What I can do is put the headings up for all to see, that would help.

Yes, I made the same mistake you did, once.  Then i figured out someone  
was selling a "product," and, wiser, I moved on.

Andrea


On Jun 23, 2006, at 9:41 AM, Bertha Mo wrote:


> Andrea and Mary Jane:

>

>  Thank you for your insights.  I don't see the posting of the history  

> of my math anxiety on this discussion. I never thought that math  

> anxiety and lack of financial acumen might go together, but I  

> certainly have both.

>

>  Andrea, I wondered if you'd share a blank copy of your expense form  

> with me off line.

>

>  I'm also searching for a financial advisor.  I made the mistake of  

> going to someone who was "selling" a product and did horribly.

>

>  Bertie Mo

>

> Andrea Wilder <andreawilder at comcast.net> wrote:

>>

>> Small steps: 5 bank accounts for different purposes, I have done this

>> since I was first married, someone questioned this practice and i was

>> so embarrassed it took me a long while to talk about it again--years,

>> and then the person who I told it to thought it was a fabulous idea.

>>

>> Calendar for library books--I mark the due dates. when I renew over

>> the phone, I mark on the card in the back the new date.

>>

>> Spending records; I write down what I spend in cash. I seldom use a

>> credit card, I write checks. My "financial advisor" gave me work

>> sheets to fill out, and they were a breeze because I am so dogged  

>> about

>> expenses. She said a lot of people don't do what I do and this causes

>> havoc. So my kind of babyish habits drew praise. By the way, in my

>> looking around for a financial advisor, no one before her had given me

>> such detailed expense sheets to fill out.

>>

>> When looking for services, I ask my friends who they use, then check

>> them out myself.

>>

>> When doing taxes, I xerox and clip together my check stub info.

>>

>> If someone who works for me botches up I job, I pay the person and  

>> hire

>> someone else. (This technique has caused my friends to question my

>> sanity, but if a person doesn't do a job properly then they won't be

>> able to do it properly the second time...)

>>

>> And so on...I wonder if there might be occasions in math classes for

>> group discussion on techniques adult learners use to manage money?

>>

>> Andrea

>>

>>

>> On Jun 23, 2006, at 7:04 AM, Mary Jane Schmitt wrote:

>>

>> >

>> > Andrea's  description of her personal numeracy development is so  

>> real

>> > and rich. Once a math professor of mine started the class with the

>> > question: "How can a boring, heartless subject like math evoke so  

>> much

>> > emotion?" I often think about that remark and maybe the answer is  

>> more

>> > complex than we had bad math instruction. However, since I am a math

>> > teacher, people do tend to share with me some horror stories about

>> >  school math experiences that caused them to "check out" big time.

>> >

>> > When I read Andrea's story, I was interested in why one has to  

>>  divide

>> > by 4 and then multiply by 3. Does the division by 4 get the  

>> quarterly

>> > expenses? What does the multiplication by 3 do?  I think the answer  

>> to

>> > alleviating  math anxiety/avoidance is to keep asking why -to  keep

>> > sticking with the meaning behind the rules- if I know WHY you divide

>> > by 4, and then multiply by 3, and can picture it in my mind, I tend

>> > not to forget. It's memorizing rules I don't "get"  that makes me  

>> feel

>> > anxious.

>> >

>> > Anyway, this morning I am finally getting it together to go to a

>> > financial advisor for post divorce advice. The meeting is in 2 hours

>> > and writing back to you is one way to avoid stuff- hmm have to go -

>> > there's so much lint on my rugs and I would rather pick that than  

>> face

>> > the REAL math music. I have noticed that many people who say they  

>> are

>> > bad at math are great handling their money and a lot of math types  

>> are

>> > not so great (case in point). I think the two types could learn a  

>> lot

>> > from one another.

>> >

>> > Yours in the struggle,

>> > Mary Jane Schmitt

>> >

>> >

>> >

>> >

>> >

>> >

>> > Andrea Wilder

>> > Sent by: womenliteracy-bounces at nifl.gov

>> >

>> > 06/22/06 05:42 PM

>> > Please respond to

>> > The Women and Literacy Discussion List

>> >

>> > To

>> > The Women and Literacy Discussion List

>> > cc

>> > Subject

>> > [WomenLiteracy 352] Re: math anxiety

>> >

>> >

>> >

>> >

>> >

>> > Friends--

>> >

>> >

>> > What I can contribute is personal experience, but  why not, it

>> > probably

>> > shows what numbers can do.

>> >

>> > Soon after I separated from my husband income tax time came around.  

>>  I

>> > knew i couldn't do  the math, but even assembling the documents was

>> > overwhelming.  i ended up on the rug of my rented apartment crying

>> > and  

>> > picking fuzz off the  rug.

>> >

>> > A couple of years later I had mastered the assemblage of documents,

>> > but

>> > i neglected to send in the completed forms until I got a letter from

>> > the IRS.

