What Does It Mean If Weekend Quakes Were Caused by Fracking?

Seismic activity that can be felt is from very very deep in the ground, and is caused by the movement of the Earth's plates.  They are NOT caused by fracking  of Global Warming or hunting whales. 

Long before the enviro-mental-nazis tried to trace everything they thought was bad to fossil fuels, there has been no end of connections of thing having nothing to do with warming or earthquakes. 

Once they had a federal judge - not a scientist - declare CO2 to be a greenhouse gas, the Global Warming crowd lost all credibility with anyone who studied science. 

Picture in your mind that the Earth's atmosphere is the equivalent of a 10,000 seat football stadium.  Do you know what percentage CO2 is? Four (4) of the seats!

And we need CO2 in order to live, and plants need it to survive.  So, some stupid federal judge declaring it a toxic or damaging gas obviously flunked General Science, or is a shill for liberals.

pak152, where are you?

" The bigger problem however has been found to be some waste water injection wells, where used hydraulic fracturing fluids or other produced waters are disposed of."

Yes, but even if the quakes are not caused by fracking as such, they are still caused by fracking. That is, they are a necessary result of activities of the fracking industry. No fracking, no "used hydraulic fracturing fluids or other produced waters." No used fluids, no deep disposal wells. No deep disposal wells, no quakes.

Sometimes the statements of scientists are not the end of the road. Sometimes a further logic has to be applied to those statements.

Stephen, your question cannot be answered without knowing the depth of the earthquake locus.

That right there is some world class runaround.

@bmarvel ... prepping for Armageddon since the 5 cent plastic bag fee took effect.

@bmarvel Bmarvel, just a few short days ago: "And that debate will be conducted by the scientists , not by you and me and not by the "science crowd.""

Thank the Lord we have you, Bill, to let us know when to listen to science and when not to.

@ThePosterFormerlyKnownasPaul

2 miles down

@d-may

We didn't ban it.

We're just holding it in reserve until the price goes back up.

@d-may Yes indeed, d-may. The 3.3 quake the other night nuisanced us right out of our chairs and out into the night, where we fund several neigbors who had also been rudely nuisanced. (One said he thought a car had hit his house.) After we all figured out what had happened we went back indoors to look for cracks in our walls and to wonder when the next nuisance might arrive.

Dr. Grant reminds me of the physician who tells his patients that they might experience what he calls "a little discomfort" before he plunges an 8-inch red-hot needle into their tender parts.

@RTGolden1 @bmarvel The scientist are pretty close to deciding the quake-fracking link, Golden. Now we citizens get to decide what to do about it. A political, and possibly legal, question, but not a scientific one.

@buckbucky @bmarvel 

The water used in the hydraulic fracturing process typically comes from surface or groundwater sources. 

http://aboutnaturalgas.com/content/technology-and-process/hydraulic-fracturing-fluid/

Most water used in hydraulic fracturing comes from surface water sources such as lakes, rivers and municipal supplies.  However, groundwater can be used to augment surface water supplies where it is available in sufficient quantities.

https://fracfocus.org/water-protection/hydraulic-fracturing-usage

clearly we know who is "wrong (as always)"

@holmantx @ThePosterFormerlyKnownasPaul 

Thank you

@dingo @d-may

Fracking related earthquakes generally register at about a 6.2 on the FLO-nnoyance scale.

@bmarvel @RTGolden1 My geologist cousin, who follows this closely and participated in several studies on the subject, would disagree on how close science is to the quake-fracking link.

@TheCredibleHulk @dingo @d-may I would think the non-stop assault by the fracking debate, both for and against, would register slightly higher than the actual quakes on the FLO-nnoyance scale, no?

@RTGolden1 @bmarvel So far, there doesn't seem to be a link.  It's not to say it's impossible.  But, most earthquakes are the result of incredible force produced by the Earth's plates as they move and often rub against each other. 

Even a nuclear explosion that shakes the ground would have a very difficult time causing and earthquake - as we've known for decades. 

As far as I'm concerned, without proof derived by the Scientific Method, this is just more hysteria from liberals and an attempt by Democrats and the EPA to control every aspect of human life in America.

@RTGolden1 @bmarvel Fine, Golden. Bring him on board. We'd love to hear his arguments.

My own interest in this goes back to the 1950s when Denver suddenly began having earthguakes -- the first in anyone's memory. Experts from the Colorado School of Mines traced them to a deep disposal well, where the Rocky Mountain Arsenal had been pumping water and various waste products from the manufacture of nerve gas. When the pumping stopped, the earthquakes stopped. 

It seems strange to me that regions in which earthquakes have been rare or nonexistent suddenly start having them after the frackers move in -- Pennsylvania, Ohio, Oklahoma, north Texas. But of your cousin can explain this, hats off to him.

If, on the other hand. the quakes are just part of the cost we have to pay for energy independence, let the oil and gas industry tell us and we can have that debate. 

@buckbucky @mavdog @bmarvel H2O is the most frequently discovered liquid substance in the drilling/fracking  of any well prior to striking oil. 

In fact, in Crane County, Texas, you find a lot of farmers and ranchers who permit drilling on their property benefiting from the water discovered as well.

It's also been strongly suggested that foundations in some of these fracking areas were defective or built on ground not properly prepared for a foundation - much less an earthquake-proof foundation. 

@buckbucky @mavdog @bmarvel Oh, bucky, then you're the guy that's causing all these earthquakes. 

