical uses of math.

>

>  Planning what to do with money can give a person control and  

>  motivation.

>

>  Unless a person is planning to go into theoretical physics or math,

>  money has daily practical consequences.

>

>  Andrea

>  On Jun 22, 2006, at 11:12 AM, Daphne Greenberg wrote:

>

>  > Thank you Judy for sharing your anxiety about writing. I think that

>  > this is a great ice breaker for a lot of us who have anxiety doing

>  > math, thinking about explaining something in math, or even writing 

> on

>  > this listserv about math. I have two wonders:

>  > 1. Do others on this listserv share my anxiety about anything 

> related

>  > to math?

>  > 2. Judy, or others, what do you recommend for teachers who have math

>  > anxiety who are teaching students who have math anxiety?

>  > Thanks,

>  > Daphne

>  >

>  >>>> j.e.ward at cox.net 6/21/2006 12:27 PM >>>

>  > Greetings to everyone,

>  >

>  > Since this is a women and literacy list serve I assume that all 

> have a

>  > deep

>  > concern and interest in advancing women through a literacy 

> perspective.

>  > Also, I assume that you all love reading and writing and would like 

> to

>  > help

>  > others feel the same way.

>  >

>  > To get the numeracy and math anxiety discussion going I would like 

> to

>  > begin

>  > from a different direction. I would like to tell you a little about 

> my

>  > "anxiety" with English class during my k-12 years. Although I never

>  > made bad

>  > grades, English class was a challenge for me. Remembering all the

>  > sentence

>  > structure rules was overwhelming and didn't make sense. Diagramming 

> a

>  > sentence, as well as the other 10 or so that were assigned, was a

>  > painful

>  > task. The process didn't make sense to me and I wasn't able to carry

>  > the

>  > exercise over to writing.

>  >

>  > Writing was and still is another challenge and most of the time 

> almost

>  > a

>  > painful experience for me. You could say that my anxiety about 

> putting

>  > words

>  > on paper is a stumbling block and I have to work extremely hard just

>  > to get

>  > started. There are times when I must write something important, like

>  > now,

>  > that my stomach gets knots in it, my mind goes blank and I have to

>  > write and

>  > rewrite over and over. Just before I send this email my anxiety 

> level

>  > will

>  > increase drastically because someone will read this and find 

> mistakes

>  > or

>  > think the writing is terrible. Where does this anxiety come from?

>  > Probably

>  > past experiences with teachers that loved and knew their subject but

>  > didn't

>  > teach the way I learn. We know a lot more now about how learning 

> takes

>  > place

>  > than in my k-12 years.

>  >

>  > Now, for today's discussion question: Is there a relationship 

> between

>  > literacy and the content in a typical English class in the US?

>  >

>  > I look forward to the discussion.

>  >

>  > Judy Ward

>  >

>  >

>  >

>  > Judy Ward, Ed.D.

>  > 6886 Young Farm Avenue

>  > Springdale, AR 72762

>  > Phone: 479.361.2223

>  > Fax: 479.361.2223

>  > Email: j.e.ward at cox.net

>  >

>  > Arkansas Adult Numeracy Campaign

>  > Teaching Mathematics Effectively to Adult Learners

>  >

>  >

>  >

>  >

>  > ----------------------------------------------------

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>

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