>> >

>> > Now, because i am a small business, I have to divide my expenses  

>> into

>> > 4ths and multiply by 3. I was so put together this year that I have

>> > even put the little coupons in their envelopes--stamped--and written

>> > down the reminders of tax time on my calendar.

>> >

>> > Turns out I am POWERFULLY  MOTIVATED  to save  money, so I put in  

>> the

>> > extra time to NOT SPEND on checks to the IRS.

>> >

>> > The above reasons are why I feel it is REALLY IMPORTANT for women to

>> > know the ins and outs of managing money.  I had to go out and get  

>> the

>> >  

>> > knowledge, and I sure wish I had had a helping hand, so I am really

>> > STRONGY in favor of emphasizing the practical uses of math.

>> >

>> > Planning what to do with money can give a person control and  

>> > motivation.

>> >

>> > Unless a person is planning to go into theoretical physics or math,

>> > money has daily practical consequences.

>> >

>> > Andrea

>> > On Jun 22, 2006, at 11:12 AM, Daphne Greenberg wrote:

>> >

>> > > Thank you Judy for sharing your anxiety about writing. I think  

>> that

>> > > this is a great ice breaker for a lot of us who have anxiety doing

>> > > math, thinking about explaining something in math, or even writing

>> > on

>> > > this listserv about math. I have two wonders:

>> > > 1. Do others on this listserv share my anxiety about anything

>> > related

>> > > to math?

>> > > 2. Judy, or others, what do you recommend for teachers who have  

>> math

>> > > anxiety who are teaching students who have math anxiety?

>> > > Thanks,

>> > > Daphne

>> > >

>> > >>>> j.e.ward at cox.net 6/21/2006 12:27 PM >>>

>> > > Greetings to everyone,

>> > >

>> > > Since this is a women and literacy list serve I assume that all

>> > have a

>> > > deep

>> > > concern and interest in advancing women through a literacy

>> > perspective.

>> > > Also, I assume that you all love reading and writing and would  

>> like

>> > to

>> > > help

>> > > others feel the same way.

>> > >

>> > > To get the numeracy and math anxiety discussion going I would like

>> > to

>> > > begin

>> > > from a different direction. I would like to tell you a little  

>> about

>> > my

>> > > "anxiety" with English class during my k-12 years. Although I  

>> never

>> > > made bad

>> > > grades, English class was a challenge for me. Remembering all the

>> > > sentence

>> > > structure rules was overwhelming and didn't make sense.  

>> Diagramming

>> > a

>> > > sentence, as well as the other 10 or so that were assigned, was a

>> > > painful

>> > > task. The process didn't make sense to me and I wasn't able to  

>> carry

>> > > the

>> > > exercise over to writing.

>> > >

>> > > Writing was and still is another challenge and most of the time

>> > almost

>> > > a

>> > > painful experience for me. You could say that my anxiety about

>> > putting

>> > > words

>> > > on paper is a stumbling block and I have to work extremely hard  

>> just

>> > > to get

>> > > started. There are times when I must write something important,  

>> like

>> > > now,

>> > > that my stomach gets knots in it, my mind goes blank and I have to

>> > > write and

>> > > rewrite over and over. Just before I send this email my anxiety

>> > level

>> > > will

>> > > increase drastically because someone will read this and find

>> > mistakes

>> > > or

>> > > think the writing is terrible. Where does this anxiety come from?

>> > > Probably

>> > > past experiences with teachers that loved and knew their subject  

>> but

>> > > didn't

>> > > teach the way I learn. We know a lot more now about how learning

>> > takes

>> > > place

>> > > than in my k-12 years.

>> > >

>> > > Now, for today's discussion question: Is there a relationship

>> > between

>> > > literacy and the content in a typical English class in the US?

>> > >

>> > > I look forward to the discussion.

>> > >

>> > > Judy Ward

>> > >

>> > >

>> > >

>> > > Judy Ward, Ed.D.

>> > > 6886 Young Farm Avenue

>> > > Springdale, AR 72762

>> > > Phone: 479.361.2223

>> > > Fax: 479.361.2223

>> > > Email: j.e.ward at cox.net

>> > >

>> > > Arkansas Adult Numeracy Campaign

>> > > Teaching Mathematics Effectively to Adult Learners

>> > >

>> > >

>> > >

>> > >

>> > > ----------------------------------------------------

>> > > National Institute for Literacy

>> > > Women and Literacy mailing list

>> > > WomenLiteracy at nifl.gov

>> > > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to

>> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/womenliteracy

>> > >

>> > > ----------------------------------------------------

>> > > National Institute for Literacy

>> > > Women and Literacy mailing list

>> > > WomenLiteracy at nifl.gov

>> > > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to

>> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/womenliteracy

>> > >

>> >

>> > ----------------------------------------------------

>> > National Institute for Literacy

>> > Women and Literacy mailing list

>> > WomenLiteracy at nifl.gov

>> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to

>> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/womenliteracy

>> >

>> > ----------------------------------------------------

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>> >  

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