We notice that you've tried to switch the conversation off into idle chit-chat about where the water comes from and where it goes to. Let's get back to the subject at hand: What's your opinion about earthquakes?A good thing or a bad thing? We can take up the water question after we deal with that. 

@RTGolden1 @TheCredibleHulk @dingo @d-may

That seems perfectly reasonable. 

@bmarvel @buckbucky @mavdog

It appears Mr. Buckcucky is correct, according to the EPA:

Class II wells inject fluids associated with oil and natural gas production. Most of the injected fluid is salt water (brine), which is brought to the surface in the process of producing (extracting) oil and gas. In addition, brine and other fluids are injected to enhance (improve) oil and gas production. The approximately 144,000 Class II wells in operation in the United States inject over 2 billion gallons of brine every day. Most oil and gas injection wells are in Texas, California, Oklahoma, and Kansas.

What are the types of Class II wells?

Three types of Class II injection wells are associated with oil and natural gas production.

1. Enhanced Recovery Wells inject brine, water, steam, polymers, or carbon dioxide into oil-bearing formations to recover residual oil and—in some limited applications—natural gas. This is also known as secondary or tertiary recovery. The injected fluid thins (decreases the viscosity) or displaces small amounts of extractable oil and gas, which is then available for recovery. In a typical configuration, a single injection well is surrounded by multiple production wells. Production wells bring oil and gas to the surface; the UIC Program does not regulate wells that are soley used for production. However, EPA does have authority to regulate hydraulic fracturing when diesel fuels are used in fluids or propping agents. During hydraulic fracturing, another enhanced recovery process, a viscous fluid is injected under high pressure until the desired fracturing is achieved, followed by a proppant such as sand. The pressure is then released and the proppant holding the fractures open allows fluid to return to the well. Enhanced recovery wells are the most numerous type of Class II wells, representing as much as 80 percent of the approximately 151,000 Class II wells.

2. Disposal Wells inject brines and other fluids associated with the production of oil and natural gas or natural gas storage operations. When oil and gas are produced, brine is also brought to the surface. The brine is segregated from the oil and is then injected into the same underground formation or a similar formation. Class II disposal wells can only be used to dispose of fluids associated with oil and gas production. Disposal wells represent about 20 percent of Class II wells.

3. Hydrocarbon Storage Wells inject liquid hydrocarbons in underground formations (such as salt caverns) where they are stored, generally, as part of the U.S. Strategic Petroleum Reserve. There are over 100 liquid hydrocarbon storage wells in operation.

http://water.epa.gov/type/groundwater/uic/class2/

@holmantx @bmarvel @buckbucky @mavdog Does not address quakes, holman. Is it your position that the activities of the  fracking industry are not causing the quakes?

@buckbucky @bmarvel @mavdog So...your view of the earthquakes, bucky?

@bmarvel @holmantx @buckbucky @mavdog

Don't be jerk.  What's interesting is that 144,000 active class II wells inject over 2 billion gallons of brine every day.  That brine (super salienated ancient sea water) came out of other wells.  It's mixed with surface water and a host of frack fluids, as well as sand as "proppants".   Disposal wells are far deeper where the earthquake activity is.  And most of what is shot back into the deeper formations is brine, which came out of the producing wells.  

And you fat old SOB didn't know that nor did I until Mr. Buckbucky made the statement which pricked my interest and illuminated a truth you should hae jumped on, which is why have we been mislead by the press about what's being injected into the disposal wells that appears to be the culprit, if it is indeed man-caused?

But no, once again we must all endure your pedantic, all about me, settled science fixation when the big discovery today is we may be witnessing another East Anglia bent data crap so we will conclude it's all settled science.

So why don't you just call it a night and go harass your dog or something.  Because all you want to do is bend the argument back to the tall grass where you reside.

@holmantx @bmarvel @buckbucky @mavdog So, those earthquakes, holman.Your explanation is...?

@buckbucky @bmarvel @mavdog Let's pretend -- just to advance the argument -- I concede your points. Now: Your thoughts on the earthquakes

@bmarvel @holmantx @buckbucky @mavdog

Disposal well reinjection

Unless we've been lied to about the frequency and magnitude.

But the press thinks it's disposal of brine water from producing wells, fracking fluid from producing wells, and industrial water from the cities - in that order.

@bmarvel @buckbucky @mavdog

but they do not report it in that order

@buckbucky @bmarvel @mavdog Earthquakes, bucky? Thoughts on earthquakes? Any?Just one?

@bmarvel @buckbucky @mavdog

Ever been to Lubbock?  If the wind cuts from the southeast, the stockyards and rendering plant stench can knock a buzzard off a shit wagon at forty yards but if you ask the people?

it's the smell a money.

What if we never discovered oil?

Why, we'd a never growed to 7 billion people and we never would have had the opportunity to be exposed to your bullshit.

And thank God for that.

so slake your thirst in a lake of fire my friend.  for you owe your very existence to oil.

@holmantx @bmarvel @buckbucky @mavdog In one of the strongest oil and gas and refining states in the country, I'm shocked how many of our citizens don't know jack about producing oil and gas, transporting it, refining it, and distributing it.

Many people don't realize that plastics would not be possible without petroleum products, and hospital and medical device creation would be extremely expensive, and some devices would not exist. 

Oil makes possible a great many light containers that would otherwise be expensive, heavy, and a disposal problem. 

Look at the number of petroleum derived products that make space exploration and travel possible.  And, PVC has made possible all kinds of applications, including plumbing, insulating pipe, 

But, of course, liberals HATE petroleum products, and fall for all kinds of myths about their relative benefit to America and mankind.